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Ive just finished Unremembered Empire, and It has dawned on me that I actually enjoyed not knowing large portions of the fluff, for example, we now know that..
Spoiler:
Gulliman was not interested in usurping the Imperium, and he, Sangunius, and The Lion are all pretty decent guys. In fact, they are becoming ultra conventional, because Gulliman is all noble and selfless and humble and forgiving, and Curse is fully evil. For example, Curze has moved on from being misunderstood, or having seemingly legitimate grievances, because he is now a stock, Hollywood villain. A full blown, malevolent, evil, character, who tells Gullimans elderly adopted mother that he really wishes Gulliman was alive to suffer as he watches her die, and he then moves to savagely murder her, an unarmed pensioner.
So my question is, do you think that they should have quit with the HH books after the first ten or something? Do you think it was better when you knew little and could forge your own narrative?
Personally, it seems like all of the ambiguity has been leeched out, and now rather than have myriad shades of grey, we have very black and white, Hollywood style good guys and bad guys.
Does anybody else feel that this has detracted from characters like Curze and The Lion, or do you feel it is going well and you want every character to be a fully explored, entirely fleshed out creation like Peter Parker?
Personally, I enjoy reading them, and I greatly enjoyed Unremembered Empire and Know No Fear, but... I cant help but feel as though I have lost something along the way.....
Thoughts?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/30 20:49:36
We are arming Syrian rebels who support ISIS, who is fighting Iran, who is fighting Iraq who we also support against ISIS, while fighting Kurds who we support while they are fighting Syrian rebels.
I purposefully have gone out of my way not to read any of the Horus Heresy books because I did not want to spoil my personal take on the Horus Heresy. I liked the Primarch's being distant figures of legend, individuals whose power has grown with each telling of their deeds which in turn have become distorted and altered with time & telling. I like the legend of Ollanius Pius, Saint of the Imperial Guard, stepping in between the fallen Emperor & Horus, giving the Emperor the time he needed to strike down his son. I like that out of the death & destruction, the Imperium arose as strong as ever united by the Imperial Creed and worship of the God-Emperor.
So personally I'm happily ignorant of the details of the Horus Heresy and I wouldn't change that at all. The fellows I work with have read the Heresy series and they like it but I know it's not for me from their discussions. Personally I don't want to read about Space Marines & Primarchs - to me they're quite dull because of their inherent strength & power, but a standard human facing a galaxy filled with various threats that are far stronger than he/she is would be far more compelling for me.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/30 21:19:04
Cruze is completly insane, that's ALWAYS been the case. Guilliman not desiring rule is PERFECTLY in character with what we know of the man. remember the man was basicly handed the reins of the Empire after the Emperor was tossed into the Golden Throne. all evidance suggests Gulliman sees himself as a builder, not a ruler. he'd rather build a empire, assmble it to work, and then go off and I dunno, take up farming.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
BrianDavion wrote: Cruze is completly insane, that's ALWAYS been the case. Guilliman not desiring rule is PERFECTLY in character with what we know of the man. remember the man was basicly handed the reins of the Empire after the Emperor was tossed into the Golden Throne. all evidance suggests Gulliman sees himself as a builder, not a ruler. he'd rather build a empire, assmble it to work, and then go off and I dunno, take up farming.
Yeah but dont you think hes gone from insane to fully evil? There are nuts people who just like... talk to their shoes or something, Curze is actually evil, like he enjoys making people suffer, he enjoys torturing poor old Vulkan, he gleefully attempts to murder an old lady because he would like it, dont you think he was a little more interesting when he was at least attempting to justify his behavior?
Like, I really enjoyed his conversation with Dorn on the audio drama, I forget which one now cos I heard it a few years ago, but he basically justifies his behaviour, and he certainly didn't come across as evil. And I also liked it when they were ambigious about Gulliman, now he really is just like Clark Kent, and he doesnt seem to have any flaws at all.
I mean, I still havent decided if this is a good or a bad thing, thats why I made the thread, I certainly enjoy reading everybody elses take on affairs.
We are arming Syrian rebels who support ISIS, who is fighting Iran, who is fighting Iraq who we also support against ISIS, while fighting Kurds who we support while they are fighting Syrian rebels.
