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Except it's the legal system which accounts for most of the cost. And seeing as about 120 people have been freed from death row in the last 10 years due to the fact that they were innocent, it might not be in the best interests of justice to make is easier to kill people. Also I will say again as people are clearly trying to dance around it: A fourteen year old does not have to reasoning capacity as an adult. The area of the brain (frontal lobe) which allows one to control their temper and not be blinded by rage does not fully develop until one is in their late teens/ early twenties. Yes the kid should be punished. But all killing him does is punish those around him. You know, his parents, siblings, friends, cousins, teachers, etc. I love how people use the phrase "future victims" as though it is set in stone that this kid is a cold blooded murderer and will certainly kill again. This kid might be able put his life back together. It doesn't matter if he deserves it or not. Give his a chance, clearly the judge thought he deserved it. Maybe he knew something we don't about the kid.

BloodofOrks wrote:Except it's the legal system which accounts for most of the cost. And seeing as about 120 people have been freed from death row in the last 10 years due to the fact that they were innocent, it might not be in the best interests of justice to make is easier to kill people. Also I will say again as people are clearly trying to dance around it: A fourteen year old does not have to reasoning capacity as an adult. The area of the brain (frontal lobe) which allows one to control their temper and not be blinded by rage does not fully develop until one is in their late teens/ early twenties. Yes the kid should be punished. But all killing him does is punish those around him. You know, his parents, siblings, friends, cousins, teachers, etc. I love how people use the phrase "future victims" as though it is set in stone that this kid is a cold blooded murderer and will certainly kill again. This kid might be able put his life back together. It doesn't matter if he deserves it or not. Give his a chance, clearly the judge thought he deserved it. Maybe he knew something we don't about the kid.

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Stop the scientific BS please. What it is to be a human no matter what age ? Its choices.

Will the 14 year old kill knowing perfectly well he'll pay with his life in return? Doubt it.

I have no idea how old you are, or how long has it been since you were 14 that you forget what its like.
But trust me , 14 or 12 , we arnt as stupid as you remembered.

Lets talk about human kindness , lets talk about the so called humanity , lets talk about choices.

Do you think someone that has taken away another's life have the right to that humanity?

The moment he denied the victim's choice to live = the moment he lost his own.

What saddens me the most are the people that protects that type , give them a few years in juvenille and think its all good and done.
( nice slap on the wrist )

I like how BoO's logical resources and citations are met only with emotional hostility by the opposition. Even though the opposition has no personal stake in the matter. It's odd.

The U.S. is the last Western country to still have the death penalty. It's funny when you see maps like this and see that the only other countries with it are in the middle east, parts of africa, and SE asia.

LunaHound wrote:

BloodofOrks wrote:Except it's the legal system which accounts for most of the cost. And seeing as about 120 people have been freed from death row in the last 10 years due to the fact that they were innocent, it might not be in the best interests of justice to make is easier to kill people. Also I will say again as people are clearly trying to dance around it: A fourteen year old does not have to reasoning capacity as an adult. The area of the brain (frontal lobe) which allows one to control their temper and not be blinded by rage does not fully develop until one is in their late teens/ early twenties. Yes the kid should be punished. But all killing him does is punish those around him. You know, his parents, siblings, friends, cousins, teachers, etc. I love how people use the phrase "future victims" as though it is set in stone that this kid is a cold blooded murderer and will certainly kill again. This kid might be able put his life back together. It doesn't matter if he deserves it or not. Give his a chance, clearly the judge thought he deserved it. Maybe he knew something we don't about the kid.

\


Stop the scientific BS please. What it is to be a human no matter what age ? Its choices.

Will the 14 year old kill knowing perfectly well he'll pay with his life in return? Doubt it.

I have no idea how old you are, or how long has it been since you were 14 that you forget what its like.
But trust me , 14 or 12 , we arnt as stupid as you remembered.


Lets talk about human kindness , lets talk about the so called humanity , lets talk about choices.

Do you think someone that has taken away another's life have the right to that humanity?

The moment he denied the victim's choice to live = the moment he lost his own.

What saddens me the most are the people that protects that type , give them a few years in juvenille and think its all good and done.
( nice slap on the wrist )

QFT Luna i couldnt agree more. Well said.

stonefox wrote:I like how BoO's logical resources and citations are met only with emotional hostility by the opposition. Even though the opposition has no personal stake in the matter. It's odd.

The U.S. is the last Western country to still have the death penalty. It's funny when you see maps like this and see that the only other countries with it are in the middle east, parts of africa, and SE asia.

Oh i know this is for me

Where is the emotional hostility? Its a legit question isnt it?

