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You know what Joey, I reckon you can't take it!



But you can only fight it if I can put then resultant video of you being killed to death by that thing on youtube!

AustonT wrote:Baiting is actually legal in MOST states. Montana is a rare exception wherein you MUST stalk the hunt, unless they changed or I misunderstood the FWP regulations tree stands are permitted in the off season for observation but must be down by the beginning of bow and blackpowder season.

Huh, didn't know that. To be fair, I'm not a hunter, so I really wouldn't be in a position to know. I do know that baiting is still illegal here, a guy just north of Helena got cited for it recently.

Joey wrote:According to wikipedia they weigh 53 to 100 kg. Unless it's at the upper end of that scale, I'm going to have the weight advantage, and I will definitely have the height advantage.
It's unlikely that a cougar would attack a grown man unless it was starving, in which case it'd be much weaker anyway.
But yeah I'd say I have enough upper body strength to dominate and kill one.

As has been pointed out, they rarely attack humans. Of course, anything that doesn't die or run in the first moments of a mountain lion attack stands a good chance of driving it off. But that isn't what you are talking about. You aren't talking about surviving a mountain lion attack. You are talking about attacking and killing a mountain lion with your bare hands.

Your scenario involves you, naked, in an arena with the cat (where it presumably cannot escape). Even in this scenario, with a starving cat, your odds are incredibly poor. Your musculature (even if you are an exceptionally strong human being) is structured differently than that of the cat. Whereas it can focus most or all of its strength in very small areas (like your throat and vital arteries), you cannot. It does not have to outweigh you to out-muscle you. And as pointed out, it comes with built-in flesh rending equipment. Your weight and height will make no difference, as you won't be the one leaping onto your opponent and tearing their throat out with your teeth.

Also, it will be a great deal faster than you.

If you do not use what makes human beings dangerous, you stand little to no chance. If you do, then you aren't killing it with your bare hands.

Blackskullandy wrote:Why would he be kidding? I once killed a bear with mind bullets... Then i sucker punched a hyena to death, just for lookin' at me funny...
True story....

Ah yes, how silly of me to doubt such tales of manliness. I see now that any competent individual who looked up a brief description of the animal on wikipedia should be able to kill a mountain lion with their bare hands.

Frazzled wrote:Team wienie would still tree it. Yes wiener dogs are that vicious.

Well, they were bred as badger hunting dogs.

Badgers themselves are pretty vicious, the dogs that hunt them need to be moreso.

(family has owned one - it died from cancer. Psychotic little bastich).

IcyCool wrote:

AustonT wrote:Baiting is actually legal in MOST states. Montana is a rare exception wherein you MUST stalk the hunt, unless they changed or I misunderstood the FWP regulations tree stands are permitted in the off season for observation but must be down by the beginning of bow and blackpowder season.

Huh, didn't know that. To be fair, I'm not a hunter, so I really wouldn't be in a position to know. I do know that baiting is still illegal here, a guy just north of Helena got cited for it recently.

I'm a lifelong hunter from Elk in Ennis, deer in Galitan and Cascade counties, and Antelope in the LandC and Cascade zones. My dream is still to win the draw for a Moose tag up next to Glacier. I've hunted most fo the southern states, many of which bait, and I especially loved my time in Georgia: open season on hogs on post all year...now I'm salivating.

chromedog wrote:

Frazzled wrote:Team wienie would still tree it. Yes wiener dogs are that vicious.

Well, they were bred as badger hunting dogs.

Badgers themselves are pretty vicious, the dogs that hunt them need to be moreso.

(family has owned one - it died from cancer. Psychotic little bastich).

In fact dachshund means BADGER DOG!!!! (wuf!) lb for lb the greatest donkey-caves in the universe...

Isnt it true that a feral dachshund will take up residence in a badger den after killing the previous owner?


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or is that badgers and thier prey

IcyCool wrote:

Joey wrote:According to wikipedia they weigh 53 to 100 kg. Unless it's at the upper end of that scale, I'm going to have the weight advantage, and I will definitely have the height advantage.
It's unlikely that a cougar would attack a grown man unless it was starving, in which case it'd be much weaker anyway.
But yeah I'd say I have enough upper body strength to dominate and kill one.

As has been pointed out, they rarely attack humans. Of course, anything that doesn't die or run in the first moments of a mountain lion attack stands a good chance of driving it off. But that isn't what you are talking about. You aren't talking about surviving a mountain lion attack. You are talking about attacking and killing a mountain lion with your bare hands.