I certainly think the HH should never have been explored as much as it has been. I guess the one solace or caveat we have is the whole "there is no such thing as 40k canon". Also with something that happened 10k years before the current setting you can more or less head/fan canon the HH however you like without stepping on too many toes.
I think the saddest thing is how the Emperor has been handled. Some things should stay mythic and folkloric.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/01 00:15:41
"Order. Unity. Obedience. We taught the galaxy these things, and we shall do so again."
"They are not your worst nightmare; they are your every nightmare."
"Let the galaxy burn!"
Both ADB and Nick Kyme have said that the "no canon in 40k" line only applies to actual 40k lore, not to the HH. It's why new BL authors are only allowed to write books for 40k and why the new hardcover releases of older HH books will have changes to bring them in line with what's been established so far. For instance, fixing Corax's conversation with the Emperor to match with the fact that one of the missing primarchs was discovered after Corax.
For me personally, I'm more than happy to have as much information as possible. But that's probably because I have no connection to the old IA articles and in general, don't consider anything written before 2003 canon anymore, with some very minor exceptions.
I agree, having fluff that is purposefully vague allows more creativity when coming up with your own story, but I also know a lot of people like to know certain details to make their army fit perfectly with the fluff.
It's tough to find the balance. With the Horus Heresy (HH), I like knowing all the details, as asimo77Made said, there is 10k years in difference, so you still have plenty of room to be creative. Personally, I prefer a more fleshed out story of 40k, and the HH sets all of our 40k games up.
And, well, with knowing how the Primarch are, it is often true that the most exalted leaders tend to be well, human; and have plenty of faults.
Or you can just view the HH books as some historian writing everything down, and is open to interpretation and they just got some of the facts wrong, ie the Imperium is making sure the traitor Primarchs are more 'evil' than they really were.
Getting out of 40K at the end of 3rd Ed and coming back at the tail of 5th, I like to live in a 'no new fluff' bubble. Almost none of the material done in the last decade I've come across has been an improvement- most is simply a rehashing of previous work with brain bugs built into the new versions.
Specifically in regards to the HH, yeah, it should never have been told. Legends and myths have a certain power that is lost when we get definitive knowledge. It's done now though, so no use whining about it but I do believe it was a mistake. We know where the Imperium started and where it is now and I think the writers got it wrong. The pre HH Imperium seems about a hundred years older- maybe a few hundred- than the contemporary Imperium now (to me at least). It no longer feels like the 10,000 year old remnants of greatness. its long, slow decline into mysticism, eternal war and bloodshed seems to have been encapsulated in the HH and altogether far too abrupt. I wanted to see this amazing Imperium the Emperor led but instead all I got was contemporary marines but a) more of them b) led by more bad ass characters than ever with the primarchs (who are still non the less idiots). Where was the brilliance and genius of the primarchs? Where is the wonder tech that would be the originators of the bastard, rigged up, misunderstood, worshipped tech of the 41st millennium?
But that's just my opinion. 40k used to capture my imagination and maybe I just got old, but maybe there's just less to imagine.
I like the whole story investment in the Horus Heresy, Loken and Argel Tal are very interesting characters, althought they dropped the ball in some occassions, (i feel Horus turn to chaos should have taken more books).
The only problem is that the Emperor comes of as a selfish workaholic who only cares about his great plan, without thinking about the consequences of his actions.
BrianDavion wrote: Cruze is completly insane, that's ALWAYS been the case. Guilliman not desiring rule is PERFECTLY in character with what we know of the man. remember the man was basicly handed the reins of the Empire after the Emperor was tossed into the Golden Throne. all evidance suggests Gulliman sees himself as a builder, not a ruler. he'd rather build a empire, assmble it to work, and then go off and I dunno, take up farming.
. And I also liked it when they were ambigious about Gulliman, now he really is just like Clark Kent, and he doesnt seem to have any flaws at all.
.
he's got flaws, he's got doubts. There's this bizzare Myth that all characters have to have negitive flaws etc.some of the most intreasting flaws are when their virtue is a weakness. the classic case is Batman's refusal to kill. this is a Virtue, but it's also a weakness and can be a flaw to the character.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
Horus Heresy became simply bad. One thing is it steals intriguing mystery from HH, primarchs, well, everything.
