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Based on their points are Death cult assassins (DCA) the strongest close combat unit in the game?

For 15 points you get a model that has 3 attacks basic, 4 on the charge, strength 4, WS 5, Initative 6 and a 5+ invun save. Decent stats but nothing which would make it the best close combat unit.

But then you get the wargear and DCA ech have 2 power weapons meaning that for 15 points you get 4 attacks on the charge with power weapons. The fact they each have 2 power weapons means that you can give them a power sword for str 4 and AP3 and a power maul so they are str 6 ap 4 or you can give them an axe so they are str 5 ap 2 etc etc

for 15 points you get a model that has WS 5, Initiative 6, 4 attacks on the charge, 5+ invun and the choice of any 2 power weapons to increase their str to 6 or to increase their ap to 2 etc etc

is there another unit in the game that for the points cost is as effective as death cult assassins in close combat.

Howling Banshees come to mind.

in all of the newer books they can only take swords. but yes i really like them. i like to put 11 in a raider, with an inquisitor with hammer hand and rad grenades. makes for a brutal close combat unit. if your being really cheeky take the liber heresius and re-roll to hit as well with hatred

saf101 wrote:
in all of the newer books they can only take swords. but yes i really like them. i like to put 11 in a raider, with an inquisitor with hammer hand and rad grenades. makes for a brutal close combat unit. if your being really cheeky take the liber heresius and re-roll to hit as well with hatred

Grey Knight codex still allows them to use axes.

champagne_socialist wrote:
But then you get the wargear and DCA ech have 2 power weapons meaning that for 15 points you get 4 attacks on the charge with power weapons. The fact they each have 2 power weapons means that you can give them a power sword for str 4 and AP3 and a power maul so they are str 6 ap 4 or you can give them an axe so they are str 5 ap 2 etc etc.

I don't know if this has been changed/updated in Codex:Grey Knights, but Codex: =][= unfortunately specifies that they carry 2 power swords, so no more axe/sword combos. Still a very good unit for 15 points, but not quite as powerful, unfortunately.

EDIT: D'oh. I type too slow.

" Codex: =][="

Iv redownloaded the Epub one and it doesn't specificity only power sword. Nor for the crusader. (who i wanna nominate for extremely useful in CC with conjunction with the reroll save priest)

obsidiankatanaMade you are correct, but at the way things are going i don't know how much longer this is going to be the case

saf101 wrote:
obsidiankatanaMade you are correct, but at the way things are going i don't know how much longer this is going to be the case

My guess is that they will chaange death cult assassins wargear to two power swords rather than two power weapons in the next GK codex but that will be in quite a few years time.

I can think of a unit thats better point for point. 5 crusaders, 6 dca, 1 priest, 1 inquisitor with rad granades and hammerhand. Rerolls to hit and wound. St5 attacks against opponents with -1t. Lots of 3++ to keep them alive. 12 dca is overkill.

The Death Cult Assasins where the only reason my Banshees ever prooved their worth on the battlefeild. That women scrap left many dead but the Howling Banshees ability to strike first really hurts Death Cult Assasins. I had enough power to take out their shield wall too.

But yes they are really scary.

Poly Ranger wrote:
I can think of a unit thats better point for point. 5 crusaders, 6 dca, 1 priest, 1 inquisitor with rad granades and hammerhand. Rerolls to hit and wound. St5 attacks against opponents with -1t. Lots of 3++ to keep them alive. 12 dca is overkill.

Crusadors and DCA make a great unit, give the crusadors power axes along with their storm shields and the death cult assassins have power mauls and power swords. A 12 man unit of 9 assassins and 3 crusadors for 180 points will kill anything in close combat.

Pay the extra 10pts for a priest. Auto rerolls to hit due to his usr. His ability also means you are also likely to be rerolling to wound. And fearless! Ridiculous buffs to the unit for just 25pts.

+ Crusader with int 6 means it can scare down some Eldars as well.

Poly Ranger wrote:
Pay the extra 10pts for a priest. Auto rerolls to hit due to his usr. His ability also means you are also likely to be rerolling to wound. And fearless! Ridiculous buffs to the unit for just 25pts.

they dont have priests in the gk codex.

To answer your original question, the answer is no, they are not "the strongest". Strongest implies alot more than raw damage output. They do alot of damage, but will struggle against high toughness targets and have low toughness/poor saves.
As far as "most efficient", I think it depends. I would personally say that the crusader is a competitor due to the 3++, effectively making it as survivable against most AP2 as a TH/SS terminator. For raw damage output I think a death cult assassin or a squad of them is hard to beat, but without support they are only slightly more survivable than guardsmen.

Remember, you have to get to CC in the first place.

On another note, it's better to not start all your posts with absolute statements bordering on hyperbole and act as if you were the first to discover said unit/tactic...in this case the rest of us have known about death cult assassins for years.

 greyknight12 wrote:
To answer your original question, the answer is no, they are not "the strongest". Strongest implies alot more than raw damage output. They do alot of damage, but will struggle against high toughness targets and have low toughness/poor saves.
As far as "most efficient", I think it depends. I would personally say that the crusader is a competitor due to the 3++, effectively making it as survivable against most AP2 as a TH/SS terminator. For raw damage output I think a death cult assassin or a squad of them is hard to beat, but without support they are only slightly more survivable than guardsmen.

