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I don't want to buy a titan, superheavy, or gargantuan creature model just to have a chance at the new 40K tournaments, if they allow Escalation and Stronghold. Then, I came across the rules for the Transcendent C'tan. It's a model that has D-weapons and is basically the Necron equivalent of a titan, but can be represented by the Deceiver or Nightbringer models. It's also easy to ally in Necrons to most established lists. Is this unit the answer for everyone who doesn't want to buy a Revenant Titan?

If you are playing competitive tournament scene then there isn't much choice but to get the new and shiny is there.


the transcendent i think is one of the best minimightysuperheavynotreallygargantuen creature with some of the best D weapons available - hellstorm hits of death!.

its small enough to hide though from what i keep hearing tournaments dont have many LOS blocking terrain.

Superheavies can only be taken for your primary detachment AFAIK.

So, it's the solution for Necrons anyways.

I think it's a great way of using my Eldar Avatar model as an actual titan without actually having to buy a new model. If this game gets as ridiculous as currently would be, it would be nice to have a D-weapon model without paying $200+ for it.

 Oaka wrote:
I think it's a great way of using my Eldar Avatar model as an actual titan without actually having to buy a new model. If this game gets as ridiculous as currently would be, it would be nice to have a D-weapon model without paying $200+ for it.

In a tournament , I'd actually have a problem with you using both a normal C'tan and an Avatar as your T C'Tan since you are just doing it so that you don't have to pay as much to get the model.
Anywhere else I wouldn't even bother playing with a titan class monster...

 Makutsu wrote:

 Oaka wrote:
I think it's a great way of using my Eldar Avatar model as an actual titan without actually having to buy a new model. If this game gets as ridiculous as currently would be, it would be nice to have a D-weapon model without paying $200+ for it.

In a tournament , I'd actually have a problem with you using both a normal C'tan and an Avatar as your T C'Tan since you are just doing it so that you don't have to pay as much to get the model.
Anywhere else I wouldn't even bother playing with a titan class monster...

What the hell does it matter to you how much money your opponent has spent on his army? It's still reasonably wysiwyg, and it's not like it's confusing to you regarding what's what.


@OP: The C'tan, with its 18" D-move, the D-template and whatever else it has to take, is a fantastic option. It can easily hide behind terrain, or even your own vehicles, and absolutely murders pretty much everything, and has the mobility to get where it needs to be. In addition, the Necron primary detachment can be really effective at very small sizes. Two Warrior units in Scythes, a Destroyer Lord tanking for a unit of Wraiths, and you're under 700 points. Add in the C'tan and you still have room for allies at higher point levels. Otherwise you can drop the Destroyer Lord and the Wraiths for a cheaper HQ and more allies.

This^

Confusing counts as I can understand, but being biased against someone for not wasting their money... nah bro

I understand it's an attractive option for those who don't want to spend, but if you're using Necrons and don't want to spend on Lords of War, just play without them. I think Necrons are one of the very few armies that can compete vs. Lords of War without actually having one in their own army.

As far as the C'tan is concerned, it's a bit of a glass cannon. It dies much easier than some other superheavies in that point range, but it does clean up non-superheavies faster than its competitors. If you can ally Necrons into your army, you could ally in a Pylon as well. It costs about the same as a Wraithknight in real money, but it's probably not hard to convert a giant gun platform either.

Maybe I'm just being dumb(not the first time.)But what is the point of tournaments?From what I understand basically instead of being able to say:"Serpent spam?Sorry not playing".You have to play against it.Same with revenants and tournaments that allow escalation.Could someone explain them to me?

Da krimson barun wrote:
Maybe I'm just being dumb(not the first time.)But what is the point of tournaments?From what I understand basically instead of being able to say:"Serpent spam?Sorry not playing".You have to play against it.Same with revenants and tournaments that allow escalation.Could someone explain them to me?

I doubt you can walk around at your local store or gaming club and seeing 100-200 painted armies on display, and getting to play around 6 games vs. new people.

Tournaments, for me, are what makes this game worth playing, and it's not because of the competition. It's the best means of getting the 40K players world- or nationwide together. Most people at tournaments don't have your type of attitude problems. You shouldn't be afraid to lose, because being unbeaten at your local group doesn't mean much either.

 Therion wrote:
I understand it's an attractive option for those who don't want to spend, but if you're using Necrons and don't want to spend on Lords of War, just play without them. I think Necrons are one of the very few armies that can compete vs. Lords of War without actually having one in their own army.

As far as the C'tan is concerned, it's a bit of a glass cannon. It dies much easier than some other superheavies in that point range, but it does clean up non-superheavies faster than its competitors. If you can ally Necrons into your army, you could ally in a Pylon as well. It costs about the same as a Wraithknight in real money, but it's probably not hard to convert a giant gun platform either.

