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Made in us
Drew_Riggio





Hey fellas, and help would be appreciated. I am coming out of hiatus since 3rd edition. Are EC still a viable list. I had someone trying to explain to me how the ruinous powers work in 6th and all he did was confuse me. I remember watchin some EC games a few years ago with noise marines chewing MEQ to crap. Just curious about their playability/ability to field a EC force. Coming from an old Ork player.
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran




Reading - UK

I would say that anything is viable in the right environment. It really depends on whether you are playing hobists or competitive players or someone where in the middle.

Perhaps a troop choice of Noise marines has its place with the right tactics in a competitive world. EC with the right utility would do well in non competitive worlds, add a heldrake or 2, thats generally the deal with competitive chaos.
   
Made in us
Monstrous Master Moulder




Cleveland, Ohio, USA

Blastmasters are pretty awesome.

They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines, and they shall know no fear. 
   
Made in nz
Boom! Leman Russ Commander




New Zealand

Be prepared to hear a lot of

"Get plaguemarines instead and take 3x heldrakes"


5000
 
   
Made in us
Drew_Riggio





I wanted to make an EC themed force. The guys i would be playing are in betweeners hobbyist-tourny players.

Are EC army still doable or are my core units going to be BL ?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




St. George, UT

EC still rocks the house.

Just because your EC doesn't mean you can't use the best toys. The following is what I put into my list.

I take Lucius - Why because he unlocks noise marines and second he is hella fun to play and then either a biker lord with burning brand or a flying Daemon Prince

Elites - Nothing to be seen here... move along.

Troops. Noise marines Woot woot.
You can go one of two ways - shooty or assaulty. If you go shooty, I'd recommend a unit of 6 with blastmaster and sonic blastes, and IOE. These guys are your backfield objective sitters. They truely punish anyone who dares entire your side of the table.
Assauty is just noise marines with noise champion and doomsiren. Leave the sonic weapons at home. You have two attacks base and I5. Throw in the IOE and your going to stick around for a while. Put these guys in a rhino with dirge casters.

Fast - Heldrakes and bike squads with IOE banners are really mean. I5 on the bikes and T5 with FNP means your going to be around to get the goods in. I like double melta guns on my bikes.

HS - Maulerfiends and autocannon havoks. You use the Havoks to open up transports and the Maulerfiends to rip apart anything the autocannons can't handel. I personally run two maulerfiends and one havok squad.

Depending on how many sonic squads you take its easy to run a balanced shooty/assault list. I like mine 60% assaulty with 40% shooty. The glory of this list is that all the creatures have INV saves and IWND and all your guys have FNP. Add to it a disgusting number of AP3 template weapons and you have an army that is both resilant and adds pain in large chunks.

Now because I'm a fluff snob, all my units are either 6 or 12 guys. I even give the MOS to my havoks even though it really does nothing for them. I have been known to trade out one unit of CC noise marines for a unit of CSM to hang out with Lucius (with MOS and IOE of course) only to get my hands on another melta or plasma gun. But the unit is still always marked and it still is a 6 man squad in a rhino when all is said and done.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/02/15 03:00:35


See pics of my Orks, Tau, Emperor's Children, Necrons, Space Wolves, and Dark Eldar here:


 
   
Made in us
Member of a Lodge? I Can't Say




OK

The biggest problem with EC is that the Slaanesh Lord needed to unlock them is probably the worst lord of all.

From everything I've read it seems that MSU blastmaster squads are the way to go. The assaulty squads just sound like fail to me and they do not perform in batreps either. Take daemonettes as allies for assault.

I am trying out Noise Marines allied with daemons for the first time today and should be posting up some batreps.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/15 16:45:04




Argel Tal and Cyrene: Still a better love story than Twilight 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

Well, EC is still viable. You can unlock Noise Marines to become troops.
If you want to play competitive, I'd consider Helldrakes, Maulerfiends, Spawn and Bikers.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in us
Drew_Riggio





such a noob question but Allies with Daemons?
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

 dameanone wrote:
such a noob question but Allies with Daemons?