Your scenario involves you, naked, in an arena with the cat (where it presumably cannot escape). Even in this scenario, with a starving cat, your odds are incredibly poor. Your musculature (even if you are an exceptionally strong human being) is structured differently than that of the cat. Whereas it can focus most or all of its strength in very small areas (like your throat and vital arteries), you cannot. It does not have to outweigh you to out-muscle you. And as pointed out, it comes with built-in flesh rending equipment. Your weight and height will make no difference, as you won't be the one leaping onto your opponent and tearing their throat out with your teeth.

Also, it will be a great deal faster than you.

If you do not use what makes human beings dangerous, you stand little to no chance. If you do, then you aren't killing it with your bare hands.

Well I'm six foot tall, so you have something that's trying to jump six foot in the air, that weighs about the same that I do. You know what I have? Arms. I'm not exactly a body builder but if I put my weight into an elbow just as it leaded up at me, it'd be dead or stunned and easy to finish off.
And if it was a ground fight the fact that my arms are much longer and more agile than its legs would mean it wouldn't be able to do gak.
To be fair though I don't have the cardiovascular strength for a long drawn out fight, so it could ware me down.

I'm going to say with nowhere else to run it would feth your gak up.

I assume that's an adolescent? They can't all be that small.

AustonT wrote:Isnt it true that a feral dachshund will take up residence in a badger den after killing the previous owner?


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or is that badgers and thier prey

That sounds remarkably like how we got ours. They were feral, took up residence and grow when we try to get them to go outside.


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Joey wrote:I assume that's an adolescent? They can't all be that small.

Thats a young one.

I'm no expert but she seems about average. I've seen both smaller and much larger. It depends a lot on location. We are talking about a species that stretches from Canada to Mexico (granted there are several sub species) so a great deal of variation can be expected in color and size. Cougars aren't "Big Cats" in the sense that we refer to Lions and Tigers, they are more like your domestic house cat really like Ocelots, Lynx, and Bobcats (also all felines), rather than Panthers like Tigers, Leopards, Jaguars, and Lions

Frazzled is not crazy. Hybrid Alien Weiner dogs exist. They are a bit elusive though...

I knew it.

reds8n wrote:

AustonT wrote: From a bait and stand in Texas

What is this ?

Oh :

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jan/11/big-cat-gloucestershire-wood-national-trust

What i never got about that was, where do the damn things go?
I get that it's a lot of ground to cover but someone must have tracked one to a den of some kind...

Good one, Joey. It's like the times I get people worked up when I make them think I believe pro wrestling is the real deal and not coreographed.

Frazzled wrote:

AustonT wrote:Isnt it true that a feral dachshund will take up residence in a badger den after killing the previous owner?


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or is that badgers and thier prey

That sounds remarkably like how we got ours. They were feral, took up residence and grow when we try to get them to go outside.


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Joey wrote:I assume that's an adolescent? They can't all be that small.

Thats a young one.

I still saw chihuahuas are fiercer and more scary.
Just look.

Although not as much and shi tzu. Those dogs where once used for the vicious nature and small stature to protect Chinese emperors by concealing them in their sleeves.

Lord Scythican wrote:Frazzled is not crazy. Hybrid Alien Weiner dogs exist. They are a bit elusive though...

He has surveillance on us boys! er, excellent...er thats a little blurry it could be er...giraffes yes giraffes.
(pushes the RED button under the desk).


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hotsauceman1 wrote:

Frazzled wrote:

AustonT wrote:Isnt it true that a feral dachshund will take up residence in a badger den after killing the previous owner?

Crickey!!!

Frazzled wrote:
He has surveillance on us boys! er, excellent...er thats a little blurry it could be er...giraffes yes giraffes.
(pushes the RED button under the desk).

I used my CSI skills and zoomed in on my photo. I enlarged by 500% and I think you may be right. They are definitely giraffes.

AustonT wrote:
@Lone Cat
actual attacks on humans are infrequent, it doesn't mean they don't happen. Cougars are basically just very large felines, and behave accordingly. They attack and kill smaller easy prey when available and larger more dangerous game out of desperation. Humans fall into the category of both dangerous and larger, so most encounters between cougars and humans are defensive: that's why they aren't all fatal.

so as long as human doesn't harrass them first, they will not attack human. right?

Have you ever been in Ukutula (Lion conservatory of Johannesburg, South Africa) before? if so, have you ever seen any 'cougars' there?




meow.

