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As the thread implies really, has there ever been a case where these two wonderfully shooty armies took to the field together to prod buttock?
And if not, what would be a good idea behind a temporary alliance? (aside from 'we're both after the same guy')

Sorry if this is a bit of a fluff abomination, but I really want to use my wonderful Dangel drop pods without feeling soulless and icky.

Well...

The old fluff goes like "The Dark Angels are also notoriously intolerant of non-humans and will refuse to fight alongside armies that include alien races. They are highly suspicious of outsiders and often appear unreasonably aloof and intransigent." So expect some nerd rage from some fluff-lovers. According to the Rulebook now they are OK with Eldars and Tau, and Desperate Allies with Necrons, so this has changed. Anyway, I haven´t heard of any Necron-Dark Angel alliance in the setting... so you should create one. And the allied matrix is usually regarded as "unfluffy".

The only reason I can think of that would make the Dark Angels side with the Xeno is the hunt of the Fallen. So if a Fallen is suspected to be nearby some sort of alliance is conceivable.

Another option: play a renegade warband of Dark Angels. Loyalists fall to chaos all the time, or go renegade. It helps if you are playing a successor Chapter that got isolated from the rest of the Unforgiven. That would explain how they can ally with, well, anyone you wish. Creating your own insignias, chapter symbols and banners helps a lot.

Another option: play a Space Marine Chapter you create on the go. Say that it is ignored who is the progenitor. Apply the rules for Dark Angels. The Chapter could be in charge of a Sector and being force to ally with Necrons against a major thread.

Hope this helps. Do not let anyone tell you what you can field... they are your models, your money an your time.

Necrons teaming up with the living? Nope. Never happened, never will.

I said it never happened.

 Lord Spartacus wrote:
Necrons teaming up with the living? Nope. Never happened, never will.

I said it never happened.

LOOK AT IT! LOOOOK AAAAAAT IIIIIIT!

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
LOOK AT IT! LOOOOK AAAAAAT IIIIIIT!

Get out of here with your filthy propaganda!

Hmmm, I suppose since the Angels are gonna be a drop pod list, could I just say that they're simply killing the more dangerous force, so like a super temporary alliance where as soon as other force is all gone/prisoners are taken it's time to boogaloo MK2?

thoughts?

@Lord Spartacus
Have you read Codex: Inquisition? The Allies Matrix.

Inquisitors are Battle Brothers with human (not-chaos).
Allies of Convenience with Eldar and Eldar alone.
Desperate Allies with Dark Eldar and Tau.
And will never, never, never ally with Orks, Tyranids and Necrons.

That´s quite a change from the previous situation, with Inquisitors (through Grey Knights) allying with Necrons as Allies of Convenience.

I hope this is a sign of future changes in the Allies Matrix, with the Necrons going more Necron-like again. A lot of people complained on the new "we are all friends" direction the setting was moving towards. Perhaps GW listens.

I hope so.







Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Inky wrote:
Hmmm, I suppose since the Angels are gonna be a drop pod list, could I just say that they're simply killing the more dangerous force, so like a super temporary alliance where as soon as other force is all gone/prisoners are taken it's time to boogaloo MK2?

thoughts?

Old style Dark Angels will attack everything even if it endangers the mission. They are really stubborn in this regard.

Now it seems Space Marines are more "reasonable", so I guess you can try this approach. As I said, expect some nerd-rage.

 da001 wrote:
@Lord Spartacus
Have you read Codex: Inquisition? The Allies Matrix.

Inquisitors are Battle Brothers with human (not-chaos).
Allies of Convenience with Eldar and Eldar alone.
Desperate Allies with Dark Eldar and Tau.
And will never, never, never ally with Orks, Tyranids and Necrons.

That´s quite a change from the previous situation, with Inquisitors (through Grey Knights) allying with Necrons as Allies of Convenience.

I hope this is a sign of future changes in the Allies Matrix, with the Necrons going more Necron-like again. A lot of people complained on the new "we are all friends" direction the setting was moving towards. Perhaps GW listens.

I hope so.







Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Inky wrote:
Hmmm, I suppose since the Angels are gonna be a drop pod list, could I just say that they're simply killing the more dangerous force, so like a super temporary alliance where as soon as other force is all gone/prisoners are taken it's time to boogaloo MK2?

thoughts?

Old style Dark Angels will attack everything even if it endangers the mission. They are really stubborn in this regard.

Now it seems Space Marines are more "reasonable", so I guess you can try this approach. As I said, expect some nerd-rage.

It seems that due to newcrons you could have non-perma omnicidal deathmachines (which i personally like, as oldcrons reminded me of pretty much metal nids) in that a particular lord that may or may not wish to kill the big green numpties, but for Dangels? they've been shown to work with Eldar and although the Allies Matrix is daft, I can honestly see something working out between them...

But i admit, it's mainly because I want to use the lovely drop pods I'm painting (they're so shiny and feathered!)

 da001 wrote:
Well...