Why not. Slaaneshi Daemons are playable: winged DP, Greater Daemon (slow), Daemonettes, Fiends of Slaanesh, Soul Grinder.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a "" I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."

Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in gb
Cackling Chaos Conscript





HELL. Or just England

 herpguy wrote:
The biggest problem with EC is that the Slaanesh Lord needed to unlock them is probably the worst lord of all..


I would have to disagree here. MOS, MURDER SWORD, then either a bike or jump pack. Stick him in a fast squad with the Slaanesh Banner for FNP. I think that's a pretty tough, fast and killy.

Noise Marines still rock though, and +1 Iniative helps to survive in melee a lot more then you think.

The Red Mist Legion- Renegade Chaos Space Marines
'Show those loyalist dogs that their masters send them to the slaughter!'
Iron Heads - Ork Warband
'Dat one put a dent in my iron hat humie!'
The Red Coats - Necromunda Gang
'A good kill Juve, but not worthy of a Red Coat yet'
The Masked Junkies - Necromunda Gang
'Fully automatic, a steel backed stock and more bullets then I know what to do with! Now thats a real gun.' 
   
Made in us
Drew_Riggio





What i mean by allies with them, is back in 3rd you could just take them as a troop choice are they in a different slot now?
   
Made in gb
Cackling Chaos Conscript





HELL. Or just England

 dameanone wrote:
What i mean by allies with them, is back in 3rd you could just take them as a troop choice are they in a different slot now?

I think what you are looking for is this: To take an ally you MUST take 1 HQ and 1 Troop choice, after that you 'unlock' more slots on the FOC which allows you use more allied units. The rule book has it all layed out anyway

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/15 18:50:38


The Red Mist Legion- Renegade Chaos Space Marines
'Show those loyalist dogs that their masters send them to the slaughter!'
Iron Heads - Ork Warband
'Dat one put a dent in my iron hat humie!'
The Red Coats - Necromunda Gang
'A good kill Juve, but not worthy of a Red Coat yet'
The Masked Junkies - Necromunda Gang
'Fully automatic, a steel backed stock and more bullets then I know what to do with! Now thats a real gun.' 
   
Made in us
Frenzied Berserker Terminator





Everett, WA

 dameanone wrote:
What i mean by allies with them, is back in 3rd you could just take them as a troop choice are they in a different slot now?

Yeah, if you haven't played since 3rd, you're in for quite a surprise. No more Daemons in the same codex. Daemons have their own codex now. And if you want some in your army you have ally with them.

Adds an additional FOC, with limited numbers.

Kind of a pain, as you now have to get an additional codex.

Not sure if it's worth it, you'll get answers for and against allies.

I have tried allies several times, and I preffer running a single codex army. Less stuff to remember, and CSM has PLENTY of rules to remember.


   
Made in us
Lesser Daemon of Chaos




It kinda depends on what you mean by an 'Emperor's Children list'. There are no legion rules so to me all that really makes a particular list belong to a legion is fluff and paint. Hell, if you want to use plague marines in your EC just model them as drugged up and/or modified space marines and paint them purpley.
   
Made in us
Using Inks and Washes




St. George, Utah

 herpguy wrote:
The biggest problem with EC is that the Slaanesh Lord needed to unlock them is probably the worst lord of all.
I can't really argue against that because there are some brutal builds with Nurgle and Khorne lords (Tzeentch Lords can also be quite good because it's the only way to get 3++ on a beatstick HQ unit), but I wouldn't say they are bad. They can offer a lot of utility, especially if you jam one on a Steed of Slaanesh. There are a lot of chaos units that are really deadly when outflanked with acute senses, Noise Marines being a prime candidate with all those ignores cover weapons.

He's not going to do much against TEQ because all the AP2 weapons he has access to drop him to I1 which is a bad idea for an I6 model, but the nice part about outflanking with acute senses is you shouldn't have much of a problem going to where you want to go. Lightning Claw/Power Fist is the way to go, I think. Lets you bash vehicles if you have to, lightning claw against everything else when initiative will matter.
   
Made in us
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





I regret going khorne when double lash princes with msu blastmaster noisemarines were competitive before 6th ed. If I had went the double lash prince noisemarine army that I should have went with, then I would of had a fun time now in 6th ed.

