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iproxtaco wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:It is after all a "grim darkness of the far future".
Tau should be a little grimdark after all. No race is perfect and no race will just stand and let other conquer and prosper.
If Matt Ward is doing their next codex, you can expect grimdark Tau - like the Khornite knights.

They don't necessarily have to be Grimadark, the whole point of the armies existence is to be a non-grimdark force.
What's the Khornite Knights?

He was making a joke about Mat Ward being a bad codex writer...
Lets just drop it now. Too many threads have been ruined by someone raising that and this thread is a good one.

iproxtaco wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:It is after all a "grim darkness of the far future".
Tau should be a little grimdark after all. No race is perfect and no race will just stand and let other conquer and prosper.
If Matt Ward is doing their next codex, you can expect grimdark Tau - like the Khornite knights.

They don't necessarily have to be Grimadark, the whole point of the armies existence is to be a non-grimdark force.
What's the Khornite Knights?

In their naiviety they are make the everything else more grimdark. I still maintain my view that they are all brainwashed communists, but even if their not the fact that the only good race in the galaxy is in the worst position. The galaxy sees this new upstart that wants to be nice to people and wants to nom them

purplefood wrote:

iproxtaco wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:It is after all a "grim darkness of the far future".
Tau should be a little grimdark after all. No race is perfect and no race will just stand and let other conquer and prosper.
If Matt Ward is doing their next codex, you can expect grimdark Tau - like the Khornite knights.

They don't necessarily have to be Grimadark, the whole point of the armies existence is to be a non-grimdark force.
What's the Khornite Knights?

He was making a joke about Mat Ward being a bad codex writer...
Lets just drop it now. Too many threads have been ruined by someone raising that and this thread is a good one.

I see, I just don't know of anything in any of his codices which mentions Khornite Knights but I agree, lets not drag out that pointless conversation again.

iproxtaco wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:It is after all a "grim darkness of the far future".
Tau should be a little grimdark after all. No race is perfect and no race will just stand and let other conquer and prosper.
If Matt Ward is doing their next codex, you can expect grimdark Tau - like the Khornite knights.

They don't necessarily have to be Grimadark, the whole point of the armies existence is to be a non-grimdark force.
What's the Khornite Knights?

I know that, but who knows. Maybe they will, maybe they will stay the same. But I wouldn't be suprised if the ymake a Tau little darken then now, almost every army has been made.
As for Khornite Knights: http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Khornate_Knights. Matt Ward at work, next are Black Templars, then Tau or Necrons.
Emperor show mercy on them...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

purplefood wrote:
He was making a joke about Mat Ward being a bad codex writer...
Lets just drop it now. Too many threads have been ruined by someone raising that and this thread is a good one.

You are right, I will drop it from here.
I am still staying with my statement, Tau should be more darker in the new codex.

Grimtuff wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Grimtuff wrote:Although Farsight takes this too far (there were rumours floating around of him having some very... racist views when it came to the allied races, hence why he can't have them in his armies)

Actually, the reason they always talked about it was that since he's not part of the Tau's "Greater Good" he's unable to get access to the alien allies and newer tech due to the fact that he "cut communication with the Tau as a whole".

Which goes directly against the info given about the War of Dakka in the Ork dex, which is set in 815.M41, Farsight split from the Empire in 760.M41. The Tau High Command sent in reinforcements to evacuate him and his armies from the warzone.

815.M41 is the 'Descent of Grog'. It's for a very particular incident, and is in the Planetstrike book.

We don't know how long the 'War of Dakka' went on. We also do not know if that particular planet was part of the Farsight Enclaves(planet was Atari Vo).

P44 of the Tau Empire book, by the by supports my point.

Tau Empire wrote:This region has long been forbidden to the Tau, and when contact was severed between Farsight and the Tau homeworlds, it could mean only one thing. But to countenance the notion that Farsight has set up his own colonies is to accept that he has turned his back on the empire and is fighting for personal gain rather than the Greater Good.

There's also mention in there that he had an entire expedition at his disposal.

Where the idea falls apart is that the second part, 'Grog's Revenge' and 'The Kunnin' Plan' deal with things that were after the original invasion of the Tau Empire's Sept Worlds and focus solely on the invasion of the Farsight Enclaves.

Plus it uses a customarily, as we always get with Tau information, vague bit of "Tau High Command". Could it have been the Tau Empire proper? Sure.

But you're neglecting the fact that the Farsight Enclaves are heavily militarized, with production capabilities to match. A Manta Missile Destroyer is something within the realm of them building or still having from the original expedition.

Of course, my point is supposition--but with the Tau we have absolute gak to go on in regards to their culture outside of the Greater Good.

