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So back in like fifth edition a friend of mine convinced me to start making a Blood Angels army (They look really cool and have some sweet fluff) before I went off to college. However, that never quite got done, and then with 6th edition I never really finished that project. With the semester almost over I was looking to build an army over the summer and hopefully have it ready come start of the fall term. I hear there are rumors about new start set with blood angels and that possibly heralding new codex that might make them stronger after assault got all kinds of messed up. Would it be better to see if/when that comes out or just start working now? I don't think I'll be able to play much over the summer though.

Onto actual list building. My college has a fair number of regular players so I've mostly watched to try and get a feel for how 6th edition works and what might be good and so just attempted my first small list. There are a number of nid players that like to run masses of gaunts with some hive tyrants and some genestealers along with another BA player that comes sometimes, some tau, some eldar, and some IG (Asta Militarium now? ) and I swear I saw an orks player once, but haven't seen him since xD I tried to read through the forums and see what was recommended and more or less use that information to construct two lists.
I made a list for 1000 and 1500 points depending on what models I end up being able to find possibly for cheap and what I mange to end up painting. Advice and some heavy criticism would be much appreciated. Thanks!




This list I more or less got directly from the forum and think is a pretty standard "core" BA army for such a small amount of points, Not sure about what to do for psychic powers and I'm a little worried about what I'd do about flyers, but it's really hard to fit something in to deal with them at only 1000 points
At 1500 points I felt I was really able to add to the core and flesh out a list that I think would be kind of cool to play.



With this list I was able to get a dread to drop in order to try and take out AA or secure FB and attract a little more attention away from my preds, the stormraven can really help dealing with flyers and nasty MCs and the extra scout squad gives me a scoring unit to sit on objectives so I don't have to leave behind assault marines. I think there's a pretty good balance of AI with Hurricane bolter, frag, and the preds and a good bit of AV with meltas on the marines, the dread, and the MM on the stormraven. I don't really think the sergeants needed meltabombs but i didn't know where else to put the 10 points.


This was my first time working with the new edition (and practically my first time building a list) but don't hold back as I'd really like any and all criticism and other advice to make this list good. thanks!

one of blood angels main strengths is their access to fast vehicles. A vindicator is a fairly average beast, but when blood angels paint it red and make it go faster, it suddenly becomes an incredibly dangerous piece of kit, capable of moving 12" and still firing its gun.

you'll need to be clever if you're going to try and run an assault army nowadays. overwatch is a real killer if you deal with the wrong unit. if you can take some throwaway transports somehow, rhinos are good for screening units off from overwatch, so the assault marines can still be up close to the enemy but only one or two of the enemy models can see them to overwatch. this sort of tactic really takes the edge off tau gunlines and large units of guardians. the predators can do it but that starts dictating what they're aiming at for the shooting phase.

So what would suggest I cut to fit in some metal boxes? And do you think I'd have to worry about that so much at 1000 points, or would it be more of a problem to consider for when expanding to 1500 points? What about vindies? I'm not sure I'd be able to protect them with just the couple of assault squads? Should that be something to consider instead of predators or for playing around with the 1500 list?

Thanks!

Your first list looks pretty exact to my list I am running. Overwatch is a pain. You can only hope that FNP can carry you through it.

You could always drop the press and swap them for some sternguard vets in a drop pod and scouts for a back field objective. Basically your opponents target priority will end up being on them, giving you a turn or two to get your ASM into melee.

Be aware that overwatch, while possibly dangerous, shouldn't deter you from the charge. The problem is that BA have a tough time in CC AFTER the charge. Certain armies like Tau and Necrons are extraordinarily BAD targets to charge-necrons because of rapid fire or tesla shenanigans and Tau because...well Tau lol! Once you get stuck in combat you need a way to get "unstuck", and that's where your vehicles come in. Such is my experience anyway. I run a squad of ten tactical marines (plasma, missile launcher and the sergeant has a combiplasma) and put Brother Corbulo in. This squads sole purpose is to provide fire support for the assault marines. Corbulo tanks all of the wounds, and the rapid fire bolter/plasma can really help loosen up a CC fight.

Tanks can help here too. BA are about tactics and bringing a lot of pain on single targets. Take one unit at a time if you can, it has worked wonders for me, but winning any battle will be very uphill so be careful and you should have a lot of fun!

And bring Corbulo. He is worth his weight in gold for the stupid amount of wounds he can tank

I'm afraid if I cut the preds from the 1000 point army I won't have anything with even a chance to take down any flyers I run into. The weight of fire and rending iirc from the preds seem like a good way to have something against a small amount of flyers I might see while still being strong even if there aren't flyers. Do you think those would be enough of a nonissue to cut to the preds and through something else in?