I would of had six squads of six noise marines with six blastmasters. The new rule for 6th ed codex would have allowed me to have 12 noise marines and 2 blast masters per squads. I could have 12 blast masters among the 6 squads and I could have added IoE to make them harder to kill.

I regret...
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Vallejo, CA

EC are just fine. People are rightly talking up blastmasters, but don't forget sonic blasters as well. Your basic infantry have BS4 Ap5 ignores cover. That's a lot to chew on if you've got a Sv5+ army. Also, don't forget that EC are better than an awful lot of stuff in CC. Always striking first and FNP are both great ways to keep down casualties.

I've played against slaanesh CSM a couple of times, and the only one serious glaring problem that they have is against tanks and monstrous creatures. They don't get access to meltaguns/poison like plague marines, and they don't get S5 spam like berzerkers. This is really bad, of course, because the strongest lists in 40k at the moment revolve around vehicles and monstrous creatures.

As such, ECs are going to make up a part of a slaanesh CSM army, but possibly not even the most dominant part, given that you have to glean so many points to apply to heavy hitters elsewhere in the codex. Once you get some slaanesh havocs and your HQ choices sorted (and I don't think MoS terminators are that bad either), you will still have points left over for some MSU EC squads, or something.



Your one-stop website for batreps, articles, and assorted goodies about the men of Folera: Foleran First Imperial Archives. Read Dakka's favorite narrative battle report series The Hand of the King. Also, check out my commission work, and my terrain.

Abstract Principles of 40k: Why game imbalance and list tailoring is good, and why tournaments are an absurd farce.

Read "The Geomides Affair", now on sale! No bolter porn. Not another inquisitor story. A book written by a dakkanought for dakkanoughts!
 
   
Made in gr
Nurgle Veteran Marine with the Flu





Athens, Greece

Remember CL with slaanesh mount gets outflank. also 10 man NM squads with double BM and IoE will rock probably. Then bikes and drakes. Also you can CD allies as other people mentioned. KOS is faster than any other Greater daemon. And slaanesh DP has the last weapon which rocks. Apart from that you can add be'lakor. He is not slaaneshi but he can be a good all around.

Killing is easy. Being politically correct is a pain in the ass...
My Chaos Space Marines showcase so far: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/437151.page (too old - i will update it soon) 
   
Made in us
Drew_Riggio





Are dreads still used in CSM lineups? I remember they were insanely popular back in 3rd
   
Made in gb
Cackling Chaos Conscript





HELL. Or just England

 dameanone wrote:
Are dreads still used in CSM lineups? I remember they were insanely popular back in 3rd


Not so much, they are now called Helbrutes and have a weird random table they have to roll when they lose a hull point.

Ive had a bit of luck with them at low points games (500 - 750) but I know they arent super competitive

The Red Mist Legion- Renegade Chaos Space Marines
'Show those loyalist dogs that their masters send them to the slaughter!'
Iron Heads - Ork Warband
'Dat one put a dent in my iron hat humie!'
The Red Coats - Necromunda Gang
'A good kill Juve, but not worthy of a Red Coat yet'
The Masked Junkies - Necromunda Gang
'Fully automatic, a steel backed stock and more bullets then I know what to do with! Now thats a real gun.' 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Vallejo, CA

Nah, hellbrutes are pretty rare these days. In part, it's because they have a terrible model that's difficult to convert (because it's not a multi-piece, but rather a snap-together in the starter set), but also the roles it fills are very narrow.

This was the best I could come up with for how to use them. Even still, they have versatility, but not killing power or durability, especially compared to other options. And that's somewhat high praise - most people angrily dismiss them out of hand.



Your one-stop website for batreps, articles, and assorted goodies about the men of Folera: Foleran First Imperial Archives. Read Dakka's favorite narrative battle report series The Hand of the King. Also, check out my commission work, and my terrain.

Abstract Principles of 40k: Why game imbalance and list tailoring is good, and why tournaments are an absurd farce.

