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Frazzled wrote:Automatically Appended Next Post:

Albatross wrote:

Chrysaor686 wrote:To keep things fair (or cripple my options severely), I'll limit my videos to musicians from Kansas. The United States holds a pretty broad monopoly on music, even if the United Kingdom is responsible for starting most of it.

Actually, you have it the wrong way round. The UK has a dominant position in terms of the best bands/artists of all time, though blues and jazz are absolutely indispensable to the development of modern popular music. Even so, American music has it's roots in British Music Hall and the folk traditons of England, Ireland and Scotland.

Respectfully, Bull fu ing gak.

Without the Beetles, David Bowie, UT, and the Police, you aint got gak.

Aren't you supposed to be a mod?

Well, as long as we're being respectful - you haven't got a fething clue what you are talking about.

Ragtime, invented USA

An acculturation of several european forms, one of which being military march music that had it's roots in Britain, in addition to the aforementioned Music hall style which was direct antecedent to American vaudeville and dancehall music, from which ragtime was birthed.

Jazz invented USA

See above.

Rock n Roll invented USA

Amalgam of the various Country styles (Which have their origins in traditional English, Irish and Scots folk songs and hymns), in addition to Blues, Gospel (same) and forms directly directly birthed from jazz, such as boogie-woogie (see jazz example)

Hip Hop invented USA

Fair enough, you can have that one, Grandmaster Frazzled, if only because I can't be arsed with long and convoluted path back to English music from hip-hop.

Big Band invented USA

See Jazz

Grunge invented USA

Are you serious? Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin? Ringing any bells? Grunge was HEAVILY influenced by British music.

Blues invented USA

The spirituals and 'field hollers' from which Blues is derived have their roots in traditional British folk song and hymns (in addition to the obvious African inflence - on ALL of these styles, to be fair.) Also, there is a version of 'Champagne Charlie', a British Music Hall song, recorded by Blind Blake in 1928.

Bluegrass invented USA

Again, British traditional music.

Western invented USA (ok in defense I'm sure every country has their own country/folk music version)

See above.

Rap invented USA

Wait... You already said Hip-Hop!

Cajun / Zydeco invented USA

Well, that's a mix of French and other forms mentioned earlier, such as Blues and Country.

Boy George invented UK

He's heavily influenced by American music, most notably Motown.



Seriously, Frazzled - I write essays on this stuff more often than you clean your guns.

Albatross wrote:

Frazzled wrote:Automatically Appended Next Post:

Albatross wrote:

Chrysaor686 wrote:To keep things fair (or cripple my options severely), I'll limit my videos to musicians from Kansas. The United States holds a pretty broad monopoly on music, even if the United Kingdom is responsible for starting most of it.

Actually, you have it the wrong way round. The UK has a dominant position in terms of the best bands/artists of all time, though blues and jazz are absolutely indispensable to the development of modern popular music. Even so, American music has it's roots in British Music Hall and the folk traditons of England, Ireland and Scotland.

Respectfully, Bull fu ing gak.

Without the Beetles, David Bowie, UT, and the Police, you aint got gak.

Aren't you supposed to be a mod?

Well, as long as we're being respectful - you haven't got a fething clue what you are talking about.

Ragtime, invented USA

An acculturation of several european forms, one of which being military march music that had it's roots in Britain, in addition to the aforementioned Music hall style which was direct antecedent to American vaudeville and dancehall music, from which ragtime was birthed.

Jazz invented USA

See above.

Rock n Roll invented USA

Amalgam of the various Country styles (Which have their origins in traditional English, Irish and Scots folk songs and hymns), in addition to Blues, Gospel (same) and forms directly directly birthed from jazz, such as boogie-woogie (see jazz example)

Hip Hop invented USA

Fair enough, you can have that one, Grandmaster Frazzled, if only because I can't be arsed with long and convoluted path back to English music from hip-hop.

Big Band invented USA

See Jazz

Grunge invented USA

Are you serious? Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin? Ringing any bells? Grunge was HEAVILY influenced by British music.

