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rigeld2 wrote:

easysauce wrote:you choose the angle of entry as per BRB, it says nothing about models not on the board yet pivoting,

It doesn't need to. They're allowed to make a normal move. Is a pivot an allowed part of a normal move? Is there anything denying the pivot?

yes, they can make a normal MOVE,

move =/= pivot as you keep saying

they can MOVE onto the board edge

pivot happens BEFORE they make a normal move, just because it happens in the movement phase, does not make it a "move" just like vector strike isnt a MOVE.

your MOVE is 18"+, end of story.

your move happens after your pivot,

you cannot pivot onto the board, you can only move onto the board.

easysauce wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
Since it's considered to be "just off the board in the previous turn and moved as normal" (page 124) and you pivot around the centerpoint of the model (page 71) it's not hard to figure out.

again, you are asserting that pivoting = movement,

it is not,

Pivoting alone is not. Pivoting plus movement is.

you just like to interject Schrodinger into everything then?

Because I'm the one that brought that up?

[quoet]you assert:
pivoting is movement, because it allows me to move onto the board, and is allowed while in reserves
but it is not movement, because it does not take up the move distance, and is not calculated for move range, and it can be done from reserves.

rigeld2 wrote:

easysauce wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:
Since it's considered to be "just off the board in the previous turn and moved as normal" (page 124) and you pivot around the centerpoint of the model (page 71) it's not hard to figure out.

again, you are asserting that pivoting = movement,

it is not,

Pivoting alone is not. Pivoting plus movement is.

You're just completely ignoring the fact that it states in the flyers rules that it IS pivoting on the spot and it IS before moving.

Pivoting on the spot is not moving. What is the flyer doing before it moves? And what must you do to be able to get onto the board from reserves?

 Kevin949 wrote:
So you just want to ignore the part of the flyer rules that explicitly say it's pivoting on the spot?

No. But it is not pivoting on the spot alone


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kevin949 wrote:
Pivoting on the spot is not moving.

You're intentionally misstating the rule. Please stop doing so since it's been pointed out.

rigeld2 wrote:

 Kevin949 wrote:
So you just want to ignore the part of the flyer rules that explicitly say it's pivoting on the spot?

No. But it is not pivoting on the spot alone


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kevin949 wrote:
Pivoting on the spot is not moving.

You're intentionally misstating the rule. Please stop doing so since it's been pointed out.

I'm not misstating the rule, you're misunderstanding the construction of the sentence. The word "alone" in there is simply solidifying that pivoting is not moving, regardless of whatever else you add. Otherwise pivoting after moving at all would count against your total movement allowance.

It's a poor choice of words but you're looking at the syntax incorrectly. Unfortunately I can't think of a better way to construct the sentence at the moment.

If you do something alone, it counts as doing something else.

Which means that if you don't do it alone it doesn't count as that thing.

The word "alone" is before the "so" which means it is part of the first half of the sentence. Trying to ignore it is incorrect.

 Kevin949 wrote:
So you just want to ignore the part of the flyer rules that explicitly say it's pivoting on the spot?

Yes, let's look at the whole sentence - Pivoting
on the spot alone does not count as moving, so a vehicle that
only pivots in the Movement phase counts as Stationary.

You see that word "so" there? That's used when imparting an example.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BarBoBot wrote:
Making the text bigger doesn't stop you from being wrong Kevin.

It says pivoting on the spot alone does not count as moving.

If the flyer does anything besides "pivoting alone" then it IS par of the movement.

His can you type something out in such large font and not actually read it first?

Thinking I'm wrong doesn't make you right, so how about you contribute instead of berate.

I neve said you don't get an opinion, I said big font doesn't make you right.

Yelling isn't goin to prove anything, so you should relax, take a breath and make your case without the caps.

Premise 1: pivoting is included in a flyers movement.

Do we agree on Premise 1?

 Kevin949 wrote:
The word "alone" in there is simply solidifying that pivoting is not moving, regardless of whatever else you add. Otherwise pivoting after moving at all would count against your total movement allowance.

