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So if this rumor about skimmers not getting a default 5+ jink save while moving, but instead allowed to choose to get a 4+ default jink save by eschewing their shooting after having moved ....if this is true, I will be happy from a gameplay balance perspective.

Yes, it will nerf Landspeeders, Vypers and Piranhas, but come on. A Land Speeder armed with dual Multi Meltas can deepstrike AND fire both weapons AND at normal BS as well, so please dont call it a waste of points. And the Vyper improved immensely compared to previous codex for gaining BS4 instead of BS3, and with the new snapshot ruling only being -2 to BS, a BS2 Vyper with 4+ jink is at least as good as a BS3 Vyper with 5+ jink used to be during early 6th ed with the old Eldar codex.

And the Piranha? The Piranha is the most undercosted transport in the game. Coming with 2 drones (24 points), the AV11 skimmer itself costs a laughable 16 points, so it can handle a nerf.

Let's move on to tanks, shall we?

Take a look at the Predator Annihilator. 13/11/10, 1 TL-LC, and 2 sponson LCs.145 points. That is 15 points costlier than a 5 man Devastator squad with 4 Lascannons. Now take a look at the Hammerhead. 13/12/10, 1 Railgun w. submunitions, TL-SMS. 130 points.

Saying the Hammerhead is undercosted is an understatement. Not only does it have better firepower (AP1, longer range, doesnt have to worry about a sponson not having LoS that would otherwise cut its AT firepower by a third; or reduce its AT firepower by two thirds if it moves; submunition large blast for anti-infantry and even more dakka from the TL-SMS) and the mobility advantages of a skimmer (ignres terrain features and doesnt have to drive around it), but with a disruption pod it costs just as much as the Predator Annihilator but now has a 4+ cover save whenever it moves. That's insane. For a Predator to even get a 5+ cover save in the open once per game, it has to sacrifice all of its firepower. And unlike the Hammerhead it also doesnt gain bonuses by being "hull down" behind an ADL either (HH behind ADL is 3+ if it keeps moving sideways, otherwise 4+ if stationary).


And let me not even get started on the Wave Serpent.

The Wave Serpent was desperately in need of attention but I am not currently sure it was needed for all skimmers?

Im thinking it will be interesting.

First thought is its a buff for the Piranha since its a 3+ save with D-pods and marker lights are a thing.

Also potentially DA/imperium with there shrouding land speeders followed by other fast skimmers making for a bunch of 2+ covers saves hovering around being all annoying like.

Though since ignore cover is unclear i dont know yet.

Everyone keeps saying its a buff to tau vehicles because of markerlights. Its a nerf, because now we need more markerlights for more units, which means less units that actually do damage.

Any player with half a brain will target markerlight units instantly. Unless i hide them thus not use them, i rarely have more than a random ML left after turn2. I dont want to buff piranhas with markers, i want to buff my suits/hammerheads.

Markerlights are not cheap. And everyone seems to assume we'll just magically have enough to support the entire army instead of half like before, since we bank on certain units not needing it to be valuable so we can bring less lights. In a 2k points game i usually have ~20 markerlight sources, mostly in pathfinder units or marker drones. Tallied up, thats around 300pts in marker support alone, not including the other things that go with it such as the Mark'O commander or the vehicle upgrade of the skyray. And dont forget theyre Heavy, so pathfinders snapfire when they move, and my skyray isnt Fast so i only get to fire one if i move 6" at BS4, other at BS1 (2 if snapfire rumors are true). I usually get one use out of pathfinders unless i get lucky as hell with cover saves since they cant jump away like the drones, but cost significantly less.

If the -2BS snapfiring ruling is true, it's not really that much of a nerf for Necron skimmers, particularly the Anh. Barge, which hits 3-6 or more times snapfiring anyway. Durability is slightly increased.

When this new jink save is taken- either you're jinking hits (which is how flyers work now, and makes more sense practically) or you're jinking the pens/glances- is something I'm pretty curious to know right now.

1 markerlight costs 12 points. whether it is on a pathfinder with BS3 or on a marker drone with BS2 that has T4, I4, can move and fire it, and can JSJ on top of all this.

you get a body in addition to the light. no seriously, markerlight spam is ridiculously cheap.

11pts pathfinder, 14pts drone. Pathfinders are T3 5+ save with no cover benefits (which is odd, the model gives me the impression of Stealth...was kinda surprised when i finally got a rulebook for my 2nd army and saw they lacked it) so they die if you even look at them, and drones are only better because they can hide from most weaponfire barring bad jump dice. 4+ armor means almost nothing these days.

Yes, its technically a low cost model. Who cares when it dies almost instantly? I have brutally punished players for not focusing firing my markerlights to hell and back, and they dont take much to do that lol.

EDIT: Ok 12pts drone if you buy them on a suit or FW shas'ui. But then you lose gun drones, shield drones, or are also factoring in the cost of the unit theyre attached to.

you can always have a commander with PEN and 3 crisis suits hang back with 6 missile launchers and 8 marker drones and a drone controller upgrade on the commander will make all those drones BS5.

Have fun JSJ-ing raining 8 markerlight tokens at BS5 and 12 S7 AP4 shots re-rolling hits and ignores cover and re-roll armor pens at the enemy upto 36" away while the markerlights can be used by the rest of your army to deleted said target unit if your commander and friends do not manage to

Personally it wouldnt be too bad.

T1 Flat out close too a unit you want removed with 5 Piranha with fusion blasters. keep a markermander in a squad of some marker drones in deep strike reserves

T2 roll em in (probably good idea to take some reserve manip)
drop em near in a safe spot, mark, and remove.
they could also disembark the drones and work on two targets.

Its a huge fast unit with a 3+ cover save (if flat out bumps even more 2+)

the marker mander can get expensive, but if you forge world you could tetra which might also be interesting.

But ether way still just speculation.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/594815.page

Well, my Ghost Arks are going to be flat-outing all over the place - 3++, thanks ;D

 Sigvatr wrote:
Well, my Ghost Arks are going to be turbo-boosting all over the place - 3++, thanks ;D

you mean flat outing? ^^

 Sir Arun wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
Well, my Ghost Arks are going to be turbo-boosting all over the place - 3++, thanks ;D

you mean flat outing? ^^

Meh, semantics!

While AB are getting slightly nerfed, GA get a pretty good buff. Higher overall resistance vs. damage for vehicles and it still is a AV 13/13/11 vehicle with a 3++ and 4 HP. Not too shabby. And it's even scoring now. Hogging those objectives like a baws.