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But Bats would bring some EMP field that would fry all of starks stuff rendering him useless. (or some bring some ice grenades)

(edit: actually i like frazzles counter better)
And the cycle continues

Yeah, I like the Iron Man movies, but "I am Iron Man. The suit and I are one" rrrrrreally wasn't the best idea ever. Batman keeping his identity secret was the right way to go. Interesting to find out that Joker always knew who Bats was and didn't care. Any other villain would exploit it. Joker is anything BUT "any other villain" though. Came up in N52: DotF, for those who don't know. And for Batman, I consider N52 canon: it follows all of his previous activities outside of JL.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Came up in N52: DotF, for those who don't know.

If they don't know, they won't know what N52: DotF means. For those who don't know, it is the Death of the Family storyline.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Yeah, I like the Iron Man movies, but "I am Iron Man. The suit and I are one" rrrrrreally wasn't the best idea ever. Batman keeping his identity secret was the right way to go.

That isn't just a movie thing though, even in the comics everyone knows who Iron Man is. Part of the character is his arrogance.

Interesting to consider that the mirror image of the Joker re: Batman's identity is James Gordon. I'm not claiming it's been a consistent thing, but we have suggestions in various works that he suspects but simply chooses not to follow up on it. I think even TDKRises touched on this...that Gordon simply doesn't want to know. I believe they hinted that Gordon also knew it was Dick under the cowl while Bruce was riding "Omega Airlines" into the past following Infinite Crisis.

I think it was suggested on at least one occasion that Perry White must know Clark's secret but chooses to keep it to himself. I like this idea a lot, and liked that Man of Steel left it open as a possibility.

IMO, it's a much more realistic approach to secret identities to have people know or suspect but keep the secret, rather than being something that literally no one suspects.

Here is the rank-order of the comic book power hierarchy:

1. Anyone holding the Infinity Gauntlet who is not Thanos
2. The Flash
3. Zatanna
4. Batman

Anyone fighting the Flash will have about as much success as anyone attempting to fight physics itself. It cannot be done. As a distant third is Zatanna, whose magical powers are basically only limited by her ability to think or comprehend the desired effect of her powers. Fourth is Batman, who is the living avatar or science, tech and human ingenuity.

The only reason anyone holding the Infinity Gauntlet triumphs, is because it has the power to re-shape reality itself, including time and space. However, this only applies to people who are not THanos, because when he had the Infinity Gauntlet, he was defeated by the kids from The Electric Company, and that is just pathetic.

Isn't Dr. Fate a better magician than Zatanna, or are you going to tell me it is all the helmet?

Nah, all in the fishnets.

Not just showin' off for the crowd, y'know.

How would Hulk rate in this?

 Frazzled wrote:
How would Hulk rate in this?

As far as power levels?
He has the potential for limitless physical strength and endurance, all based on his emotional state (generally his anger/rage). The Beyonder (one of the most powerful entities in the Marvel Universe) has been quoted as saying the Hulk's strength has "no finite element inside" but writers have limited his physical power by saying his subconscious (i.e.- Banner) places mental blocks to prevent him from losing total control. However, Jean Grey removed those subconscious mental blocks and the Hulk was able to best Onslaught in a one-on-one fight. In Planet Hulk, in the final fight with the Red King tries to blow his own planet, Sakaar, apart to kill the Hulk. Unfazed, the Hulk grabs to tectonic plates and slams them back together to save the planet from being destroyed. It was awesome.

Also, the Hulk would do to Batman like he does to everything else... smash.

 KingCracker wrote:

 Surtur wrote:
Superman needs super powers to fight crime.

Batman needs money to fight crime.

Judge Dredd just needs the law.

I think we know who the best hero is. ;D

Defendor needs his wits and will......and hornets.


And hes Woody Harrelson. Again lads, I win the argument.

I think he would fit in wonderfully with Dredd's universe.

But back to Dredd v Bats:

 gorgon wrote:
Well, in the New 52, there's one hero that Batman can't defeat -- Wonder Woman. She has no real weaknesses to exploit. That's why he's nervous about Clark and Diana's relationship, because his plan for stopping Diana is having Clark take her down.

Wait, did they get rid of WW's "bondage weakness" ?? if so, thats some serious crap man, because Bats should easily take care of her with some nifty batarang/ grappling bat hook thing shooting.

Isn't the Sandman universe part of the DC universe?

Shouldn't that sum up the "who can beat who" arguments?

The entire threat of Batman hinges on him surviving learning what your powers are and having time to counter them. It's all dependent on plot armor. All you'd need to do is have a marginally powerful super being - someone who can deal with the standard bat-gear who actually follows through and finishes him off immediately.

Besides, Black Panther is cooler, anyways.

Aquaman seems a tad bit cooler these days.

Aquaman clearly would win. He has the power of Cthulhu.

She wins. Every single time.

Fafnir wrote:

She wins. Every single time.

"latrommi ma I"

What, will Death's skinny-jeans powers activate, then?

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 gorgon wrote:
Well, in the New 52, there's one hero that Batman can't defeat -- Wonder Woman. She has no real weaknesses to exploit. That's why he's nervous about Clark and Diana's relationship, because his plan for stopping Diana is having Clark take her down.

Wait, did they get rid of WW's "bondage weakness" ?? if so, thats some serious crap man, because Bats should easily take care of her with some nifty batarang/ grappling bat hook thing shooting.

I think that's been written out since pre-Crisis.