Other thing is that despite GW favourite claim "everything is biased", belletry must be written very, very skillfully to save feeling of one persons opinion and not to slide into became solid and sure retelling of events how those really happend. And HH writers are in most cases mediocre at best. Worse, as OP said, they have tendency to make from shades of grey dumb black and white scenarios which is for my taste really stupid.
So, for me is fluff basic rulebook, codexes and I take all of those as interestingly biased. It is fun. Read about so good and honest loyalist primarchs and so evil and rotten heretic ones is simply boring and killing whole fluff.
Being optimistic´s worthless if it means ignoring the suffering of this world. Worse than worthless. It´s bloody evil.
- Fiddler
Because the prequels to Star Wars were such masterpieces, right? Some extrapolation on events from the Heresy are quite welcome. Others that drag on for ten books of meaningless batles and bland characters are not welcome.
So much of Black Library's stock is Bolter Porn, I'm clamoring for a simple story about a man trying to survive in such madness. And then getting bagged by the Inquisition for asking questions. There is a good story behind such a premise, but it doesn't conform to "Space marines fighting aliens and shooting bullets!"
Arcsquad12 wrote: Because the prequels to Star Wars were such masterpieces, right? Some extrapolation on events from the Heresy are quite welcome. Others that drag on for ten books of meaningless batles and bland characters are not welcome.
So much of Black Library's stock is Bolter Porn, I'm clamoring for a simple story about a man trying to survive in such madness. And then getting bagged by the Inquisition for asking questions. There is a good story behind such a premise, but it doesn't conform to "Space marines fighting aliens and shooting bullets!"
I dont uderstand your argument. Because SW prequels were poor, dumbing HH to black-and-white fairytale is acceptable? (or maybe, probably I really didnt understand)
But in the rest I agree, extrapolation would be nice, it should work this way, best with some side character PoV. For the Black Library and Bolter Porn and desire to see the story of simple man, I can only clap for telling exactly my opinion
Being optimistic´s worthless if it means ignoring the suffering of this world. Worse than worthless. It´s bloody evil.
- Fiddler
Arcsquad12 wrote: Because the prequels to Star Wars were such masterpieces, right? Some extrapolation on events from the Heresy are quite welcome. Others that drag on for ten books of meaningless batles and bland characters are not welcome.
So much of Black Library's stock is Bolter Porn, I'm clamoring for a simple story about a man trying to survive in such madness. And then getting bagged by the Inquisition for asking questions. There is a good story behind such a premise, but it doesn't conform to "Space marines fighting aliens and shooting bullets!"
I dont uderstand your argument. Because SW prequels were poor, dumbing HH to black-and-white fairytale is acceptable? (or maybe, probably I really didnt understand)
But in the rest I agree, extrapolation would be nice, it should work this way, best with some side character PoV. For the Black Library and Bolter Porn and desire to see the story of simple man, I can only clap for telling exactly my opinion
Sarcasm, man. Hard to get across on the internet. Somebody thought that the prequels were a good idea, and look at the mediocre mess that came from them. Same thing happens with the Heresy books. Ups and downs but mostly pointless faff.
Arcsquad12 wrote: Because the prequels to Star Wars were such masterpieces, right? Some extrapolation on events from the Heresy are quite welcome. Others that drag on for ten books of meaningless batles and bland characters are not welcome.
So much of Black Library's stock is Bolter Porn, I'm clamoring for a simple story about a man trying to survive in such madness. And then getting bagged by the Inquisition for asking questions. There is a good story behind such a premise, but it doesn't conform to "Space marines fighting aliens and shooting bullets!"
I dont uderstand your argument. Because SW prequels were poor, dumbing HH to black-and-white fairytale is acceptable? (or maybe, probably I really didnt understand)
But in the rest I agree, extrapolation would be nice, it should work this way, best with some side character PoV. For the Black Library and Bolter Porn and desire to see the story of simple man, I can only clap for telling exactly my opinion
The argument is "most BL novels are terrible. You're expecting too much from the HH series."
Which is true, especially a series written by so many authors. They're attempting to provide the "reality" of that which, previously, was only myth and legend in the setting. It is bound to fall short.