As for Corb, I freaking love him, his soaking is incredibly, however, I didn't feel like I had the points to fit him into the 1000, I considered him for the 1500, but again, he can't jump pack, and i'm really not a fan of tacs (they seem really overcosted for BA). Which means the only place for him would be with something getting dropped/landraidered and at that few points that also seemed troublesome. at 1500 points not having corb, a squad, and a raven on board turn 2 would pretty much mean imminent defeat since so much of my army would be offboard. I considered him maybe with a drop of sternguard, to let them possibly make it past the turn they drop in and alphastrike something, but then I'm left with just preds and the flyer for army, which probably I think makes AV targetting pretty easy as the stormraven doesnt come in until turn 2 or 3. Are those concerns reasonable or how should I build to not only have a couple easy to crack vehicles?

Taldrakkan wrote:
I'm afraid if I cut the preds from the 1000 point army I won't have anything with even a chance to take down any flyers I run into. The weight of fire and rending iirc from the preds seem like a good way to have something against a small amount of flyers I might see while still being strong even if there aren't flyers. Do you think those would be enough of a nonissue to cut to the preds and through something else in?

As for Corb, I freaking love him, his soaking is incredibly, however, I didn't feel like I had the points to fit him into the 1000, I considered him for the 1500, but again, he can't jump pack, and i'm really not a fan of tacs (they seem really overcosted for BA). Which means the only place for him would be with something getting dropped/landraidered and at that few points that also seemed troublesome. at 1500 points not having corb, a squad, and a raven on board turn 2 would pretty much mean imminent defeat since so much of my army would be offboard. I considered him maybe with a drop of sternguard, to let them possibly make it past the turn they drop in and alphastrike something, but then I'm left with just preds and the flyer for army, which probably I think makes AV targetting pretty easy as the stormraven doesnt come in until turn 2 or 3. Are those concerns reasonable or how should I build to not only have a couple easy to crack vehicles?

Your concerns are totally legit! BA are a tough list to build. Their principle problem is bloated points cost so it makes tailoring a list tough at best. No matter what you do, victory is tough to achieve because every unit you lose hurts so much more than other armies. There is little margin for error with them which is honestly why I love them so much

Tactical Marines are a hotbutton topic where BA are concerned. On the one hand they cost way to much for what you get, but on the other hand they can make for a pretty reliable anvil when teamed with Corbulo. Your list is pretty good, but I was just sharing what works for me. My assault marines are vicious on the charge, but then after they lack any kind of true killing power. Chainswords just don't do enough damage. But with a squad of tactical marines shooting into the fray, it can tip the tide and give you a fighting chance.

Wait how are you shooting into a combat? aren't you not allowed to shoot into an active combat? I thought that was part of the point of getting locked into combat? (I'm still kind of learning rules? xD)

Just checked the BRB to be sure and I see nothing that says that a squad of tactical marines cannot shoot into a battle between two units assaulting each other. The units locked in CC cannot shoot each other, but a third unit can certainly shoot in based on what I see.

Don't have the page, but pretty sure you've never been able to fire into an existing combat in 40K, the thought being the risk of hitting your own men is too high... Unless your Inquisitor Karamazov! The trick is declare the charge with the tactical, they suffer the overwatch, then charge in with your assault squad unscathed!

Hmmmm. I don't see anything in the shooting phase section under choose a target? You'd think something like that would be in there...

Dagger wrote:
Don't have the page, but pretty sure you've never been able to fire into an existing combat in 40K, the thought being the risk of hitting your own men is too high... Unless your Inquisitor Karamazov! The trick is declare the charge with the tactical, they suffer the overwatch, then charge in with your assault squad unscathed!

The problem is they get to choose when to overwatch, so they can choose to let your crappy tac marines get in and then overwatch the assault, besides, for the same amount of points that tac squad could be an assault squad that would do a fair bit more in that combat than a tac would.

 Murdius Maximus wrote:
Just checked the BRB to be sure and I see nothing that says that a squad of tactical marines cannot shoot into a battle between two units assaulting each other. The units locked in CC cannot shoot each other, but a third unit can certainly shoot in based on what I see.

pg 28 bottom right "shooting into and out of close combat"

paraphrased, it essentially says "no."

Our group DOES house-rule you to be able to fire into combats that don't involve any of your units, like say...in a multiplayer game.

As far as BA are concerned, I would almost never take a tactical marine over an assault marine. I would have to know before list-writing that I was going to be in a scenario specifically as a defender to even think about them.

CURSES! thanks for the tune up man! Darn page 28 gets me every time lol!