Blues invented USA

The spirituals and 'field hollers' from which Blues is derived have their roots in traditional British folk song and hymns (in addition to the obvious African inflence - on ALL of these styles, to be fair.) Also, there is a version of 'Champagne Charlie', a British Music Hall song, recorded by Blind Blake in 1928.

Bluegrass invented USA

Again, British traditional music.

Western invented USA (ok in defense I'm sure every country has their own country/folk music version)

See above.

Rap invented USA

Wait... You already said Hip-Hop!

Cajun / Zydeco invented USA

Well, that's a mix of French and other forms mentioned earlier, such as Blues and Country.

Boy George invented UK

He's heavily influenced by American music, most notably Motown.



Seriously, Frazzled - I write essays on this stuff more often than you clean your guns.

Frazzled was mentioning genres invented by the US not what influenced the genres.

Cheesecat wrote:Frazzled was mentioning genres invented by the US not what influenced the genres

I said that American music has it's roots in British music and he said that was bs. I was merely demonstrating that it is, in fact, true.

Albatross wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:Frazzled was mentioning genres invented by the US not what influenced the genres

I said that American music has it's roots in British music and he said that was bs. I was merely demonstrating that it is, in fact, true.

Yeah you're right the UK has influences in almost every genre. But as mentioned before the US has invented a fair amount of genres even if they have "British" inspiration.

Frenzal Rhomb cant go past some uber bogan punk rock =)

Well, if we are now limiting it to our State I suppose from Indiana there are few.




And of course Michael Jackson is from Indiana.

Now, the one I originally wanted to post:





And how could we list influential British bands and Led Zepplin and Pink Floyd were left off the list?

Hail to the king, baby!

Cheesecat wrote:

Albatross wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:Frazzled was mentioning genres invented by the US not what influenced the genres

I said that American music has it's roots in British music and he said that was bs. I was merely demonstrating that it is, in fact, true.

Yeah you're right the UK has influences in almost every genre. But as mentioned before the US has invented a fair amount of genres even if they have "British" inspiration.

Yes. I know that. I'm studying popular music at degree-level. The USA has a rich musical history - that is not in question.

Albatross wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:

Albatross wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:Frazzled was mentioning genres invented by the US not what influenced the genres

I said that American music has it's roots in British music and he said that was bs. I was merely demonstrating that it is, in fact, true.

Yeah you're right the UK has influences in almost every genre. But as mentioned before the US has invented a fair amount of genres even if they have "British" inspiration.

Yes. I know that. I'm studying popular music at degree-level. The USA has a rich musical history - that is not in question.

Oh I know I'm just stating that I'm in agreement .

Albatross wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:Frazzled was mentioning genres invented by the US not what influenced the genres

I said that American music has it's roots in British music and he said that was bs. I was merely demonstrating that it is, in fact, true.

Blues, jazz, bluegrass, soul music came from the South and has its earliest roots in African music. The closest it came to british were the original slave ships thanks.
I forgot about Motown.

Really Brit, get it together, on the music front you invented well, nothing.

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:Frazzled was mentioning genres invented by the US not what influenced the genres

I said that American music has it's roots in British music and he said that was bs. I was merely demonstrating that it is, in fact, true.

Blues, jazz, bluegrass, soul music came from the South and has its earliest roots in African music. The closest it came to british were the original slave ships thanks.
I forgot about Motown.

Really Brit, get it together, on the music front you invented well, nothing.

Seriously Frazzled, you haven't got the faintest idea what you're talking about - I know way more about this than you do. If you'd like, I could recommend some reading on the subject. You really need to educate yourself on things before you go shooting your mouth off about them, making yourself look foolish.

Hell, even a cursory look at wikipedia will verify what I say. Taking just bluegrass as an example:

wiki wrote:Bluegrass pioneer Bill Monroe characterized the genre: "Scottish bagpipes and ole-time fiddlin'. It's Methodist and Holiness and Baptist. It's blues and jazz, and it has a high lonesome sound."

I mean, that's available for anyone to read - not even considering the vast amount of reading I've done on the subject over the past couple of years. ALL research points towards an overwhelming British influence on American music. It's not the only influence, but it is a major influence. To suggest otherwise is just ignorant. The key term is 'acculturation', the meeting of different cultures and the formation of new culture from disparate elements. British elements are key to the formation of whole swathes of American culture.

