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Hey guys, I am wondering what units you would suggest adding to my space marine army to make it more competitive, here is a list of my current army:
Fifteen tactical marines (5,5,5)
Fifteen terminators (5, 10)
Captain in power armour
Marneus calgar in power armour
librarian in terminator armour.
3 bikes.
2 ven dreadnoughts.

Thanks for any suggestions.

A lot depends on your playstyle and what direction you want to go.

You have no good AA. Picking up an ADL w/ a quadgun is a simple step, but you might be better served grabbing a flyer or two of your own.

Terminators, while fun and fluffy, are not very competitive in a lot of metas. When I include mine in a list, I generally stick to a 5 man squad. You are paying a lot of points for a generalist unit that is susceptible to a whole class of firepower, and one that is becoming increasingly common (AP2)

Some rhinos/razors for mobility might help. 5 man marine units are not that hard to erase from the table. In an objective based game I’d look into boosting the troops you have. My average 1,500 list has two full squads in rhinos plus some scouts. A bike captain and some more wheels in your army could also help here.

Long range firepower could use a boost. TFCs are good for thinning hordes, preds are not bad platforms for lascannons. The humble Dev squad got some nice boosts this edition. With a little care and caution Dev Cents can put a lot of firepower downrange.

A selection of the units you've listed would make a solid core to a list but none of it really stands out as being good at doing a particular job.

Some of the better and more powerful units at their particular roles (imho) are:

Thunderfire cannon - This puts wounds on all types of infantry at long range and doesn't need LOS, add the fact thats its hard to kill and can bolster cover and its a surefire winner. The model is very expensive but there are many alternatives out there if you look.

Stormtalon - Cheap anti-air that is also great at transport popping and can hurt most targets when needed to a lesser degree of effectiveness. The turret mounted assault cannon is great for getting to rear armour.

Bikes - These add needed speed to the list and with double special weapons also add specialised punch - Grav guns rule here.

Chapter Master on Bike - This guy is expensive but with the right equipment (AP:2 weapon, shield eternal, artificer armour) gives a very mobile true assault threat which is really needed to put certain opponents under pressure. Goes well with troop bikes or a bike command squad.

There are lots of other good units in the dex but those are the standout choices to my mind, possibly droppod sternguard or legion of the damned with melta for the damage they can do but they don't last long after they are used.

Drop Pods, Sternguard, DevCenturions and/or a Land Raider(for delivering Terminators in this edition of low-STR Rending/AP2).

Those are my top 4 items I'd recommend followed by Thunderfires, LasPreds and/or Devs.

You have calgar, and as much as I love these other suggestions you should use him to his full affect. You should run lots of tacticals with special weapons and combi weapons. He works really well in balanced infantry lists. So personally you could make those terminators thunderhammer/storm shield assault termies then do it because those are much more hardy. Also if you want to go calgar sternguard in drop pods, and devastator squads in the backlines also help out a lot. Basically just put lots of cheap bodies on the board. The all stars l the codex have pretty much all been mentioned here (with the exception of a few HQs)

ok thanks guys, I'm going to invest in a devestator squad with 2 lascannons and two heavy bolters. would you guys suggest a predator with twin-linked las + sponson lases?
what about adding a captain with shield eternal, thunder hammer, and terminator armour? 2+ 4++ sounds good for surviving shooting and getting into close combat where he should wreck face with str. 10 ap 2?
and maybe for some dedicated anti-air i add a 4x missile launcher devestator squad with flakk and max meat shields?
and for some anti-marine i should be ok, the only problem realy is when my termies run into a las-cannon or power fist, but i think i need some thing better because i need to shrink marine units quick 'cause the mass bolter fire tends to kill 2-3 termies per turn. so any suggestions for "thinning the horde" of ten man tactical squads

Thunderfire Cannon all day!

1. Storm talon(s)
2. Aegis Defense Line with quad gun.
3. More Tacticals (ap4 is useful against everything but MEQs)
4. Land raider(s)

 the shrouded lord wrote:
ok thanks guys, I'm going to invest in a devestator squad with 2 lascannons and two heavy bolters. would you guys suggest a predator with twin-linked las + sponson lases?
what about adding a captain with shield eternal, thunder hammer, and terminator armour? 2+ 4++ sounds good for surviving shooting and getting into close combat where he should wreck face with str. 10 ap 2?
and maybe for some dedicated anti-air i add a 4x missile launcher devestator squad with flakk and max meat shields?
and for some anti-marine i should be ok, the only problem realy is when my termies run into a las-cannon or power fist, but i think i need some thing better because i need to shrink marine units quick 'cause the mass bolter fire tends to kill 2-3 termies per turn. so any suggestions for "thinning the horde" of ten man tactical squads

I would avoid mixing weapon classes in dev squads. Running HB/LC half of your guns are going to be useless all of the time. If you want a little flex, use MLs. 2xLC, 2xML works much better vs. vehicles, and if you need to hit an infantry squad, you have the frags. The 2xHB, 2xML should be spending most of its time recoving troops from the table, but can toss a pair of kracks downrange if needed. The HBs might be able to strip a HP or two off of a light tank/flyer if you get lucky.