That's a link to 1d4chan, I already know that it's going to be a bunch of bull. Stop now though, this thread is about Tau, not the mis-conceptions people pick up due to Hyperbole and the idiotic idea that 1d4chan is a basis of clear opinion.

I would actually be surprised if they darkened them down, it's be a contradiction to the original designers notes, despite the fact that it would be a logical step in their background.

Kanluwen wrote:

Grimtuff wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Grimtuff wrote:Although Farsight takes this too far (there were rumours floating around of him having some very... racist views when it came to the allied races, hence why he can't have them in his armies)

Actually, the reason they always talked about it was that since he's not part of the Tau's "Greater Good" he's unable to get access to the alien allies and newer tech due to the fact that he "cut communication with the Tau as a whole".

Which goes directly against the info given about the War of Dakka in the Ork dex, which is set in 815.M41, Farsight split from the Empire in 760.M41. The Tau High Command sent in reinforcements to evacuate him and his armies from the warzone.

815.M41 is the 'Descent of Grog'. It's for a very particular incident, and is in the Planetstrike book.

We don't know how long the 'War of Dakka' went on. We also do not know if that particular planet was part of the Farsight Enclaves(planet was Atari Vo).

P44 of the Tau Empire book, by the by supports my point.

Tau Empire wrote:This region has long been forbidden to the Tau, and when contact was severed between Farsight and the Tau homeworlds, it could mean only one thing. But to countenance the notion that Farsight has set up his own colonies is to accept that he has turned his back on the empire and is fighting for personal gain rather than the Greater Good.

There's also mention in there that he had an entire expedition at his disposal.

Where the idea falls apart is that the second part, 'Grog's Revenge' and 'The Kunnin' Plan' deal with things that were after the original invasion of the Tau Empire's Sept Worlds and focus solely on the invasion of the Farsight Enclaves.

Plus it uses a customarily, as we always get with Tau information, vague bit of "Tau High Command". Could it have been the Tau Empire proper? Sure.

But you're neglecting the fact that the Farsight Enclaves are heavily militarized, with production capabilities to match. A Manta Missile Destroyer is something within the realm of them building or still having from the original expedition.

Of course, my point is supposition--but with the Tau we have absolute gak to go on in regards to their culture outside of the Greater Good.

And that is what makes Farsight so good compared to say, Draigo. We know next to nothing about him and his associates, which is what make him so compelling. I was under the impression that Farsight has no contact with the Empire until reading the War of Dakka story, which throws a bits of a spanner in the works WRT their established background.

Kelly seems to do it a lot, even within his own codexes, check out the stuff for Lady Malys. Either there's some timey-wimey stuff going on in the Webway or she's older than Kelly says she is. She is alive when Vect comes to power in M35, yet is described as being "Less than 1000 years old".

Nicholas wrote:

iproxtaco wrote:

Brother Coa wrote:It is after all a "grim darkness of the far future".
Tau should be a little grimdark after all. No race is perfect and no race will just stand and let other conquer and prosper.
If Matt Ward is doing their next codex, you can expect grimdark Tau - like the Khornite knights.

They don't necessarily have to be Grimadark, the whole point of the armies existence is to be a non-grimdark force.
What's the Khornite Knights?

In their naiviety they are make the everything else more grimdark. I still maintain my view that they are all brainwashed communists, but even if their not the fact that the only good race in the galaxy is in the worst position. The galaxy sees this new upstart that wants to be nice to people and wants to nom them

That's a fairly good description of the role of the tau. (The first part anyway.) They are the foil. They are not very dark and that makes everyone else look darker. That's also why they have to avoid making the tau too dark.

Grimtuff wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Grimtuff wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Grimtuff wrote:Although Farsight takes this too far (there were rumours floating around of him having some very... racist views when it came to the allied races, hence why he can't have them in his armies)

Actually, the reason they always talked about it was that since he's not part of the Tau's "Greater Good" he's unable to get access to the alien allies and newer tech due to the fact that he "cut communication with the Tau as a whole".

Which goes directly against the info given about the War of Dakka in the Ork dex, which is set in 815.M41, Farsight split from the Empire in 760.M41. The Tau High Command sent in reinforcements to evacuate him and his armies from the warzone.

815.M41 is the 'Descent of Grog'. It's for a very particular incident, and is in the Planetstrike book.

We don't know how long the 'War of Dakka' went on. We also do not know if that particular planet was part of the Farsight Enclaves(planet was Atari Vo).

P44 of the Tau Empire book, by the by supports my point.