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
BL are trying their best. Whether their best is good enough is up to each reader. Some people prefer mystery. Some prefer to know all the secrets and some prefer to only know some "facts" and leave the rest to the imagination.
None of these 3 have anything to do with BL wanting to make money ... (well except maybe the middle point)
BrianDavion wrote: Cruze is completly insane, that's ALWAYS been the case. Guilliman not desiring rule is PERFECTLY in character with what we know of the man. remember the man was basicly handed the reins of the Empire after the Emperor was tossed into the Golden Throne. all evidance suggests Gulliman sees himself as a builder, not a ruler. he'd rather build a empire, assmble it to work, and then go off and I dunno, take up farming.
Yeah but dont you think hes gone from insane to fully evil? There are nuts people who just like... talk to their shoes or something, Curze is actually evil, like he enjoys making people suffer, he enjoys torturing poor old Vulkan, he gleefully attempts to murder an old lady because he would like it, dont you think he was a little more interesting when he was at least attempting to justify his behavior?
Like, I really enjoyed his conversation with Dorn on the audio drama, I forget which one now cos I heard it a few years ago, but he basically justifies his behaviour, and he certainly didn't come across as evil. And I also liked it when they were ambigious about Gulliman, now he really is just like Clark Kent, and he doesnt seem to have any flaws at all.
I mean, I still havent decided if this is a good or a bad thing, thats why I made the thread, I certainly enjoy reading everybody elses take on affairs.
Considering Curze is based on Heart of Darkness/Apocalypse Now Kurze, its just bad writing. Kurze was insane but his terror (mostly) had a purpose, a will behind it. He wasn't heh heh he maniacal laugh evil just to be evil.
I read through the third book and stopped. They were going very downhill and felt like they were divurging from the old canon.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Frazzled wrote: Considering Curze is based on Heart of Darkness/Apocalypse Now Kurze, its just bad writing. Kurze was insane but his terror (mostly) had a purpose, a will behind it. He wasn't heh heh he maniacal laugh evil just to be evil.
This. I'll add that Curze may have been a victim of the Abnettverse. After all, what's the point of a soldier going mad at the sight of the future consequences of his actions if what's to come is not a morally repugnant theocracy that will usher in a new dark age, but a ruthless but ultimately well-meaning regime?
I'm not putting down the book yet. So far it reads as the screwball comedy version of a Highlander sequel, but I'm giving it one final chance of redemption. Worst offering by Abnett so far, though, but for every "The Gunslinger" there has to be one "Dreamcatcher", I guess.
War does not determine who is right - only who is left.
Oh man, too many things I have seen on this darn website have shattered my bliss, for instance I loved the mystery from Gav Thrope's Angels of Darkness about Lion being a possible traitor (really the irony does fit in well with the grimdark theme of 40k), and then there is Ollanius pious, what once was just a regular joe with cahones the size of the galaxy has now fairly well turned into just another Astartes/superman making a bleh sacrifice. (Superman fights a god woohoo, punisher fights a god...turn in to next weeks episode of punisher to see how the heck this turns out)
DA 4000 points W/L/D 6e 3/2/0
IG 1500 points W/L/D 6e 0/2/0
And 100% Primed!
BrianDavion wrote: Cruze is completly insane, that's ALWAYS been the case. Guilliman not desiring rule is PERFECTLY in character with what we know of the man. remember the man was basicly handed the reins of the Empire after the Emperor was tossed into the Golden Throne. all evidance suggests Gulliman sees himself as a builder, not a ruler. he'd rather build a empire, assmble it to work, and then go off and I dunno, take up farming.
Yeah but dont you think hes gone from insane to fully evil? There are nuts people who just like... talk to their shoes or something, Curze is actually evil, like he enjoys making people suffer, he enjoys torturing poor old Vulkan, he gleefully attempts to murder an old lady because he would like it, dont you think he was a little more interesting when he was at least attempting to justify his behavior?
Like, I really enjoyed his conversation with Dorn on the audio drama, I forget which one now cos I heard it a few years ago, but he basically justifies his behaviour, and he certainly didn't come across as evil. And I also liked it when they were ambigious about Gulliman, now he really is just like Clark Kent, and he doesnt seem to have any flaws at all.