What this means to the OP? Ignore my comment about shooting into combat because I'm evidently the worst reader ever. Sorry for the bad info, I'm going to go iron my hands now

Do not use a Drop Pod for your dread. It will make it a huge target for you enemy and most likely give first kill to them. Put Talons on the dread too. Use the Stormraven to bring it in. Move the Stormraven(when it becomes available)in toward a point of your enemy's army that you would like the dread to assault. Then in the next turn, drop drop off the dread so he can do what he does best. Drop Pods let the dread be a huge target be cause they cannot assault when they come in. Unless you are using a Lucious pattern one where you can assault out of it. The Stormraven can also carry your infantry across the board and assault from it too. Up to 12 models.

Remember that no transport can move over 6" to let anyone out too. Except the Lucious pattern Drop Pod. The Lucious pattern Drop Pod a FW piece and you should ask for your opponents permission before using it. And it's only 50 points. Does not come with a gun but will let you assault out of it when it comes in. I'll take that trade off.

Good luck

Gundor2 wrote:
Do not use a Drop Pod for your dread. It will make it a huge target for you enemy and most likely give first kill to them.

I'm pretty sure the goal of the dread is to drop in and blow something up and then become a bulletmagnet. It seems like a staple in a lot of lists as it takes a lot of fire and with front 13 armor if your opponent doesnt move around to flank the dread will soak a good bit of damage. Furthermore, I'm pretty sure the goal is to use it to try and get first blood with it before it dies. with melta/frag it has a pretty decent chance to take something out and set up for the rest of your army.

Taldrakkan wrote:
I'm pretty sure the goal of the dread is to drop in and blow something up and then become a bulletmagnet. It seems like a staple in a lot of lists as it takes a lot of fire and with front 13 armor if your opponent doesnt move around to flank the dread will soak a good bit of damage. Furthermore, I'm pretty sure the goal is to use it to try and get first blood with it before it dies. with melta/frag it has a pretty decent chance to take something out and set up for the rest of your army.

There are plenty of armies that will take care of it in their first turn. Melta, plas, lance weapons,...etc will all do that job. A "decent chance" is not good enough. Also it's a lot of points to sacrifice getting first kill. But get a Talon dread in combat and watch the sparks fly. Don't let it become a "bulletmagnet" or "meltamagnet" or any other type. Get it in were it can do it's job. Even in hand-to-hand, marines can't touch it with krak grenades. They would have to have a PF or something else to take it down.

I have played BA since 3rd ed. A Talon dread with a Lucious pattern Drop Pod is hands down the best way to go.

Gundor2 wrote:
Do not use a Drop Pod for your dread. It will make it a huge target for you enemy and most likely give first kill to them. Put Talons on the dread too. Use the Stormraven to bring it in. Move the Stormraven(when it becomes available)in toward a point of your enemy's army that you would like the dread to assault. Then in the next turn, drop drop off the dread so he can do what he does best. Drop Pods let the dread be a huge target be cause they cannot assault when they come in. Unless you are using a Lucious pattern one where you can assault out of it. The Stormraven can also carry your infantry across the board and assault from it too. Up to 12 models.

Remember that no transport can move over 6" to let anyone out too. Except the Lucious pattern Drop Pod. The Lucious pattern Drop Pod a FW piece and you should ask for your opponents permission before using it. And it's only 50 points. Does not come with a gun but will let you assault out of it when it comes in. I'll take that trade off.

Good luck

So let me get this straight.
Your idea is that instead of getting on the table on turn 1, you should go on Raven which come at turn 2 (earliest!), drop off of it and get to CC.
You have two choices:
1. drop the Dreadnought and wait one turn chilling around. The enemy will still shoot at you and this time you might actually die because of scattering (compared to Drop Pod). A bad idea, right?
Well it's not as bad as the second choice:
2. Hovering. Seriously, hovering.
Not a good plan. You do realise that your 200pts model will be nothing but an expensive Drop Pod if you inted to hover it? It's not resilent enough and a single Lascannon will most likely damage it or even destroy if it doesn't fly.

It's much more efficent to drop a Fragioso Dreadnought (Frag Cannon) on turn one. Play it well and it will give you First Blood with a snap of your fingers.
Been there, seen several times how it works. Drop it in the flank so that you will get the AV13 facing against the enemy and then burn the enemy infantry.

If you get to use the Lucius pattern, the dual Talon/Fist version comes useful enough.

 soomemafia wrote:
So let me get this straight.
Your idea is that instead of getting on the table on turn 1, you should go on Raven which come at turn 2 (earliest!), drop off of it and get to CC.
You have two choices:
1. drop the Dreadnought and wait one turn chilling around. The enemy will still shoot at you and this time you might actually die because of scattering (compared to Drop Pod). A bad idea, right?
Well it's not as bad as the second choice:
2. Hovering. Seriously, hovering.
Not a good plan. You do realise that your 200pts model will be nothing but an expensive Drop Pod if you inted to hover it? It's not resilent enough and a single Lascannon will most likely damage it or even destroy if it doesn't fly.