It's like Auston says, infrequent. Sometimes a cougar will attack a human without provocation and I like keeping my kids close by when we go into the mountains around here.
There are incidents here of cougars coming down from the hills and carting off someone's pets from their yard. The last I remember hearing about is of a German Shepard that got taken by a big son of a bitch of a cougar.
I was on a land nav course with a partner at Camp Williams in Utah when we ran into a cougar that looked about 7' from snout to the tip of it's tale. Both sides jumped through their own butts to get out of the others way.

isn't there cougar conservatory anywhere in North America? aren't this felines endangered species? and does the law protects this feline being?

meow.

Around here they get hunted, I can't speak for other areas of the country.
I guess a google search could answer the question.


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Looks like there might be something in Colorado:

http://www.cougarcanyonliving.com/main/lifestyle/nature


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Doesn't seem like it's specific to cougars, though.

Mountain Lions (Cougars) are readily hunted in most of the US where they appear. They are in the conservation category "Least Concern" and have been since the categories were established. Generally speaking the Felines are pretty stable populations, where the Panthers are endangered.

I've encountered numerous big cats both mountain lions and bobcats, and its mostly the bobcats I'm wary of; mean little bastards; I think the wife will make me buy her one though...sigh.

Relapse beware the Ft Knox Land Nav course (closed for training now?) Ran into an Emu there, the guys I was with just froze when I pointed out a man sized blue bird with red eyes picking its way through the sticks, another group ran from it...Apparently unlike big cats, big birds are vicious and determined.

Auston, that warning about bobcats reminds me of some neighbors of my sisters that had moved into the Maine woods from some city in southern New England.

They told her that they'd found a kitten in the woods and brought it home. The thing was mean, though, and they were barely able to put a collar on it.
When they showed it to her, she realized she was looking at a very young Bobcat.

The section of the land nav course on camp Williams we were on was littered with deer carcasses, so we figured there was a critter about.
How did an Emu end up on the Fort Knox course? A pet or farm animal that got out?

I have no idea, I asked another NCO from who was a drill there he says there's more than one and they've been there for years.
If I had to guess...
Back in the mid 90's they were talking up Ostriches and Emus to ranchers and land owners up in Montana as a good source of red meat, something like 500lbs per Ostrich if I remember the pitch. I would guess someone bought a few Emu nearby and they either escaped or were dumped there, that are onery creatures.

AustonT wrote:Back in the mid 90's they were talking up Ostriches and Emus to ranchers and land owners up in Montana as a good source of red meat, something like 500lbs per Ostrich if I remember the pitch.

I remember that. There were a ton of people in Louisiana and East Texas that bought in. I recall seeing a number of them running around in people's pastures for a while, there.

Relapse wrote:Auston, that warning about bobcats reminds me of some neighbors of my sisters that had moved into the Maine woods from some city in southern New England.

They told her that they'd found a kitten in the woods and brought it home. The thing was mean, though, and they were barely able to put a collar on it.
When they showed it to her, she realized she was looking at a very young Bobcat.

The section of the land nav course on camp Williams we were on was littered with deer carcasses, so we figured there was a critter about.
How did an Emu end up on the Fort Knox course? A pet or farm animal that got out?

did she mistook that wild animal as a mainecoon kitty ?

http://www.gotpetsonline.com/pictures/gallery/exotics/all-by-photo/bobcats/bobcat-0019/

someone did really pet a bobcat. and some bobcats. (i think) looks like mainecoon.

=^.^=

Joey wrote:
I'm not exactly a body builder but if I put my weight into an elbow just as it leaded up at me, it'd be dead or stunned and easy to finish off.

I'm not a body builder either, but I was a collegiate athlete, personal trainer, and have always been rather strong despite being only 5'9 and I imagine my elbow would buckle if pounced on by a cougar. That is, assuming the most likely point of contact (teeth) didn't result in my inability to use the arm.

Joey wrote:
And if it was a ground fight the fact that my arms are much longer and more agile than its legs would mean it wouldn't be able to do gak.

I guarantee you that isn't the case. Your arms and hands allow you to do a larger number of complicated tasks, but the cougar's legs will be capable of moving faster than yours.

Id love to own a maincoon, infact we are looking to adopt one here hopefully. But Bobcats are quite a bit larger then maincoons.

Did you know mainecoons are the second most registered breed in the American cat fancy? I didn't...