How long has it been since you are 14 that you guys assume they arnt capable of making a simple choice?
A simple choice that was lead astray from leniency , simple choice:

If you kill someone you get the 2 outcome :

a) pay with your life

b) get locked in juvie for awhile.

Please , you are telling me14 year olds are not capable of seeing the difference between the 2 effecting the out come?

stonefox wrote:I like how BoO's logical resources and citations are met only with emotional hostility by the opposition. Even though the opposition has no personal stake in the matter. It's odd.

Avoid the seal hunt thread.

stonefox wrote:I like how BoO's logical resources and citations are met only with emotional hostility by the opposition. Even though the opposition has no personal stake in the matter. It's odd.

The U.S. is the last Western country to still have the death penalty. It's funny when you see maps like this and see that the only other countries with it are in the middle east, parts of africa, and SE asia.

Facts? the only facts he provided were from some random surveys about the death penaility. Heres a fun fact. 99% of all statistics can be made to say whatever you want.

That gak about the frontal lobe. Give me a break. Every single 14 year old knows that killing is the most horrific crime someone can commit. He wasnt 6 years old. He knows santa isnt real. Stop cutting this kid so much slack.

brad3104 wrote:

stonefox wrote:I like how BoO's logical resources and citations are met only with emotional hostility by the opposition. Even though the opposition has no personal stake in the matter. It's odd.

The U.S. is the last Western country to still have the death penalty. It's funny when you see maps like this and see that the only other countries with it are in the middle east, parts of africa, and SE asia.

Facts? the only facts he provided were from some random surveys about the death penaility. Heres a fun fact. 99% of all statistics can be made to say whatever you want.

That gak about the frontal lobe. Give me a break. Every single 14 year old knows that killing is the most horrific crime someone can commit. He wasnt 6 years old. He knows santa isnt real. Stop cutting this kid so much slack.

Well brad , according to statistics dogs have the intelligence around of an infants. And i know my dog will not go bite someone to death just for stealing his ball.
Some how the statistic is telling me my dog is smarter than the said 14 year old?

You are right , statistics are awful arnt they :"P

Lol yes they are awful

Yes the kid should be punished. But all killing him does is punish those around him. You know, his parents, siblings, friends, cousins, teachers, etc.

Then maybe they should have done a better job of instilling in him the social virtue that murder is wrong?

Well brad , according to statistics dogs have the intelligence around of an infants. And i know my dog will not go bite someone to death just for stealing his ball.
Some how the statistic is telling me my dog is smarter than the said 14 year old?

If my dog killed someone it would be put down at the soonest possible moment. If it bites somone twice it gets put down, if it harms some one twice it gets put down. No one really cares that the dog could possibly be rehabilitated. They are shot anyway.

Then maybe they should have done a better job of instilling in him the social virtue that murder is wrong?

Wait are you saying their suffering doesn't matter because they are somehow responsible for their family member's actions? So if my older brother were to be arrested for killing someone it's somehow my fault as well? I'm calling BS on that. The humiliation, shame and social isolation family members of criminals have to live through often tears families and lives apart. Punishing them further by then killing the person whom they still love (presumably) is just insult to injury. I brought it up because of the frequent argument about the affects of murder on the victim's family. It's awful don't get me wrong, but most people are happily oblivious to the suffering of the families of the accused. Seriously this is not guilt by association, it's punishment by association. Their is enough suffering in the world. To wish more on those who simply happen to be close to someone who commits a crime (or to demean the suffering they already experience) is needlessly cruel.

Oh please. They're not being materially harmed. The law can't bend over for people having their feelings hurt.

The friends and family of both parties are irrelevant, really. Is it more acceptable to murder an orphan? Of course not. Nor should an orphan get more of a sentence if they're the murderer. It needs to be between the criminal, the victim, and law.

Consider the friends and family of the criminal another victim of the criminal's acts, if you wish. It's the criminal's actions that brought down harm to the criminal. The law only reacted in the manner it must. If the family can't see that it's their problem.

Wait are you saying their suffering doesn't matter because they are somehow responsible for their family member's actions?

Your right, that was kind of wrong of me.

The humiliation, shame and social isolation family members of criminals have to live through often tears families and lives apart. Punishing them further by then killing the person whom they still love (presumably) is just insult to injury.

This part is what I disagree with. It is not my fault that their son chose to beat another persons face in with a brick. It is his fault. He should have thought of the sufferring that they would go through because of his actions. In addition to the suffering of the victims family and the victim. It is not insult to injury that they are harmed by the criminals actions. It is the criminals fault, they are just the collateral.