You don't like that because your a jingoist, and with that comes a certain amount of insecurity and defensiveness, but it doesn't make the facts not facts.

Really thats your best shot?

hahahahah

Yeah, good comeback, champ.

Albatross wrote:Yeah, good comeback, champ.

You started it. I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks Blues, Soul and Jazz weren't invented in the US. Remember you started this with yours snarky comment about the US. Wait you think hip hop and rap are the same? Really?

What music did the UK invent again?

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:Yeah, good comeback, champ.

You started it. I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks Blues, Soul and Jazz weren't invented in the US. Remember you started this with yours snarky comment about the US. Wait you think hip hop and rap are the same? Really?

What music did the UK invent again?

The music that directly gave birth to yours. Remember when I said that a few posts ago? I NEVER said that the British invented those genres, I said the roots of American music come from Britain. A fact. Quit crying about it, you can still hug the 'Stars and Bars' when you go to bed at night, no-ones trying to take it away from you.

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

Albatross wrote:

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:Yeah, good comeback, champ.

You started it. I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks Blues, Soul and Jazz weren't invented in the US. Remember you started this with yours snarky comment about the US. Wait you think hip hop and rap are the same? Really?

What music did the UK invent again?

The music that directly gave birth to yours. Remember when I said that a few posts ago? I NEVER said that the British invented those genres, I said the roots of American music come from Britain. A fact. Quit crying about it, you can still hug the 'Stars and Bars' when you go to bed at night, no-ones trying to take it away from you.

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

I think Frazzled just got owned. Also Blues has folk influences guess where Folk comes from.

Albatross wrote:

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:Yeah, good comeback, champ.

You started it. I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks Blues, Soul and Jazz weren't invented in the US. Remember you started this with yours snarky comment about the US. Wait you think hip hop and rap are the same? Really?

What music did the UK invent again?

The music that directly gave birth to yours. Remember when I said that a few posts ago? I NEVER said that the British invented those genres, I said the roots of American music come from Britain. A fact. Quit crying about it, you can still hug the 'Stars and Bars' when you go to bed at night, no-ones trying to take it away from you.

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

So yuou didn't actually invent any genres of music. Gotcha.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

-British drinking song from pre war. Wow that means all of...nothing.



I think Frazzled just got owned. Also Blues has folk influences guess where Folk comes from.
-Africa, Britain, France, Germany, Japan, everyfreaking where.

I restate, how many genres of music did Britain invent in the last 200 years? How many did the US invent? Ok. Thats what I thought you said.
Can we move on now and go back to the original topic?

Frazzled wrote:So yuou didn't actually invent any genres of music. Gotcha.

punk, new wave, jungle, trip-hop, drum and bass, dubstep

And influenced about 90% of rock and roll, prog rock, indy.

i cold go on.

On the flip side is Lady Gaga US or Brit? Wherever she comes from should immediately apologize to the rest of the world.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

whatwhat wrote:

Frazzled wrote:So yuou didn't actually invent any genres of music. Gotcha.

punk, new wave, jungle, trip-hop, drum and bass, dubstep

And influenced about 90% of rock and roll, prog rock, indy.

i cold go on.

Not influenced-invented.
rock n roll: US.
You're claiming new wave? Why? don't you like your country?

Genres originating in or radically developed by British musicians include blues rock, heavy metal, progressive rock, hard rock, punk rock, electric folk, folk punk, acid jazz, shoegaze, drum and bass, grime, Britpop and dubstep.

Frazzled wrote:rock n roll: US.

Ya think so? What's next are you going to try and tell us Elvis is rock and roll?

Rock and roll was absalolute shyte before britain turned it into rock music.

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:Yeah, good comeback, champ.

You started it. I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks Blues, Soul and Jazz weren't invented in the US. Remember you started this with yours snarky comment about the US. Wait you think hip hop and rap are the same? Really?

What music did the UK invent again?

The music that directly gave birth to yours. Remember when I said that a few posts ago? I NEVER said that the British invented those genres, I said the roots of American music come from Britain. A fact. Quit crying about it, you can still hug the 'Stars and Bars' when you go to bed at night, no-ones trying to take it away from you.