I like the auto/las pred, but compelling arguments can be made for the all-las one.

Flakk missiles are a trap choice, IMHO. For the points you spend, you can buy something better.

 the shrouded lord wrote:
ok thanks guys, I'm going to invest in a devestator squad with 2 lascannons and two heavy bolters.

Don't, at least if you want a more powerful army.

If you don't want the most powerful options because you don't like certain units, or because there is something that appeals to you especially because you think it's cool, then absolutely go for that, and I'm sure you can find lots of tips on how to make the best of it. The problems with a lot of the "tips" you typically get online is that people either don't know what they're talking about, or they are superimposing their own "morals" onto their tactical advice. And don't go out buying models based on what some random dudes on the internet think is cool, or how they think a Marine army ought to be run (and that includes me, btw). Decide if you want a straight-up better army, or if you want to make the best of a theme you like.

So, you want more power? Well, Marines have a few hardcore power lists, but based on your collection that's gonna be some serious investments. First one is based around Bikes; lots of bikes. Second is the Devastator Centurion deathstar.

My best suggestion for you, for now, is to proxy some Centurions for a few games to see how they work out for you. Something like the following:

Tigurius

Chapter Master w/ artificer armour, power fist (or thunder hammer), shield eternal

3x5 Tacticals

10 Terminators (I don't know which ones you have, but thunder hammers/storm shields are the best)

3 Devastator Centurions w/ grav cannons, omniscope

Inquisitor w/ rad grenades, psychotroke grenades, psyker, 3 servo skulls, liber heresius

Coteaz


This should be approaching 1500 points. Now, it's not a super strong list; your troops section is weak, and you have limited mobility, but you have two big threats that give you decent board control, and you only need to proxy six models. The inquisitor can scout the Terminators if he passes a ld10 test, and with prescience (from him) + hammerhand (from Coteaz) combined with the grenades, these guys can do some serious damage. Tigurius and CM go with the Centurions, with the CM up front to tank ap2 shots, and Tigerius in the back buffing them with divination powers.

In response to the
Previous post, I'l make a list of units I don't like, and and a list of units I'm interested in, and see what you guys would suggest from the list:

I like:
Stormtalon
Devestator marines
Predator
Some rhinos for transport
Centurions
Assault marines
Sternguard
Comand squad.
Land raider.
I am not interested in
TFC

the shrouded lord wrote:Hey guys, I am wondering what units you would suggest adding to my space marine army to make it more competitive, here is a list of my current army:
Fifteen tactical marines (5,5,5)
Fifteen terminators (5, 10)
Captain in power armour
Marneus calgar in power armour
librarian in terminator armour.
3 bikes.
2 ven dreadnoughts.

the shrouded lord wrote:In response to the
Previous post, I'l make a list of units I don't like, and and a list of units I'm interested in, and see what you guys would suggest from the list:

I like:
Stormtalon
Devestator marines
Predator
Some rhinos for transport
Centurions
Assault marines
Sternguard
Comand squad.
Land raider.

I’m going to assume you like the stuff you have. I’m going to suggest a themed, TAC list based on what I see here, leaving some wiggle room to personalize.

Start with a CC HQ, and an assault unit (Terminators or a command squad) and put them into a LR. This is going to be the centerpiece of your tank column.

Take two full 10 man tac squads in rhinos. My go-to squads are ML/F and MM/M. Matching combis on the sarges would be nice.

Pick 3 tanks in the HS slot that you like. At least two should be AV13 up front, but if you want one of the support ones (WW or AA) that works. Dreads can work as well. Part of the strategy to this kind of list is armor saturation.

Take a pair of stormtalons to fly air cover.

That should put you somewhere in the 1,500 to 1,750 range, depending on what options you go with.Chapter tactics should probably be iron hands. The theme is an fast moving armored fist, spearheading its way into the heart of the enemy. Everything is mechanized, fast, or flying. Other things to add:

Bikes. I like a little fast melta in my lists, this is a good place for it. They are also very competitive these days. A solid option would be to move you HQ out of the LR and onto a bike, and boost the bike squad you have up to 5 models to swap it to a troop pick.
Sternguard. They work best in a drop pod, but OK in a rhino. Keep them simple; without the pod, you aren’t guaranteed the alpha strike, so investing in combis is not a good idea.
Assault marines: not the most competitive unit, but fun, and fast enough to keep with the theme of the list.

Things not on your list, but would work:
Land Speeders. A pair of TML/HB is versatile firepower at a reasonable price.
Scouts. A 5 man sniper scout squad will free up your rhinos to move forward.

This is just me tossing ideas around over my morning coffee, The trick is to find a theme you like, and make it work.