The old fluff goes like "The Dark Angels are also notoriously intolerant of non-humans and will refuse to fight alongside armies that include alien races. They are highly suspicious of outsiders and often appear unreasonably aloof and intransigent." So expect some nerd rage from some fluff-lovers. According to the Rulebook now they are OK with Eldars and Tau, and Desperate Allies with Necrons, so this has changed. Anyway, I haven´t heard of any Necron-Dark Angel alliance in the setting... so you should create one. And the allied matrix is usually regarded as "unfluffy".

The only reason I can think of that would make the Dark Angels side with the Xeno is the hunt of the Fallen. So if a Fallen is suspected to be nearby some sort of alliance is conceivable.

Another option: play a renegade warband of Dark Angels. Loyalists fall to chaos all the time, or go renegade. It helps if you are playing a successor Chapter that got isolated from the rest of the Unforgiven. That would explain how they can ally with, well, anyone you wish. Creating your own insignias, chapter symbols and banners helps a lot.

Another option: play a Space Marine Chapter you create on the go. Say that it is ignored who is the progenitor. Apply the rules for Dark Angels. The Chapter could be in charge of a Sector and being force to ally with Necrons against a major thread.

Hope this helps. Do not let anyone tell you what you can field... they are your models, your money an your time.

I'd also point out that Necrons allying with humans and Astartes allying with Necrons isn't that outlandish at all with the new Necron fluff. The Necrons are the ULTIMATE arch enemy of Chaos and a reasonably intact Necron Lord or Overlord should be more than happy to accept aid from any human factions that also despise Chaos. After the Chaos forces are removed, they'd of course go right back to killing each other, but Necrons and Humanity share a large and unifying enemy. Sure the Necrons may view humans as a bunch of gypsies loitering on their property and humans/astartes viewing Xenos as an affront to their existence, but they both despise Chaos above all else.

Well,I as necron collected, heard that blood angels and necrons teamed up against the tyranids...

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Lord Spartacus wrote:
Necrons teaming up with the living? Nope. Never happened, never will.

I said it never happened.

LOOK AT IT! LOOOOK AAAAAAT IIIIIIT!

Matt.... WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I couldn't resist.
This is the guy that wrote the worst "9 year old wrote it" fluff in the GK codex.
Here's an example of his style.
"And then, the single Ultramarine raised his battered chain sword high above his headand charged the Tyranid horde with that mighty weapon of doom! He slew them by the thousands single handidly and the planet was saved that day and never again did the vile xenos threaten the peaceful world again, ever."
That's really not much of an exaggeration.

Ignore the allies matrix it has little to no basis in fluff, case in point Tau and space marines (of all kinds) being battle brothers,dark angels would never willingly ally with even abhumans let alone non humans, all xenos should be come the apocalypse for da and all imperials allies of convenience, with exception to inquisition which should be distrusted allies.

Stupid allies matrix

 MWHistorian wrote:

I couldn't resist.
This is the guy that wrote the worst "9 year old wrote it" fluff in the GK codex.
Here's an example of his style.
"And then, the single Ultramarine raised his battered chain sword high above his headand charged the Tyranid horde with that mighty weapon of doom! He slew them by the thousands single handidly and the planet was saved that day and never again did the vile xenos threaten the peaceful world again, ever."
That's really not much of an exaggeration.

Yes, it is an exaggeration. Over-exaggeration gets silly.

The DA would probably hate allying with any xenos but if it helped to protect their super secret history or capture the fallen then they would strip naked and belly dance with a tyranid.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Lord Spartacus wrote:
Necrons teaming up with the living? Nope. Never happened, never will.

I said it never happened.

LOOK AT IT! LOOOOK AAAAAAT IIIIIIT!

Please take my Exalt............

Looking at the necron perspective of this allaince I don't see why not, after they turned the c'than to shards some of the necrons looked for peace instead of war, and I kind of think thats what makes this hard. On one hand we have the flayed ones whom only care to slaughter and feast, but on the other hand we have some of the crons who are still partly there and they want peace. Add the peaceful/defensive squads of necrons+ common enemy = allies4dayz. Of course, it also depends which group the BA ask, because they could get unlucky and end up with a few rounds from a gauss cannon :c

 Formosa wrote:
Ignore the allies matrix it has little to no basis in fluff, case in point Tau and space marines (of all kinds) being battle brothers,dark angels would never willingly ally with even abhumans let alone non humans, all xenos should be come the apocalypse for da and all imperials allies of convenience, with exception to inquisition which should be distrusted allies.

Stupid allies matrix

If you ever get a chance, look through the Iyanden supplement. There is a really, really fun scenario which is 3 armies, 2v1, with an Iyanden/Dark Angels allied force against a Chaos base in the middle of the board that has to be lead by a Chaos Lord with certain upgrades they list. Iyanden side has to field at least one troops' choice worth of wraithguard, Dark Angels have to field at least 1 Ravenwing Attack Squad.

The fluff behind the battle it's supposed to portray is really cool. Basically the Eldar were already working on purging the zone when they realized the Dark Angels were approaching. They hid and waited for the Dark Angels to blow up the fortress walls to this place as their Ravenwing went in pursuit of the fallen, and joined them in the massacre of the chaos marines.

