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You know at least when red dawn came out there was a lot of tension. I just don't see that with Korea really. I mean the cold war was giant! Anyboby remember the TV show Amerika?

Andrew1975 wrote:You know at least when red dawn came out there was a lot of tension. I just don't see that with Korea really. I mean the cold war was giant! Anyboby remember the TV show Amerika?

Indeed,I do...

Which is sort of what I had eluded to before,during the era in which the original Red Dawn was released the "Idea" that the Soviets (Reds,Commies...etc) were " out to get us." permiated much of the "media"...
So..even though the event's depicted in the original were some what far fetched...that "Idea" pushed them into some sort of "credible" realm.

Those same conditions simply don't exist for this film.

FITZZ wrote:

Andrew1975 wrote:You know at least when red dawn came out there was a lot of tension. I just don't see that with Korea really. I mean the cold war was giant! Anyboby remember the TV show Amerika?

Indeed,I do...

Which is sort of what I had eluded to before,during the era in which the original Red Dawn was released the "Idea" that the Soviets (Reds,Commies...etc) were " out to get us." permiated much of the "media"...
So..even though the event's depicted in the original were some what far fetched...that "Idea" pushed them into some sort of "credible" realm.

Those same conditions simply don't exist for this film.

'

Well let's face it. A lot of us would have liked to have seen what would have happened if the cold war came to fruition, just to see how it would have played out. Not saying I would have wished it to happen of been there when it did. I'm not gonna use words like cool, but it would have been interesting.

We should probably that the deity of your choice it didn't happen. But I always still wonder what if.

Andrew1975 wrote:

FITZZ wrote:

Andrew1975 wrote:You know at least when red dawn came out there was a lot of tension. I just don't see that with Korea really. I mean the cold war was giant! Anyboby remember the TV show Amerika?

Indeed,I do...

Which is sort of what I had eluded to before,during the era in which the original Red Dawn was released the "Idea" that the Soviets (Reds,Commies...etc) were " out to get us." permiated much of the "media"...
So..even though the event's depicted in the original were some what far fetched...that "Idea" pushed them into some sort of "credible" realm.

Those same conditions simply don't exist for this film.

'

Well let's face it. A lot of us would have liked to have seen what would have happened if the cold war came to fruition, just to see how it would have played out. Not saying I would have wished it to happen of been there when it did. I'm not gonna use words like cool, but it would have been interesting.

I remember watching " The Day After" ( a made for tv film from the 80's about what happens in America before,during and after a massive Soviet missle strike) when it first aired,I was like 10 or so and recall being extreamly nervous for some time after that bombs were just going to start falling from the sky and blow everything up.
Funny thing was the next day at school the teachers were openly discussing the films events in class as though they could indeed happen at any moment...doing little to alieave any of us "traumatized children" of our anxieties..

We still did duck and cover drills in grade school. I mean really?

Andrew1975 wrote:We still did duck and cover drills in grade school. I mean really?

So did we... ...It makes me laugh now when I think about it...Nuclear blast can knock buildings over like bowling pins...but you'll be perfectly safe under that pressed board desk..

it was the whole airplane crash position theory. It was an illusion of safety. "Put you head between you legs and kiss your %$$ goodbye". Remember all the cool cold war music videos?

Andrew1975 wrote:it was the whole airplane crash position theory. It was an illusion of safety. "Put you head between you legs and kiss your %$$ goodbye". Remember all the cool cold war music videos?

Exactly...no real safety at all...but...at least you didn't see the end coming.

...And Cold war music videos...man I have Genisies " Land of Confusion" video permanetly etched into my brain...along with Killing Jokes "80's",Sig Sig Sputniks " Shoot it Up" and about a hundred others...
I think my personal favorite was Time zone ( Johnny "Rotten" Lydon and Afrika Bambatia ) "World Destruction"...They had more mushroom clouds in that video than in a whole vault full of civil defense films.

I always think of "It's a mistake" by Men at work, and "If Russians love their children too" by sting

It was all either cold war or post apocalypse in the 80's.

Andrew1975 wrote:I always think of "It's a mistake" by Men at work, and "If Russians love their children too" by sting

It was all either cold war or post apocalypse in the 80's.

So true...even the poppy-est of pop music had that " They could hit the button any second" vibe...Nina..."99 Luftballons"...catchy little tune...about nuclear war.

Yeah, you just don't get that vibe from Korea.

Andrew1975 wrote:Yeah, you just don't get that vibe from Korea.

True...watching the news in the 80's,and seeing footage of Soviet Troops,one got the sense that they meant "business"...I just don't get that from footage of North Korea I see now, I mean sure,Kim Jongs got a certian " Helter Skelter" vibe...but ultimantley lacks the same " Impact" the USSR once had.

Like a lot of stories, the starting point is just a bit of fantasy you just wave over to get into the story you actually want to tell. That is, when an evil army paratroops into your school in the middle of the day, it would be wicked cool to become a partisan fighting out of the woods around home.

When I was a kid the fact that Russians couldn't just paratroop into the middle of my school didn't register as being silly. The fact that I wasn't actually American and it certainly wouldn't happen in Perth, Western Australia registered even less. What I wanted was to make believe that I could be a partisan fighter.

