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Made in us
Fate-Controlling Farseer





Fort Campbell

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/12/18/Green-Bullets-Overtaking-Lead-Bullets-Thanks-To-EPA-State-Regs-Military

Thanks to EPA regulations, state regulations, and military goals, traditional lead ammo is on its way out and "green bullets" are on their way in.
As Breitbart News reported on December 1, EPA regulations led to the closing of the Herculaneam lead smelter in Herculaneum, Missouri, which is expected to push up prices for traditional lead ammo.
On top of this are regulations like the recent statewide lead ammo ban in California. Signed by Governor Jerry Brown (D) on October 11, this ban forces hunters to seek out nontraditional alternatives for their ammunition. In this way, the ban mandates "green bullets" by default.
Moreover, as Fox News reports, the military has set 2018 as its target date to have troops operating lead-ammo-free. "Green bullets" have been under testing at Picatinny Arsenal since 2010, and the Army plans to issue "a lead-free version of the 7.62 mm rounds fired from M-14 rifles... in 2014." The Army already switched to a greener 5.56 mm "enhanced performance round" in 2010.
With the military committing to the switch, the EPA making smelting a tougher business, and governors passing state-level lead ammo bans, experts say "lead bullets will be all but phased out within a few years in favor of so-called green bullets."


All I've gotta say is that I'm sure that the 25,000 Airmen who will be walking out the door next year due to budget cuts, are glad we're doing so much for the environment.

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Kid_Kyoto






Probably work

What are the new bullets actually made from?

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Fort Campbell

I haven't found anything yet that says that, but I have seen that the price of lead bullets was .5 cents per bullet, while these new "green" bullets are 8 cents a bullet.

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While on the one hand it's great that they are pushing environmental issues, what kind of impact does the lead really have?

Seems a bit mad.

   
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Camas, WA

 Medium of Death wrote:
what kind of impact does the lead really have?

Pretty significant actually. In fact, the whole point of a bullet is the impact.

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Well they dont want to give lead poisoning to the terrorists, we have to be humane

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Camas, WA

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Well they dont want to give lead poisoning to the terrorists, we have to be humane

Considering that not everyone in the area where we are currently holding offensive operations is a terrorist...

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Probably work

 pretre wrote:
 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Well they dont want to give lead poisoning to the terrorists, we have to be humane

Considering that not everyone in the area where we are currently holding offensive operations is a terrorist...

The way people keep going on about them, you'd think we had them jumping out from behind every corner.

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Fort Campbell

 pretre wrote:
 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Well they dont want to give lead poisoning to the terrorists, we have to be humane

Considering that not everyone in the area where we are currently holding offensive operations is a terrorist...


The only credible risk of lead poisoning that I've seen is from subsistence hunters who on a daily basis eat animals they have shot, and even that is rare.

Unless Afghani's are doing nightly BBQ's with the latest Jimmy Jihad we lit up, the risk is statistically negligible to them.

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New Jersey, State of Perfection

So, where does the 1600% more come into play?

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Ma55ter_fett wrote:It reads like the ramblings of a Nigerian lobotomized Shakespeare typed into a cellphone with a very aggressive autocomplete function.
 
   
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I was being sarcastic, It was mean t as a joke that we dont want to poison the terrorists we shot with lead.

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I figured as much, either that or djones was practicing to become a journalist ;P

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Ma55ter_fett wrote:It reads like the ramblings of a Nigerian lobotomized Shakespeare typed into a cellphone with a very aggressive autocomplete function.
 
   
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Camas, WA

 djones520 wrote:
The only credible risk of lead poisoning that I've seen is from subsistence hunters who on a daily basis eat animals they have shot, and even that is rare.

I imagine handling them as well could be an issue and if they get into the water supply. I imagine there are also environmental issues surrounding lead production, but yeah...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh hey look, more information that didn't come to breitbart... How bad do you have to be when FOX is more factual... Geeze.

It has little to do with EPA:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/18/end-line-for-lead-bullet-regulations-bans-force-switch-to-green-ammo/

The bid to ban lead bullets, seen by some as harmful to the environment, started slowly more than a decade ago. But with two dozen states, including California, banning bullets made of the soft, heavy metal, the lead bullet's epitaph was already being written when the federal government finished it off.

First, the military announced plans to phase out lead bullets by 2018.

Then the federal Environmental Protection Agency, citing emissions, ordered the shutdown of the Doe Run company's lead smelter in Herculaneum, Mo., by year's end.


So the military was already planning to get rid of them before EPA stepped in and EPA is acting because of environmental issues at the manufacturer.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/19 20:56:14


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Fort Campbell

chaos0xomega wrote:
So, where does the 1600% more come into play?


The fact that a led bullet cost .5 cents to make, and these green ones cost 8 cents to make. And we're just talking the actual projectile here, not the whole thing, with casing, powder, etc...

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Lakewood, Ohio

 djones520 wrote:
 pretre wrote:
 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Well they dont want to give lead poisoning to the terrorists, we have to be humane

Considering that not everyone in the area where we are currently holding offensive operations is a terrorist...


The only credible risk of lead poisoning that I've seen is from subsistence hunters who on a daily basis eat animals they have shot, and even that is rare.