Remember, you have to get to CC in the first place.

On another note, it's better to not start all your posts with absolute statements bordering on hyperbole and act as if you were the first to discover said unit/tactic...in this case the rest of us have known about death cult assassins for years.

Based on their points are Death cult assassins (DCA) the strongest close combat unit in the game?

He asked a question. Dont be a jerk you make us gamers look bad.

 Swastakowey wrote:
He asked a question. Dont be a jerk you make us gamers look bad.

I'm not being a jerk for the sake of being a jerk, I'm trying to help the OP keep this thread from ending up like these:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/577539.page
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/30/580300.page#6555631
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/60/580243.page#6552135

And I did answer his question.

 greyknight12 wrote:

 Swastakowey wrote:
He asked a question. Dont be a jerk you make us gamers look bad.

I'm not being a jerk for the sake of being a jerk, I'm trying to help the OP keep this thread from ending up like these:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/577539.page
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/30/580300.page#6555631
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/60/580243.page#6552135

And I did answer his question.

Then PM him. Dont talk like that. 99% of people arent gonna research this guy just to see what you mean. Dont be a jerk dude, its easy.

 Swastakowey wrote:

 greyknight12 wrote:

 Swastakowey wrote:
He asked a question. Dont be a jerk you make us gamers look bad.

I'm not being a jerk for the sake of being a jerk, I'm trying to help the OP keep this thread from ending up like these:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/577539.page
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/30/580300.page#6555631
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/60/580243.page#6552135

And I did answer his question.

Then PM him. Dont talk like that. 99% of people arent gonna research this guy just to see what you mean. Dont be a jerk dude, its easy.

From what I can tell no, he wasn't being a jerk, he answered his question thoroughly and quite correctly towards the OP's question and having personally dealt with him in the past with a similar recent thread I wouldn't say that his last statement is unfounded. It wasn't very confrontational and if anything was more of a helpful suggestion in being a more respected member of the forum, one that needs to be quite open and blunt given his recent, very obstinate and unreasonable behaviour.

No seriously. Actually look at his posts in these threads. Either way the last thing he needs is someone reinforcing him to keep acting in this way.

I suppose he said "on another note" but not everyone saw what happened. I still disagree. Its easy to PM. Or keep it to relevant threads where people actually know what he is referring to. Otherwise people like me think he's just being a pain.

Sorry ish.

 Swastakowey wrote:
I suppose he said "on another note" but not everyone saw what happened. I still disagree. Its easy to PM. Or keep it to relevant threads where people actually know what he is referring to. Otherwise people like me think he's just being a pain.

Sorry ish.

Fair enough. But I can see part of the reasoning as to why he makes it public like this is so he can't ignore it unlike in a PM, which he may not even know how or bother to open.

 Grimskul wrote:

 Swastakowey wrote:
I suppose he said "on another note" but not everyone saw what happened. I still disagree. Its easy to PM. Or keep it to relevant threads where people actually know what he is referring to. Otherwise people like me think he's just being a pain.

Sorry ish.

Fair enough. But I can see part of the reasoning as to why he makes it public like this is so he can't ignore it unlike in a PM, which he may not even know how or bother to open.

I agree, at the time I didnt know though. It just came from nowhere haha. But I see your points now.

 Swastakowey wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:

 Swastakowey wrote:
I suppose he said "on another note" but not everyone saw what happened. I still disagree. Its easy to PM. Or keep it to relevant threads where people actually know what he is referring to. Otherwise people like me think he's just being a pain.

Sorry ish.

Fair enough. But I can see part of the reasoning as to why he makes it public like this is so he can't ignore it unlike in a PM, which he may not even know how or bother to open.

I agree, at the time I didnt know though. It just came from nowhere haha. But I see your points now.

S'alright. Out of context I can understand why you were upset. But now we know. And knowing is half the battle!

 Grimskul wrote:

 Swastakowey wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:

 Swastakowey wrote:
I suppose he said "on another note" but not everyone saw what happened. I still disagree. Its easy to PM. Or keep it to relevant threads where people actually know what he is referring to. Otherwise people like me think he's just being a pain.

Sorry ish.

Fair enough. But I can see part of the reasoning as to why he makes it public like this is so he can't ignore it unlike in a PM, which he may not even know how or bother to open.

I agree, at the time I didnt know though. It just came from nowhere haha. But I see your points now.

S'alright. Out of context I can understand why you were upset. But now we know. And knowing is half the battle!

All good. in this case the second half haha. Cheers.

 Grimskul wrote:

 Swastakowey wrote:
I suppose he said "on another note" but not everyone saw what happened. I still disagree. Its easy to PM. Or keep it to relevant threads where people actually know what he is referring to. Otherwise people like me think he's just being a pain.

Sorry ish.

Fair enough. But I can see part of the reasoning as to why he makes it public like this is so he can't ignore it unlike in a PM, which he may not even know how or bother to open.

what does he need to pm me about or even get angry about lol? I asked a legitimate question about whether DCA are the best close combat units in the game based on their points and wargear. If you don't liike me due to previuos threads that is your issue but following or stalking all of my threads so that you can take cheap shots is well rather cheap.

if you don't like me don't comment on my threads.

As my dad used to say 'if you have nothing nice to say it is better to say nothing at all'.