Necrons are indeed one of the few armies that can probably use almost the same army in regular games as well as in games of Escalation with a reasonable chance for victory. Most other armies become true underdogs when going up against Destroyer weaponry.

However, super-heavies can only be taken in the Primary detachments so you cannot ally in a Necron super-heavy. Rather, necrons would have to be your primary army if you want to take the C'tan.

DE don't have too much of a problem with that sort of thing based an amount of shots and large numbers of high strength lance shots.

One thing is for certain, Void Shield generators are a must for any Escalation game.

 Dakkamite wrote:
This^

Confusing counts as I can understand, but being biased against someone for not wasting their money... nah bro

In a tournament, either put in the effort to convert it or pay for it is my rule. That's pretty fair considering that people are playing for money/rewards/prizes.

I wouldn't mind if someone spent hours and hours into making one that looks cool, but just using the model as is would be considered proxying and is normally frowned upon in tournaments.
It's not like the TC'Tan doesn't have an official model anyway, for models that don't have an official model that's a whole different story.

So what you're saying is if a new DE codex drops and all the Ravagers in a DE book are now super powerful, you would let me use my Raiders AS IS as Ravagers instead?
Pretty much the same thing as using a normal C'Tan for a TC'Tan, aka proxying.

 Therion wrote:

Da krimson barun wrote:
Maybe I'm just being dumb(not the first time.)But what is the point of tournaments?From what I understand basically instead of being able to say:"Serpent spam?Sorry not playing".You have to play against it.Same with revenants and tournaments that allow escalation.Could someone explain them to me?

I doubt you can walk around at your local store or gaming club and seeing 100-200 painted armies on display, and getting to play around 6 games vs. new people.

Tournaments, for me, are what makes this game worth playing, and it's not because of the competition. It's the best means of getting the 40K players world- or nationwide together. Most people at tournaments don't have your type of attitude problems. You shouldn't be afraid to lose, because being unbeaten at your local group doesn't mean much either.

I hear this all the time - get smashed in round one by some tourney player, then go down to the lower brackets and enjoy your weekend.

However, 'attitude problems' as used here is rude and totally incorrect. People aren't rejecting serpent spam lists because they'll lose to them (though thats part of the reason) but because the army is a thoughtless overpowered spam list thats no fun to go up against.

I've had much more fun in many of the games I've lost than the ones I've won, even on those occasions when my ancient codex trumps OTT spam garbage.

So what you're saying is if a new DE codex drops and all the Ravagers in a DE book are now super powerful, you would let me use my Raiders AS IS as Ravagers instead?
Pretty much the same thing as using a normal C'Tan for a TC'Tan, aka proxying.

I wouldn't care, as long as its not confusing.

They're both paper thin, bladelike DE ships that are covered in spikes and stuff, no?

So does this mean that I can proxy my wraith lords as wraith knights, and my wraith knight as a revenant titan?

 Arbiter wrote:
So does this mean that I can proxy my wraith lords as wraith knights, and my wraith knight as a revenant titan?

And because of the transitive property that would mean the wraithlords could be revenants!!! (if A=B and B=C then A=C) as long as your opponents ok with it go ahead

As for the Ctan=TCtan I would say your silly of you dont allow it since Ctan take up so many different shapes and sizes lore wise and maybe that TCtan shard was of the deciever or nightbringer and not scary green firey thing

EDIT: Clarified things a bit

 Arbiter wrote:
So does this mean that I can proxy my wraith lords as wraith knights, and my wraith knight as a revenant titan?

The Rev. Titan seems to be a bit larger than the Wraith Knight.

The TC'tan is an interesting choice having a decent damage output. But with his low number of wounds he's rather vulnerable.

With T9 3+/4++ and FNP, he is hardly vulnerable against normal weapons.

 Illumini wrote:
With T9 3+/4++ and FNP, he is hardly vulnerable against normal weapons.

However, if he's hit by a D weapons, then his 6 wounds will hardly help. With 9 wounds I would be more confident.

 wuestenfux wrote:

 Illumini wrote:
With T9 3+/4++ and FNP, he is hardly vulnerable against normal weapons.

However, if he's hit by a D weapons, then his 6 wounds will hardly help. With 9 wounds I would be more confident.

Besides the C'tan is weak to weapons that wound on a fixed number [I could kill it with it's point cost in drop pod sternguard]

Sternguard ammunition is poisoned. Gargantuan creatures are only affected by poison (and sniper rounds) on wound roll of 6. Your hellfire rounds are only 1/5 as good against a Gargantuan Creature as they would be against a typical Monstrous Creature.

Grav guns still work though. Probably an oversight. Agonizers and Vect's Sceptre of the City, too, not that it matters.

EDIT: Not sure about Deathmarks and Hunters from Hyperspace. Sniper weapons are supposed to wound on a 6+, but marked targets are supposed to take wounds on a 2+. I would presume the supplement overrides the codex.