No, the sentence is literally saying what happens if you pivot alone.
Pivoting would never count against your movement distance as the rules for pivoting say that they don't.

It's a poor choice of words but you're looking at the syntax incorrectly. Unfortunately I can't think of a better way to construct the sentence at the moment.

If you can't reword the sentence to support your argument, perhaps it's not my reading that is incorrect.


Edit: A Flyer crashes if it moves. Would you agree with that sentence?

Pg. 124. Each model's move is measured from the edge of the battlefield, as if they had been positioned just off the board in the previous turn and moved as normal.


Pg 80. In a turn in which a Flyer enters the board from reserve, it can do so facing any direcion you wish, providing that the resulting move will not caryr it off the board again.


There is no pivoting, or measuring hull or anything required. The rule states to measure from the board edge and the Flyer is allowed to come in at any angle. So you pick a point and measure 18" and then place your Flyer on the board.

Ah... Dakkadakka... pure ridiculous. It's odd how I've never had a single argument or complaint from anybody at local gamestores or tourneys.

You start your movement at the edge of the board. You can make one 90 degree pivot. Onto the board you go. In most cases you can end up coming in at such an acute angle to the side of the board that your wing will be almost touching the side of the board.

Where is the problem with this?

You START your movement on the outside of the board.
You can make a 90 degree pivot in your MOVEMENT phase
You come in at a straight line to that angle.

 Budikah wrote:
You START your movement on the outside of the board.
You can make a 90 degree pivot in your MOVEMENT phase
You come in at a straight line to that angle.

rigeld2 sounds like a blast to play against.

So you agree 100% with Rigeld on how the rule should be played, but you wouldn't want to play him?
That's an... interesting... philosophy you've got there.

I am not sure that he was being sarcastic...

I actually am fun to play against. It's almost like arguing RAW has nothing to do with how I play.

Funny, that.

 Budikah wrote:
Ah... Dakkadakka... pure ridiculous. It's odd how I've never had a single argument or complaint from anybody at local gamestores or tourneys.

You start your movement at the edge of the board. You can make one 90 degree pivot. Onto the board you go. In most cases you can end up coming in at such an acute angle to the side of the board that your wing will be almost touching the side of the board.

Where is the problem with this?.

Technically its not, especially if you take into account Pg 124. If for some reason a model's maximum move is insufficient to fit the entire model onto the board, or it becomes Immobilised itself whilst moving onto the board, place the model so that its rear end is touching the board edge.

Which would allow almost a 0 degree angle .

Not really - a Flyers maximum move is absolutely sufficient to have it fit on the board. You can't just choose not to be on the board and get a free bump.

Logically, absolutely. But what rulewise prevents you from doing that ?

Fragile wrote:
Logically, absolutely. But what rulewise prevents you from doing that ?

Because there's no rule forcing you

Your movement is demonstrably sufficient to move onto the board.
The vehicle is not immobilized.

Therefore, no free bump.

Quanar wrote:

 Budikah wrote:
You START your movement on the outside of the board.
You can make a 90 degree pivot in your MOVEMENT phase
You come in at a straight line to that angle.

rigeld2 sounds like a blast to play against.

So you agree 100% with Rigeld on how the rule should be played, but you wouldn't want to play him?
That's an... interesting... philosophy you've got there.

Agreeing with someone on a specific point, does not mean that they agree with the tone or demeanor of the other person.

You and Charles Manson could agree that ice cream is tasty, doesn't mean that you want to hang out and have a cone together!

 Idolator wrote:
You and Charles Manson could agree that ice cream is tasty, doesn't mean that you want to hang out and have a cone together!

Maybe...is he buying?

 Happyjew wrote:

 Idolator wrote:
You and Charles Manson could agree that ice cream is tasty, doesn't mean that you want to hang out and have a cone together!

Maybe...is he buying?

Made me spit my drink. Good job.