Tau Empire wrote:This region has long been forbidden to the Tau, and when contact was severed between Farsight and the Tau homeworlds, it could mean only one thing. But to countenance the notion that Farsight has set up his own colonies is to accept that he has turned his back on the empire and is fighting for personal gain rather than the Greater Good.

There's also mention in there that he had an entire expedition at his disposal.

Where the idea falls apart is that the second part, 'Grog's Revenge' and 'The Kunnin' Plan' deal with things that were after the original invasion of the Tau Empire's Sept Worlds and focus solely on the invasion of the Farsight Enclaves.

Plus it uses a customarily, as we always get with Tau information, vague bit of "Tau High Command". Could it have been the Tau Empire proper? Sure.

But you're neglecting the fact that the Farsight Enclaves are heavily militarized, with production capabilities to match. A Manta Missile Destroyer is something within the realm of them building or still having from the original expedition.

Of course, my point is supposition--but with the Tau we have absolute gak to go on in regards to their culture outside of the Greater Good.

And that is what makes Farsight so good compared to say, Draigo. We know next to nothing about him and his associates, which is what make him so compelling. I was under the impression that Farsight has no contact with the Empire until reading the War of Dakka story, which throws a bits of a spanner in the works WRT their established background.

Kelly seems to do it a lot, even within his own codexes, check out the stuff for Lady Malys. Either there's some timey-wimey stuff going on in the Webway or she's older than Kelly says she is. She is alive when Vect comes to power in M35, yet is described as being "Less than 1000 years old".

time flows differently in the Webway.

and that could be in Eldar years, who knows how long their home planets orbit was.

i think it would be hard to grimdark the Tau really. People seem to lack an understanding that the Tau Empire is founded on the philosophy of utilitarianism, not communism. This fundamentally prevents them from being bad guys.

Nobody knows for sure what the Farsight enclave is up to at this point and may be the best place to darken things up, possibly by adding a sense of bigotry to the tau who broke away.

As for personal speculation I think the Dawn Blade is a C'Tan phase blade and could result in the farsight enclave comming under C'Tan influence. That could make things very interesting.

mwbeardpride wrote:i think it would be hard to grimdark the Tau really. People seem to lack an understanding that the Tau Empire is founded on the philosophy of utilitarianism, not communism. This fundamentally prevents them from being bad guys.

Nobody knows for sure what the Farsight enclave is up to at this point and may be the best place to darken things up, possibly by adding a sense of bigotry to the tau who broke away.

As for personal speculation I think the Dawn Blade is a C'Tan phase blade and could result in the farsight enclave comming under C'Tan influence. That could make things very interesting.

C'tan Phase Blade? That sort of plot device would be right up there with Blood Angels/Necrons alleigances and SOB's being slaughtered by Grey Knights. So yeah, if He Who Must Not Be Named is writing Tau then prepare for dissapointment.

I can see some Craftworld Eldar - Tau relationships though. Can anyone find that quote by Eldrad Ulthran? Apparently he thinks Tau are going to take the place of the Eldar.

And as much as I hate to say it; if GW goes the same route as they will with Necrons (see rumors) then Farsight won't make even a brief appearance in the codex. How come none of you thought of that

Good thing that Phil Kelly and Robin Cruddace show some respect for current background, even when changing it. So we have a 66% chance that the background will nor be totally screwed.

Kroothawk wrote:Good thing that Phil Kelly and Robin Cruddace show some respect for current background, even when changing it. So we have a 66% chance that the background will nor be totally screwed.

Do they? Cruddace ripped the entire Hive War background a new one just to ram his "brilliant" new "Swarmy" invention into the book while Kelly turned Blood Claws into womanizing GTA-style Thunderhawk-nappers before mounting the rest of the Wolves on Thundersquirrels to fight submarine wars. And to top it off, he turned the menace that were the Dark Eldar into pitful Twilight-Emo's suddenly "evil" only to staunch their leaky souls. If either of those two have any inkling of "respect" (or even knowledge) for the background, they've failed to show it so far.

TEMPERUS MAXIMUS wrote:

mwbeardpride wrote:i think it would be hard to grimdark the Tau really. People seem to lack an understanding that the Tau Empire is founded on the philosophy of utilitarianism, not communism. This fundamentally prevents them from being bad guys.

Nobody knows for sure what the Farsight enclave is up to at this point and may be the best place to darken things up, possibly by adding a sense of bigotry to the tau who broke away.

As for personal speculation I think the Dawn Blade is a C'Tan phase blade and could result in the farsight enclave comming under C'Tan influence. That could make things very interesting.

C'tan Phase Blade? That sort of plot device would be right up there with Blood Angels/Necrons alleigances and SOB's being slaughtered by Grey Knights. So yeah, if He Who Must Not Be Named is writing Tau then prepare for dissapointment.