Read "The Geomides Affair", now on sale! No bolter porn. Not another inquisitor story. A book written by a dakkanought for dakkanoughts!
 
   
Made in us
Drew_Riggio





Another quick question, viability of a EC lord with Steed accompanying seekers of slaneesh? Usable or fluff nonsense?
   
Made in us
Stoic Grail Knight






Yendor

Sadly you cannot join with Seekers of Slaanesh because the Chaos Lord doesn't have Daemonic Instability, which prevents him from joining the squad. Its pretty lame actually.

That said I converted a Steed Lord from this Warriors of Chaos Kit and generally run him with some Spawn. The unit is surprisingly fast, and can hit a LOT of squads hard. I run the lord with Power Fist, Lightning Claw, Sigil, Steed. The one thing you need to be incredibly careful about with the Steed Lord is that he's not actually a match for most good close combat units. Only toughness 4 and no Eternal Warrior means he is incredibly vulnerable to instant death from monsters or enemy characters with Power fists. Add to that the prevalence of 2+ saves, and he is forced to swing at i1 if he desires to use his Power Fist, can make a lot of match ups rather daunting for him. But you can generally use his speed to pick off you're opponents support, and if you need a character to duel with your Opponents beat sticks a Black Mace Daemon Prince can handle just about anything.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/18 18:41:22


Xom finds this thread hilarious!

My 5th Edition Eldar Tactica (not updated for 6th, historical purposes only) Walking the Path of the Eldar 
   
Made in us
Drew_Riggio





Wow cultists are back? They seem to be a great deal and a good tie up unit.
   
Made in gb
Cackling Chaos Conscript





HELL. Or just England

 dameanone wrote:
Wow cultists are back? They seem to be a great deal and a good tie up unit.


Yeah, they are pretty sweet, they also make excellent back field objective holders and bullet catchers (read cover save) for your more important stuff

The Red Mist Legion- Renegade Chaos Space Marines
'Show those loyalist dogs that their masters send them to the slaughter!'
Iron Heads - Ork Warband
'Dat one put a dent in my iron hat humie!'
The Red Coats - Necromunda Gang
'A good kill Juve, but not worthy of a Red Coat yet'
The Masked Junkies - Necromunda Gang
'Fully automatic, a steel backed stock and more bullets then I know what to do with! Now thats a real gun.' 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Vallejo, CA

You can also use an outflanking lord with a big mob of cultists for sort of an evil version of Al'Rahem. Not terribly effective as cultists themselves are pretty pants, but it does give you a hell of a meatshield for your lord.

Plus, they're annoying because they score, so you have to technically get rid of them by the end of the game.


Your one-stop website for batreps, articles, and assorted goodies about the men of Folera: Foleran First Imperial Archives. Read Dakka's favorite narrative battle report series The Hand of the King. Also, check out my commission work, and my terrain.

Abstract Principles of 40k: Why game imbalance and list tailoring is good, and why tournaments are an absurd farce.

Read "The Geomides Affair", now on sale! No bolter porn. Not another inquisitor story. A book written by a dakkanought for dakkanoughts!
 
   
Made in gb
Cackling Chaos Conscript





HELL. Or just England

If you give them MoS they strike at the same time as marines, and they do through out a hell of a lot of attacks, if you can get them into a fight.

The Red Mist Legion- Renegade Chaos Space Marines
'Show those loyalist dogs that their masters send them to the slaughter!'
Iron Heads - Ork Warband
'Dat one put a dent in my iron hat humie!'
The Red Coats - Necromunda Gang
'A good kill Juve, but not worthy of a Red Coat yet'
The Masked Junkies - Necromunda Gang
'Fully automatic, a steel backed stock and more bullets then I know what to do with! Now thats a real gun.' 
   
Made in nz
Boom! Leman Russ Commander




New Zealand

And if you can't, you wasted 1ppm on worthless meat.

Keep cultists naked, their main feature is their low cost.

5000
 
   
Made in us
Stalwart Space Marine




Silver Spring, MD

Lord on Steed gives Outflank and Acute Senses to an attached squad. Run him with a 20-block of whatever with an icon.

Infiltrate shooty noise marines using Huron.
   
 
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