It's also the only scenario from the book I've had a chance to play as between me and two of my friends, we were practically gifted from the GW gods a scenario designed for the 3 armies we already had built.

 foto69man wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Lord Spartacus wrote:
Necrons teaming up with the living? Nope. Never happened, never will.

I said it never happened.

LOOK AT IT! LOOOOK AAAAAAT IIIIIIT!

Please take my Exalt............

And mine as well.

A good example that quickly comes to mind is Taudar. Dark Angels share the same distaste for Xenos although they hate chaos more.

If regular SM chapters hate to ally necrons, you can expect the odds that DA would ally a necron to be even lesser.

So I think it won't happen.

If this happens i'm done with 40k.

The hardest thing to come up with for this alliance idea is what foe would the DA find more dangerous than the Necrons?

 Psienesis wrote:
The hardest thing to come up with for this alliance idea is what foe would the DA find more dangerous than the Necrons?

There's the possibility of allying against Chaos forces or as a means of capturing or otherwise thwarting The Fallen. Of course, my preference is that alliances like this should essentially *never* be written about it because I think it to an extent diminishes the setting.

I never understood why people take such offense at the newcrons- the new version has greater depth, especially with their history and the rivalries between the Dynasties.

The idea of the races not all being brain-dead and capable of temporary alliances is a good thing, it makes W40K more mature. The problem with allies in W40K is that you can't be certain that they won't blow up your engines when the fight with the uniting foe is won and leave you behind as sharkbait.

You know I am not sure there is anything the DA wont do if it is the only way to capture one of the fallen or keep one of the fallen from being captured by another IoM agency. It is well documented in the fluff that the DA distract, work against, and disappear inquisitors who come close enough to the truth and that they will disobey orders and leave battles and campaigns to chase the fallen.

Funnily enough the hard part might actually be justifying the necrons involvement in such an alliance. How would allowing the DA to capture one of the fallen further their goals? The only answer I can think of is that one of the fallen tries to awaken a C'Tan or perhaps open a chaos gate on a tomb world which for some reason is not protected by pillars and the necrons actually have some attachment to. Alternatively perhaps the collector wants to collect the fallen?

The allies matrix while leaving this open does say that they have almost no ability to actually function as anything resembling a cohesive force. In fact it appears that they cannot even turn their backs on each other for a few seconds.

 Wyzilla wrote:
I never understood why people take such offense at the newcrons- the new version has greater depth, especially with their history and the rivalries between the Dynasties.

The idea of the races not all being brain-dead and capable of temporary alliances is a good thing, it makes W40K more mature. The problem with allies in W40K is that you can't be certain that they won't blow up your engines when the fight with the uniting foe is won and leave you behind as sharkbait.

Same reason why the Borg in startrek was scary when they where an all consuming force of nature, que later addition of the Borg queen and now they are the butts of everyones jokes, WH40k have plenty of races to ally with, perhaps even negotating with, Nids and Crons arent one of those races.

Bishop F Gantry wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:
I never understood why people take such offense at the newcrons- the new version has greater depth, especially with their history and the rivalries between the Dynasties.

The idea of the races not all being brain-dead and capable of temporary alliances is a good thing, it makes W40K more mature. The problem with allies in W40K is that you can't be certain that they won't blow up your engines when the fight with the uniting foe is won and leave you behind as sharkbait.

Same reason why the Borg in startrek was scary when they where an all consuming force of nature, que later addition of the Borg queen and now they are the butts of everyones jokes, WH40k have plenty of races to ally with, perhaps even negotating with, Nids and Crons arent one of those races.

The Borg weren't scary in Voyager because they were nerfed to high hell, not because they were open to negotiations.

Meanwhile, the Necrons on the other hand are the absolute masters of the Imperium that use whole Imperial fleets as practice and could easily destroy Terra if they ever felt like it. They're their effective old man with a shotgun with everyone else simply being a bunch of annoying kids on his lawn that started playing a game of softball while he was sleeping. Necrons are scary because if they tell the laws of reality to jump, they ask how high.

Bishop F Gantry wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:
I never understood why people take such offense at the newcrons- the new version has greater depth, especially with their history and the rivalries between the Dynasties.

The idea of the races not all being brain-dead and capable of temporary alliances is a good thing, it makes W40K more mature. The problem with allies in W40K is that you can't be certain that they won't blow up your engines when the fight with the uniting foe is won and leave you behind as sharkbait.

Same reason why the Borg in startrek was scary when they where an all consuming force of nature, que later addition of the Borg queen and now they are the butts of everyones jokes, WH40k have plenty of races to ally with, perhaps even negotating with, Nids and Crons arent one of those races.

You need to look at the ally matrix for Necrons in the BRB, there are only 4 races that necrons CAN'T ally with: Chaos Daemons, eldar and dark eldar, and tyranids. This includes being able to ally with Dark Angels, Space Marines, and all the other IoM factions. I don't have my inquisition codex here so I don't know how that has changed but even the zealot Black Templars will ally with Necrons.

Mind you, they probably won't be having a post-battle cookout to celebrate.