I can see some Craftworld Eldar - Tau relationships though. Can anyone find that quote by Eldrad Ulthran? Apparently he thinks Tau are going to take the place of the Eldar.

And as much as I hate to say it; if GW goes the same route as they will with Necrons (see rumors) then Farsight won't make even a brief appearance in the codex. How come none of you thought of that

Can you please explain how a a blade found in pre human ruins on an artifact wield that is described to cut though most enemies and vehicles with ease and flickers with an unknown power being a C'Tan phase weapon is compareable to either of the examples of Matt Ward's creation?

Also I see gw giving more individuality to the necrons from the rumors. So if the tau go the way of the necrons and other 5th edition dexs we should see an increased amount of ics.

I persoanly agree with you about the Dawn Blade. If it originates from any of the known races it makes most sense for it to be necrons. Of course it could be something we have never seen yet.

4M2A wrote:I persoanly agree with you about the Dawn Blade. If it originates from any of the known races it makes most sense for it to be necrons. Of course it could be something we have never seen yet.

Other Necron of known prehuman races we have Eldar, and Slann. It doesn't look Eldar, kinda looks Necronish and I dont belive there is a point of reference for the Slann stuff in 40k just the fantasy stuff. Them pulling something new and dark out of nowhere or never explaining it wouldn't be to unexpected.

Personally I think Tau with a C'Tan influence could be very cool and push their technology even farther. Look what it did for the Ad Mech.

The look of the Tau is pretty much the only thing that GW has gotten right for the army. I don't foresee that changing at all when their new Codex arrives.

Kilkrazy wrote:I think the Tau will become more Grimdark because that is what the kiddies want.

It will be a mistake, because all the other factions are Grimdark factions and the background needs a bit of relief. Tau are popular with Tau players because they aren't Grimdark.

GW will screw it up and Grimdarkify Tau for the kiddies.

Yeah, that is the reason I started collecting Tau. I think their non-grimdarkness is what defines them, and make a nice contrast to the setting.
I really hope they dont turn the Tau into Imperium-2-without-awesome-space-marines

Grimdark, not grimdark... don't really care, I just hope the Crisis Suits get a redesign so they don't look like fridges with legs anymore.

Kilkrazy wrote:I think the Tau will become more Grimdark because that is what the kiddies want.

It will be a mistake, because all the other factions are Grimdark factions and the background needs a bit of relief. Tau are popular with Tau players because they aren't Grimdark.

GW will screw it up and Grimdarkify Tau for the kiddies.

Correct on all levels, i fear

Maybe they can have something new like these?

They don't need a new look, just a different artist.

mega_bassist wrote:I think they'll stay more or less the same...the only problem I see them having is the Empire starting another Expansion and trying to stay connected without FTL travel...I can see the Empire failing w/o highspeed transport and it getting too large

Uh, the Tau do have FTL travel. It is just not as fast, because IIRC they sort of "bounce" their ships off of the warp instead of traveling within it.

they have FTL in the form of Warp Hopping.


its about 10 times slower then true Warp jumping.

a Tau would be lucky to live to see more then 5 or 6 jumps due to their short lives.

GalacticDefender wrote:

mega_bassist wrote:I think they'll stay more or less the same...the only problem I see them having is the Empire starting another Expansion and trying to stay connected without FTL travel...I can see the Empire failing w/o highspeed transport and it getting too large

Uh, the Tau do have FTL travel. It is just not as fast, because IIRC they sort of "bounce" their ships off of the warp instead of traveling within it.

Yes, I know about that. I meant something in comparison to what the IoM and Eldar use.

IIRC, its about 5x slower than Imperium, with the added bonuses of: A) not actually being in the warp and thus not vulnerable to Chaos, B) No arriving at your destination before you left, or a hundred years after you were supposed to arrive, and C) You don't have to sacrifice thousands of psykers to keep your space lighthouse working.

I'm sure that GW will let one of their horrible rules-writers do an even worse job at writing stories.. Would like to see some *real authors* writing the books.

It's slower, and has no where near the distance, making a larger interstellar empire nigh impossible to maintain.

Maybe GW could write in a galaxy hopping FTL drive for the next codex. That would be cool. Turn the Tau into the equivalent of pop-up ads on the Internet. Just when you least expect it, a Water Caste diplomat pops up to talk about how you could improve your lifestyle with the Greater Good.

My lord, after reading this thread, I think I will go sell my army on eBay. It seems there is no hope for the Tau.

Or preferably, I install a Deathwatch security center, and kill them before the get a chance to infect my citizens, sorry files.