Is a Blood Angel army led by Mephiston illegal?

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**Sir Arun**

So if a Blood Angel army has Mephiston as the only HQ choice, is it illegal?

**rigeld2**

Sir Arun wrote:
So if a Blood Angel army has Mephiston as the only HQ choice, is it illegal?

Why would it be? He's an HQ character... so he's automatically the warlord.

**Sir Arun**

But the BRB says only Hq choice characters can be warlords, not HQ choices, and Mephiston has merely the infantry unit type and is not a character.

**rigeld2**

Sir Arun wrote:
But the BRB says only Hq choice characters can be warlords, not HQ choices, and Mephiston has merely the infantry unit type and is not a character.

He's a special character and therefore a character. He can challenge and everything.

**grendel083**

If he has the "unique" rule he is most definitly a character.
From the official FAQ:

Q: Do models classified as unique count as
characters? (p63)
A: Yes, but not in the case of vehicles (with the exception of
Bjorn the Fell-handed).

**DeathReaper**

grendel083 wrote:
If he has the "unique" rule he is most definitly a character.
From the official FAQ:

Q: Do models classified as unique count as
characters? (p63)
A: Yes, but not in the case of vehicles (with the exception of
Bjorn the Fell-handed).

Which really didn't need an FAQ as all special characters are characters. (Well I guess it did need an FaQ about the vehicle part).

**grendel083**

DeathReaper wrote:
Which really didn't need an FAQ as all special characters are characters. (Well I guess it did need an FaQ about the vehicle part).

Well true. I just like to reinforce the point beyond all doubt

**Sir Arun**

So can Mephiston join units or embark with a unit into a dedicated transport, then?

**Quanar**

Sir Arun wrote:
So can Mephiston join units or embark with a unit into a dedicated transport, then?

No, but being the Warlord doesn't care if you have the Independent Character special rule or not, it only cares if you are a character (the unit type - gained by being a special character in the case of older codexes).

**Kommissar Kel**

Sir Arun wrote:
So can Mephiston join units or embark with a unit into a dedicated transport, then?

No.

While he is a character, he is not an Independent Character

**nosferatu1001**

Sir Arun wrote:
So can Mephiston join units or embark with a unit into a dedicated transport, then?

No, as he does not have the IC rule. He is a character,like a vet sarge

**Vector Strike**

You can pick up the newest Blood Angels codex (it's just an update for 6th) or look at the pages right before Psionic Powers, in the Rulebook. There is a list of all 40k units (prior to July 2012), discriminating who is a Character.

**Sir Arun**

Vector Strike wrote:
or look at the pages right before Psionic Powers, in the Rulebook. There is a list of all 40k units (prior to July 2012), discriminating who is a Character.

is this only in the hardcover one or also in the mini rulebook?

**DrunkenDonkey**

Both, starts on page 134 in the mini rulebook.

**Sir Arun**

DrunkenDonkey wrote:
Both, starts on page 134 in the mini rulebook.

Am I blind or arent any stats for ICs mentioned there? I only see the stats for regular guys and vehicles.

**B0B MaRlEy**

You must be blind ,because I see lots of ICs in that list. Special characters on the other hand are not listed, and special characters are , as we are told from the FAQ, all characters.

**screaminskull**

Why is Mephiston not an independent character? Is it an oversight that hasn't been fixed or is there a reason?

**Happyjew**

He is not an IC because he does not have the IC rule (since at least 2009).

Fluff -wise...not 100% sure.

**PrinceRaven**

screaminskull wrote:
Why is Mephiston not an independent character? Is it an oversight that hasn't been fixed or is there a reason?

Because the ability to freely move something with a statline better than most Monstrous Creatures and potential 12 inch movement in and out of different squads at will would have been incredibly broken in 5th.

**CrownAxe**

screaminskull wrote:
Why is Mephiston not an independent character?

Because they didn't want him to be

**Ascalam**

And as a poke in the eye for Zogwort.

He's unsquiggable.

**SRSFACE**

screaminskull wrote:
Why is Mephiston not an independent character? Is it an oversight that hasn't been fixed or is there a reason?

Fluff-wise, I thought it was because the other Blood Angels don't trust him exactly, seeing as he's overcoming the blinding, maddening rage that plagues their whole chapter.

This is just what I've been told, though. Haven't actually read the Blood Angels book to be sure.

**screaminskull**

CrownAxe wrote:
screaminskull wrote:
Why is Mephiston not an independent character?

Because they didn't want him to be

Thanks for that insightful reply. Most helpful.

**CrownAxe**

screaminskull wrote:
CrownAxe wrote:
screaminskull wrote:
Why is Mephiston not an independent character?

Because they didn't want him to be

Thanks for that insightful reply. Most helpful.

That is literally the answer

**insaniak**

CrownAxe wrote:
That is literally the answer

No, it isn't. It's an answer, but it's not a particularly good one. It's like saying the sky is blue because it is. It's a useless response.

The common theory is pretty much what PrinceRaven said - he was designed to be a beatstick, and allowing him to join units would have been hideous. I don't recall if GW ever actually said as much, though.

**PrinceRaven**

Well, believe it or not, once upon a time GW cared just a tiny little bit about game balance, so I think it's the most likely reason they decided not to make him an IC.
The whole black rage survivor thing is also a viable explanation.

**Sir Arun**

arent there even badder IC beatsticks around?

**grendel083**

Sir Arun wrote:
arent there even badder IC beatsticks around?

Maybe now, but remember an entire enditon has come out since that codex. Balance has changed.
Don't feel too bad, just think of the poor Ork players with their 4th edition codex