It's much more efficent to drop a Fragioso Dreadnought (Frag Cannon) on turn one. Play it well and it will give you First Blood with a snap of your fingers.
Been there, seen several times how it works. Drop it in the flank so that you will get the AV13 facing against the enemy and then burn the enemy infantry.

If you get to use the Lucius pattern, the dual Talon/Fist version comes useful enough.

I have hovered my Stormraven many times and have/haven't lost it. It's also positioning it to get cover from terrain and using target priority when it comes in so it doesn't get shot when it hovers. That way I can take off and fire at normal BS because I didn't use the Jink save.

Give me a percentage of how many times that works. Drop Pod are certain death most times for anything that comes out of them unless you have mutiples coming down at one time. A fragdread won't "with a snap of your fingers" give you first kill.

Lucious pattern is the only way to go if you want to use a Drop Pod for a dread of any kind.

Funny, it does so to me.
It's the same thing with positioning, I won't be giving away first blood if I bother to use my brains and won't drop next to the closest meltagun.

Most of the armies have infantry units with low to mid S guns and need of a cover save.
Those are my targets.
What are you going to do? Kill me with Pulse Rifles? Shoot a single ML at me?

Fragiosos have worked on me countless of times, being much more efficent than few CC attacks from a machine that's purpose is sucking up heavy fire that would otherwise execute your infantry with no hope for armor/FnP.

 soomemafia wrote:
Funny, it does so to me.
It's the same thing with positioning, I won't be giving away first blood if I bother to use my brains and won't drop next to the closest meltagun.

See now you're just trying to be insulting and I refuse to argue with a child. Think what you like. I don't really care.

This post is about helping someone else out not seeing who is right on this.

Sorry that this took over your post Taldrakken. I won't let this happen again from me. Can't say otherwise from others.

IF wanting to go as 'competitive' as possible with BA:
- libby or mephy for hq.
- podded furioso, corbs if taking a squad you want to keep alive such as sternies or assault termis, sternies, assault termis and priests for elites.
- assault squad for troops, pick jps, pods, razors, LRs depending on your playstyle, maybe a backfield sniper scout unit for scoring.
- baals, speeders, mm assault bikes for FA.
- vindis for HS. Ravens are a MUST for AA.

Anything else and you won't give yourself the best chance possible.

Poly Ranger wrote:
IF wanting to go as 'competitive' as possible with BA:
- libby or mephy for hq.
- podded furioso, corbs if taking a squad you want to keep alive such as sternies or assault termis, sternies, assault termis and priests for elites.
- assault squad for troops, pick jps, pods, razors, LRs depending on your playstyle, maybe a backfield sniper scout unit for scoring.
- baals, speeders, mm assault bikes for FA.
- vindis for HS. Ravens are a MUST for AA.

Anything else and you won't give yourself the best chance possible.

Okay, that's basically what I built and was thinking. I reaaallly wish I could take corb and meph, oh gosh it's so strong, but the points don't allow. I'm glad I learned about fast vindicators though, that's a really interesting way to place cheap Major threats that if well positioned can probably get off at least 1 attack or take a good amount of fire with ac 13? (don't have my dex on campus) and possibly cover? mmmm, they're so cheap too!

A good tactic with the vindis is to run a couple down a flank with a rhino in a line. The rhino and a board edge protects their side armour for turn 1 or 2. This is nice as getting a 24" weapon into play will often give away side armour shots.
They WILL attract the majority of your opponents AT. Use them in conjunction with flamestorm baals (as they can do serious damage in 1 turn), mephiston or any form of landraider with a good assault unit inside. Hopefully the av13 will help them absorb plenty of the opposing firepower, keeping alive the rest of the units your opponent really should be firing his AT weapons at.
Lastly, remember a 4+ cover save is a 4+ cover save. In other words, if you get 6 models under your blast, don't be disappointed when only 2 or 3 die.

Gundor2 wrote:
See now you're just trying to be insulting and I refuse to argue with a child. Think what you like. I don't really care.

Oh, calling me a child? Productive and original, I like it.

This post is about helping someone else out not seeing who is right on this.

And I'm trying to by giving him advice. My advice is to use Fragnought in Drop Pod because it works.

Sorry that this took over your post Taldrakken. I won't let this happen again from me. Can't say otherwise from others.

Oh, real mature here.

You seem to be missing something. The fact is that we are both parts of this conversation.
When you recommend using Furioso in Raven with Blood Talons, it's "giving advice".
When I recommend using Furioso in Drop Pod with Frag Cannon, it suddenly becomes "childish arguing about who's right".

You'll of course blame me for arguing now, but you were the first to cross that line. All my posts before this one were related to the OP and had nothing to do with figting, I was merely pointing out the option I have found better.
I am sorry if that differs from your idea of how to use Furioso. That is not however personal issue and therefore not worth fighting for.

Edit: correcting typos.