I mean, I still havent decided if this is a good or a bad thing, thats why I made the thread, I certainly enjoy reading everybody elses take on affairs.
Did you ever read Hearts of Darkness or watch Apocalypse Now?
Kurtz is evil. There's no getting around that. Curze, the guy based on Kurtz? He's evil. There's no getting around that. He commits atrocities in the name of winning his war. That does not make him not-evil, not in a galaxy where there are defined actions that are Good and those that are Evil. Kurtz had a justification for his actions, too:
"You must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be defeated."
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
Yeah, I think the complaints regarding Curze are a bit unfounded really, as per Psienesis post, but I do agree that I liked it better when Guilliman and Lion'El Johnson might have been closet traitors...
Spoiler:
Also, some of the books seemed to suggest that Dorn was in on some sort of conspiracy himself (the piece that sticks out the most in my mind was in Nemesis, IIRC it was implied that he had something to do with the failure of the mission to assassinate Horus)
CoALabaer wrote: Wargamers hate two things: the state of the game and change.
BrianDavion wrote: Cruze is completly insane, that's ALWAYS been the case. Guilliman not desiring rule is PERFECTLY in character with what we know of the man. remember the man was basicly handed the reins of the Empire after the Emperor was tossed into the Golden Throne. all evidance suggests Gulliman sees himself as a builder, not a ruler. he'd rather build a empire, assmble it to work, and then go off and I dunno, take up farming.
Yeah but dont you think hes gone from insane to fully evil? There are nuts people who just like... talk to their shoes or something, Curze is actually evil, like he enjoys making people suffer, he enjoys torturing poor old Vulkan, he gleefully attempts to murder an old lady because he would like it, dont you think he was a little more interesting when he was at least attempting to justify his behavior?
Like, I really enjoyed his conversation with Dorn on the audio drama, I forget which one now cos I heard it a few years ago, but he basically justifies his behaviour, and he certainly didn't come across as evil. And I also liked it when they were ambigious about Gulliman, now he really is just like Clark Kent, and he doesnt seem to have any flaws at all.
I mean, I still havent decided if this is a good or a bad thing, thats why I made the thread, I certainly enjoy reading everybody elses take on affairs.
Did you ever read Hearts of Darkness or watch Apocalypse Now?
Kurtz is evil. There's no getting around that. Curze, the guy based on Kurtz? He's evil. There's no getting around that. He commits atrocities in the name of winning his war. That does not make him not-evil, not in a galaxy where there are defined actions that are Good and those that are Evil. Kurtz had a justification for his actions, too:
"You must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be defeated."
Yeah I was aware he was loosely based on Kurtz originally, its nothing like it now though is it?
Thats what I am talking about, he went from committing atrocities to win a war, to committing atrocities for a giggle because he is an evil bastard! The character has changed to the point that I feel it has been derogatory to him.
Have you read UE? In a nutshell..
Spoiler:
Curze things he has killed Gulliman and the Lion, so he goes over to kill some more people for the funzies. He then bumps into the old woman who cares for Gulliman like a mother. He then proceeds to taunt her about killed her son, and then he says "I wish Gulliman was still alive, just so I could see his face when I kill you" and then he is a second away from cutting her throat, when an enraged Vulkan shows up...
So, that's got nothing to do with atrocities to win a war, and its full on Hollywood villain murder, senseless murder of a female pensioner, for nothing other than fun. I mean, he's already killed two of his brothers right?
See what Im talking about? He used to be about atrocities for victory, and he evolved into Jeffery Dahmer!
We are arming Syrian rebels who support ISIS, who is fighting Iran, who is fighting Iraq who we also support against ISIS, while fighting Kurds who we support while they are fighting Syrian rebels.
BrianDavion wrote: Cruze is completly insane, that's ALWAYS been the case. Guilliman not desiring rule is PERFECTLY in character with what we know of the man. remember the man was basicly handed the reins of the Empire after the Emperor was tossed into the Golden Throne. all evidance suggests Gulliman sees himself as a builder, not a ruler. he'd rather build a empire, assmble it to work, and then go off and I dunno, take up farming.
Yeah but dont you think hes gone from insane to fully evil? There are nuts people who just like... talk to their shoes or something, Curze is actually evil, like he enjoys making people suffer, he enjoys torturing poor old Vulkan, he gleefully attempts to murder an old lady because he would like it, dont you think he was a little more interesting when he was at least attempting to justify his behavior?