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

So yuou didn't actually invent any genres of music. Gotcha.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

-British drinking song from pre war. Wow that means all of...nothing.



I think Frazzled just got owned. Also Blues has folk influences guess where Folk comes from.
-Africa, Britain, France, Germany, Japan, everyfreaking where.

I restate, how many genres of music did Britain invent in the last 200 years? How many did the US invent? Ok. Thats what I thought you said.
Can we move on now and go back to the original topic?

Other than Thrash and Speed metal I don't know.

whatwhat wrote:

Frazzled wrote:rock n roll: US.

Ya think so? What's next are you going to try and tell us Elvis is rock and roll?

Rock and roll was absalolute shyte before britain turned it into rock music.

Frazzled wrote:

whatwhat wrote:

Frazzled wrote:rock n roll: US.

Ya think so? What's next are you going to try and tell us Elvis is rock and roll?

Rock and roll was absalolute shyte before britain turned it into rock music.

You wouldn't be faceplaming if you realised amount of american rocksatrs I could quote putting britiain invasion bands, yeh one in particular, up as their main influence.

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:

Frazzled wrote:

Albatross wrote:Yeah, good comeback, champ.

You started it. I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks Blues, Soul and Jazz weren't invented in the US. Remember you started this with yours snarky comment about the US. Wait you think hip hop and rap are the same? Really?

What music did the UK invent again?

The music that directly gave birth to yours. Remember when I said that a few posts ago? I NEVER said that the British invented those genres, I said the roots of American music come from Britain. A fact. Quit crying about it, you can still hug the 'Stars and Bars' when you go to bed at night, no-ones trying to take it away from you.

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

So yuou didn't actually invent any genres of music. Gotcha.

Apart from the earliest forms of popular song, the basis for literally ALL of popular music. Seriously, all of it. Please get a clue before you make yourself look even MORE foolish.

I think we've established that don't know anything about this subject. Fine, you LIKE music. That's great. I like biscuits. Doesn't mean I know anything about how they are made, their historical development or anything at all about them other than that I like them.

Incidentally, 'Star-Spangled Banner'? British tune.

-British drinking song from pre war. Wow that means all of...nothing.

Apart from the fact that the music to your national anthem was composed by an Englishman. I'm betting that bothers you more than you let on.

Mr Mystery wrote:Genres originating in or radically developed by British musicians include blues rock, heavy metal, progressive rock, hard rock, punk rock, electric folk, folk punk, acid jazz, shoegaze, drum and bass, grime, Britpop and dubstep.

Blues-rock invented by Lonnie Mack from Dearborn County, Indiana, United States, Heavy Metal invented by Blue Cheer from San Fransisco, Punk Rock originated from New York.

Merely lifting from Wiki.

I know, I really should know better.

You're right. The Brits invented everything, because some farmer sang a song back in 1750. Ok, you win.

Apart from the fact that the music to your national anthem was composed by an Englishman. I'm betting that bothers you more than you let on.

The Yellow Rose of Texas was written by a Brit. Them's fighting words boy. Whippy sticks at 10 paces!

And this one's you Whatwhat:

I'm going to pick you up on that, Cheescat. Those really only apply if your applying the concept of 'proto' to the development of a genre. That's not good musicology. If you were going to do that, then there's literally no limit to how far back you can go - I could claim that Blues is a British invention by that logic, which I AM NOT!

Cheesecat wrote:

Mr Mystery wrote:Genres originating in or radically developed by British musicians include blues rock, heavy metal, progressive rock, hard rock, punk rock, electric folk, folk punk, acid jazz, shoegaze, drum and bass, grime, Britpop and dubstep.

Blues-rock invented by Lonnie Mack from Dearborn County, Indiana, United States, Heavy Metal invented by Blue Cheer from San Fransisco, Punk Rock originated from New York.

Blues Rock perhaps. But Heavy metal and Punk, you must be kidding me. Blue Cheer? They made a song which in retrospect has been determined as heavy metal, they had nothing to do with creating the genre. That was Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath etc. And punk rock is heavily influenced by two british genrres of which it's name is made up of.