I grew up and came to see Red Dawn as being really silly, because the Russians could never invade the US. Some time later I sat down to watch the movie again, thinking I'd just laught at it's silliness. Which I did, because much of the movie is very silly indeed, but it isn't all silly. At the end of the day it's telling a story about partisans and because it's set in a more relateable place than where partisans might realistically fight in the next couple of decades, it lets us pretend we might be partisans one day.

Really, the enemy could be anyone, it doesn't matter. It could be aliens. It could civil war. It be the Russians again, or the Chinese, or even the North Koreans. It doesn't matter, because the point isn't pretending something like this could actually happen.

Not that I think this was ever going to be a good movie, the look of the cast in that poster makes it look like a very terrible. But I think it will be terrible for reasons that have nothing to do with the enemy being Chinese or North Korean.

sebster wrote:Like a lot of stories, the starting point is just a bit of fantasy you just wave over to get into the story you actually want to tell. That is, when an evil army paratroops into your school in the middle of the day, it would be wicked cool to become a partisan fighting out of the woods around home.

When I was a kid the fact that Russians couldn't just paratroop into the middle of my school didn't register as being silly. The fact that I wasn't actually American and it certainly wouldn't happen in Perth, Western Australia registered even less. What I wanted was to make believe that I could be a partisan fighter.

I grew up and came to see Red Dawn as being really silly, because the Russians could never invade the US. Some time later I sat down to watch the movie again, thinking I'd just laught at it's silliness. Which I did, because much of the movie is very silly indeed, but it isn't all silly. At the end of the day it's telling a story about partisans and because it's set in a more relateable place than where partisans might realistically fight in the next couple of decades, it lets us pretend we might be partisans one day.

Really, the enemy could be anyone, it doesn't matter. It could be aliens. It could civil war. It be the Russians again, or the Chinese, or even the North Koreans. It doesn't matter, because the point isn't pretending something like this could actually happen.

Not that I think this was ever going to be a good movie, the look of the cast in that poster makes it look like a very terrible. But I think it will be terrible for reasons that have nothing to do with the enemy being Chinese or North Korean.

Yeah, I agree that suspension of disbelife is a key element in most "action films" and that there were moments in the original Red Dawn that did have me thinking.." Wouldn't that be cool if..."
The fact that during the time it was released the Soviet Union Did seem like a huge threat only added to it's appeal..(IMO)...

But your correct,the "enemy" really doesn't matter much...it's the story telling and being engrossed in the action that matters.
However...I still think this films going to fall short in all departments..

FITZZ wrote: Yeah, I agree that suspension of disbelife is a key element in most "action films" and that there were moments in the original Red Dawn that did have me thinking.." Wouldn't that be cool if..."
The fact that during the time it was released the Soviet Union Did seem like a huge threat only added to it's appeal..(IMO)...

But your correct,the "enemy" really doesn't matter much...it's the story telling and being engrossed in the action that matters.
However...I still think this films going to fall short in all departments..

Oh definitely, the movie looks like a stinker.

I guess the surprise for me is that so many people didn't think "oh the USSR was never capable of that, but it doesn't matter let's get on with the make believe", but instead thought "wow, Russia really could have done this". I mean, I thought it could happen, but I was about six years old when I saw the movie.

Not that there weren't valid fears to be had, being scared about the bomb coming down was totally understandable. But being scared about Russians landing conventional troops in the US? Not so much.

It was an illusion of safety. "Put you head between you legs and kiss your %$$ goodbye".



Exactly...no real safety at all...but...at least you didn't see the end coming.

Sounds more like you would see your end going!

Well the original movie did make an attempt at explaining what happened, desperate move by a starving soviet union. Paratroops jumping out of what was thought to be commercial flights and the armies from central America coming from the south. It seamed plausible when I was 8. I'm sure the general public, even now would buy it.

Remember the cast were not the household names that many of them would become either.

Now maybe it's me, but Asians aren't as scary as the Russians were. That doesn't come out right. As an example, when the Russian commander is giving his speech in in Russian about how to defeat the partisans, his speech and language just sound intimidating. Even now that I can speak Russian it still sounds mean. But Asian languages, they always seam somewhat comic in movies. It's funny because Russian is a beautiful sounding language, but it can also sound very brutal.

Not to denigrate Asian languages, but again evil Asians in movies just don't feel evil enough...to me anyway. It may be that they are too alien for me to get any feeling from them.

Am sure there will be ex POW's from SEA/Pacific campaigns that might disagree about that Andrew

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:Am sure there will be ex POW's from SEA/Pacific campaigns that might disagree about that Andrew

My father and uncle would disagree as well.

That's fine, I was saying to me. I'm sure it's very different in a real situation, I was just referencing the movies. Russian villains in movies are better than Asian villains in my opinion. I can't really thing of a good Asian villain that was convincing. Blame it on the writers if you want.

Andrew1975 wrote:Now maybe it's me, but Asians aren't as scary as the Russians were.

They're cute, they're cuddly and they're ready to please.

sebster wrote:
There isn't actually a secret school for teaching wizards anywhere in the English countryside, afterall.

Ahh Yes there is...
http://www.ox.ac.uk/

Nicorex wrote:

sebster wrote:
There isn't actually a secret school for teaching wizards anywhere in the English countryside, afterall.

Ahh Yes there is...
http://www.ox.ac.uk/

Well played, sir, well played.