Like, I really enjoyed his conversation with Dorn on the audio drama, I forget which one now cos I heard it a few years ago, but he basically justifies his behaviour, and he certainly didn't come across as evil. And I also liked it when they were ambigious about Gulliman, now he really is just like Clark Kent, and he doesnt seem to have any flaws at all.
I mean, I still havent decided if this is a good or a bad thing, thats why I made the thread, I certainly enjoy reading everybody elses take on affairs.
Did you ever read Hearts of Darkness or watch Apocalypse Now?
Kurtz is evil. There's no getting around that. Curze, the guy based on Kurtz? He's evil. There's no getting around that. He commits atrocities in the name of winning his war. That does not make him not-evil, not in a galaxy where there are defined actions that are Good and those that are Evil. Kurtz had a justification for his actions, too:
"You must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be defeated."
Yeah I was aware he was loosely based on Kurtz originally, its nothing like it now though is it?
Thats what I am talking about, he went from committing atrocities to win a war, to committing atrocities for a giggle because he is an evil bastard! The character has changed to the point that I feel it has been derogatory to him.
Have you read UE? In a nutshell..
Spoiler:
Curze things he has killed Gulliman and the Lion, so he goes over to kill some more people for the funzies. He then bumps into the old woman who cares for Gulliman like a mother. He then proceeds to taunt her about killed her son, and then he says "I wish Gulliman was still alive, just so I could see his face when I kill you" and then he is a second away from cutting her throat, when an enraged Vulkan shows up...
So, that's got nothing to do with atrocities to win a war, and its full on Hollywood villain murder, senseless murder of a female pensioner, for nothing other than fun. I mean, he's already killed two of his brothers right?
See what Im talking about? He used to be about atrocities for victory, and he evolved into Jeffery Dahmer!
Colonel Kurtz wrote:
I've seen horrors... horrors that you've seen. But you have no right to call me a murderer. You have a right to kill me. You have a right to do that... but you have no right to judge me. It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror... Horror has a face... and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror are your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies! I remember when I was with Special Forces... seems a thousand centuries ago. We went into a camp to inoculate some children. We left the camp after we had inoculated the children for polio, and this old man came running after us and he was crying. He couldn't see. We went back there, and they had come and hacked off every inoculated arm. There they were in a pile. A pile of little arms. And I remember... I... I... I cried, I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out; I didn't know what I wanted to do! And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it... I never want to forget. And then I realized... like I was shot... like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead. And I thought, my God... the genius of that! The genius! The will to do that! Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we, because they could stand that these were not monsters, these were men... trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love... but they had the strength... the strength... to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral... and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling... without passion... without judgment... without judgment! Because it's judgment that defeats us.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/10 17:40:11
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
Barely remembered history as legend. The mystery of the event is what gives the legend its power. Explore the myth and it becomes mere history.
It has been 10,000 years since those events - no-one alive today knows what went on 10,000 years ago in our own history. Yes, there are tales handed down generation to generation, but how many of them have been the product of embellishment?
I'm OVER 50 (and so far over everyone's BS, too).
Old enough to know better, young enough to not give a ****.
That is not dead which can eternal lie ...
... and yet, with strange aeons, even death may die.
Meh I think doing the Heresy as books was fine and interesting, it has a great cast of characters. However the problem is they've dragged it out far, far too long. It should have been a trilogy or 5 books tops.
This is my first year of WH40k, and I know *just* enough fluff to comprehend why my Tyranids are eating people/aliens and why those people/aliens deserve to die.
I have perused the Lexicanum a few times, and while some of the storylines do sound neat, I've also read some really silly stuff that has turned me off from any interest in reading the novels.
mattyrm wrote: So my question is, do you think that they should have quit with the HH books after the first ten or something?
I think they should never have written them in the first place.
The HH was better as myths and legends. They were more epic that way . They aren't quite so epic now.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/19 21:01:37
The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
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"Order. Unity. Obedience. We taught the galaxy these things, and we shall do so again."
"They are not your worst nightmare; they are your every nightmare."
"Let the galaxy burn!"
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