Unless Afghani's are doing nightly BBQ's with the latest Jimmy Jihad we lit up, the risk is statistically negligible to them.

Is Jimmy Jihad a competitor of Jack Link's Jerky?

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Toronto, Canada

 daedalus wrote:
What are the new bullets actually made from?


IT'S PEOPLE!

   
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 daedalus wrote:
What are the new bullets actually made from?


Ground-up unicorn horn and wishful thinking.


 gossipmeng wrote:

IT'S PEOPLE!


Or, you know, this.


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 Medium of Death wrote:
While on the one hand it's great that they are pushing environmental issues, what kind of impact does the lead really have?

Seems a bit mad.


I'm going to say that it has a zero impact on the surrounding envrionment.

How much lead do you think was droped all across europe during ww2,

Hell more lead was probably used during one large scale Air raid with B17s than one year in Iraq


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I suspect the B17s dropped a lot more steel than lead...


As for the smelting issue, almost all lead ammo in the US is made from recycled lead vice newly smelted lead.

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Oklahoma

 djones520 wrote:
chaos0xomega wrote:
So, where does the 1600% more come into play?


The fact that a led bullet cost .5 cents to make, and these green ones cost 8 cents to make. And we're just talking the actual projectile here, not the whole thing, with casing, powder, etc...


So either the casing is going up 1600%, the powder is going up 1600%, the labor is going up 1600% and the etc is going up 1600% as well...making the thread title true.

Or the thread title is sensationalist bullcrap.

A casual Google search seems to indicate that the military seems to pay aorund $0.40 per round. So if the quoted number for the cost increase is correct and the military gets no discount in prices for their giant bulk purchases it would put the new cost at $.0475 per round.

Considering that this would be a 20% increase in cost instead of a 1600% increase in cost I think it is safe to say that the thread title is a lie.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 CptJake wrote:
I suspect the B17s dropped a lot more steel than lead...


As for the smelting issue, almost all lead ammo in the US is made from recycled lead vice newly smelted lead.


Wasn't the one place that was shut down pretty much a new lead only operation, so the impact was going to be pretty minimal?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/19 21:48:13


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Pleasant Valley, Iowa

 d-usa wrote:
Considering that this would be a 20% increase in cost instead of a 1600% increase in cost I think it is safe to say that the thread title is a lie.


Well, you don't stuff facts into the Right Wing Outrage Machine©. My friend, you load it with derp and sensationalism, and then crank that wheel.
   
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 Ouze wrote:
 d-usa wrote:
Considering that this would be a 20% increase in cost instead of a 1600% increase in cost I think it is safe to say that the thread title is a lie.


Well, you don't stuff facts into the Right Wing Outrage Machine©. My friend, you load it with derp and sensationalism, and then crank that wheel.

Don't forget to add Liquid Schwatz to that too!

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St. Louis

Given the sort of bs Doe Run is infamous for... good?
   
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Pleasant Valley, Iowa

 djones520 wrote:
I haven't found anything yet that says that, but I have seen that the price of lead bullets was .5 cents per bullet, while these new "green" bullets are 8 cents a bullet.


Where DID that 1600% figure come from? It's not in the source article at all. I'm pretty terrible at math but I think a 1600% increase would be an $8 dollar round, not an 80 cent one... right?

 daedalus wrote:
What are the new bullets actually made from?


Shredded paper from the constitution, soaked in Obama urine.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/12/19 22:59:05


 
   
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Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 Ouze wrote:

 daedalus wrote:
What are the new bullets actually made from?


Shredded paper from the constitution, soaked in Obama urine.


And the tears of Republicans during the aftermath of the '08/'12 election.

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The Great State of Texas

 daedalus wrote:
What are the new bullets actually made from?

Copper and the armpit sweat saved from Chester E Puller.

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Have any of you geniuses considered that $.05 a round to &.08 cents a round is a 60% increase in cost, meaning they're paying 160% of what they were, and that the extra zero might simply be a typo?

But you know, don't let logic and rationale get in the way of demonizing anything slightly right.

 
   
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 Medium of Death wrote:
While on the one hand it's great that they are pushing environmental issues, what kind of impact does the lead really have?

It makes the person on the receiving end fall over

 
   
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The Great State of Texas

 djones520 wrote:
 pretre wrote:
 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Well they dont want to give lead poisoning to the terrorists, we have to be humane

Considering that not everyone in the area where we are currently holding offensive operations is a terrorist...


The only credible risk of lead poisoning that I've seen is from subsistence hunters who on a daily basis eat animals they have shot, and even that is rare.

Unless Afghani's are doing nightly BBQ's with the latest Jimmy Jihad we lit up, the risk is statistically negligible to them.


Also, people who shoot indoors a lot. I have elevated lead levels. I blame the Crimean War...



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 cincydooley wrote:
Have any of you geniuses considered that $.05 a round to &.08 cents a round is a 60% increase in cost, meaning they're paying 160% of what they were, and that the extra zero might simply be a typo?

But you know, don't let logic and rationale get in the way of demonizing anything slightly right.


Or it might be a false figure used to scare people. But just to be clear you are saying it is the readers fault for not interpreting the article correctly? Do I have that right?

   
 
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