WW is a crazy strong character. Not only does she have the raw power, she's genuinely a warrior, having been trained by the god of war himself. So think Superman's power with Batman's fighting skills (or better, actually).

So General Zod basically?

http://scans-daily.dreamwidth.org/4230439.html


Diana is pretty tough all things considered.





ouch !


and be careful how far you push her



There's been a bit of a reboot since then -- think what they did to Star Trek -- but she's one tough cookie.

 Frazzled wrote:
So General Zod basically?

With gear. She obviously has the magic lasso, and now regularly carries a sword made for her by Hephaestus...presumably it's similar to the monomolecular weapon she had in Kingdom Come. She also has been known to use a shield and battle armor.

I always wondered why the slow development of a WW movie.

When you're saying that Batman is better than every other superhero do you mean that Batman is better than Batman?

WW is a tough character to get right, methinks. Whedon tried a while back IIRC, but the project didn't go anywhere. The character kinda has one foot in the mythological realm, and one foot in the modern world. I think it makes it hard to ground the character in the way that modern audiences prefer. BUT, Thor might have provided a blueprint. I wasn't crazy about that film, but I think Branagh got the character to work on the big screen, and that's at least half the battle.

A secondary but I think important point is that she has a very weak rogue's gallery compared to Batman, Superman, GL or the Flash. Heck, even Black Manta for Aquaman might trump any of WW's villains. She really doesn't have an antagonist we want to see on screen, such as Lex Luthor or the Joker.

I'm glad that TV pilot from a couple years ago failed...frankly it looked like it was going to be the Linda Carter series reborn, and I think they need a better, less cheesy approach. They were working on an "Amazon" pilot, which was supposed to be much in the same vein as Arrow. I'm going to assume that series would majorly downplay the mythological angle in favor of focusing on a young Diana in "man's world."

Honestly, the current comic is really good. And Grant Morrison has a WW project that looks very promising. The stars could be aligning for the character as a multimedia product. There are also a few rumblings about whether she'll appear in the Batman vs. Superman movie. I tend to think it's wishlisting, but the supporters point out that the name of the movie doesn't seem to have been finalized yet, and that they're casting a role for an unnamed athletic female.

Adding fuel to that fire are some things that WB's head of creative development told Variety about the DC characters. From comingsoon.net:

“We have been doing a lot of thinking for years about how to best use all those characters and we love them," Silverman said. "Wonder Woman is an amazing character. I think it's a great opportunity both for box office success, but also to have an amazingly powerful female superhero."

Considering he only mentioned Wonder Woman, the trade then specifically asked whether she is going to be part of the film, to which he replied: "We are taking it all very seriously and are trying to do a plan that's respectful to those characters and maximizes the stories as best they can. So everything that has been speculated are things that we've thought about."

Oh, and regarding Affleck's casting (bringing this back closer OT), the same exec said:

“We knew going in that we had more information than the general public had. We knew what the take of the movie was, we knew what the character was going to be. We don’t take these decisions lightly. We thought about everybody — brand new people, established people. Ben is the perfect guy to play this role.”

How many female superheroes made it on the big screen?

Catwoman and Elektra are two well-established disasters, LOL. Supergirl in the '80s didn't set the world on fire either.

The errors there were in execution IMO, but I also understand why a studio would be reluctant to pony up significant bank after those flops.

I'm still wait-and-see on WW in the next movie, but I will admit the exec a) seems to be dodging the question, and b) seems to indicate that they already have a larger plan in place for the DC universe.

 Frazzled wrote:
How many female superheroes made it on the big screen?

If by "made it" you mean they finished shooting the film and it was released, there are a few. If you mean they were financially successful...

 gorgon wrote:
Catwoman and Elektra are two well-established disasters, LOL. Supergirl in the '80s didn't set the world on fire either.

The errors there were in execution IMO, but I also understand why a studio would be reluctant to pony up significant bank after those flops.

I'm still wait-and-see on WW in the next movie, but I will admit the exec a) seems to be dodging the question, and b) seems to indicate that they already have a larger plan in place for the DC universe.

Exactly.

There may be a tiny stretching of the term 'super' in superheroes but, going along the lines of comic book based transitions with potentially powered heroes...

Helen Slater as Supergirl.
Babydoll in Sucker Punch.
Pamela Anderson as Barb Wire.
Dunno, whether Sin City has any superheroines as main characters or not...


The rest of tend to be ensemble films, supporting characters or just plain action heroes I think.

Edit: Here's a question, what went exactly wrong with the Wonder Woman DC Animated Movie. - I thought it was pretty awesome, had Nathan Fillion in it and had a rather valid level of violence, blood, gore etc in it to show it wasn't a disney film.

 Compel wrote:
There may be a tiny stretching of the term 'super' in superheroes but, going along the lines of comic book based transitions with potentially powered heroes...

Helen Slater as Supergirl.
Babydoll in Sucker Punch.
Pamela Anderson as Barb Wire.
Dunno, whether Sin City has any superheroines as main characters or not...

Being in a comic doesn't make them a superhero, and the only one on that list I would count would be Supergirl. Barb Wire I guess could be on the fence but the other two don't count for sure as super heroes, and Sucker Punch isn't even an adaptation of a comic or character either.

 Compel wrote:
Edit: Here's a question, what went exactly wrong with the Wonder Woman DC Animated Movie. - I thought it was pretty awesome, had Nathan Fillion in it and had a rather valid level of violence, blood, gore etc in it to show it wasn't a disney film.

There is nothing wrong with it, but what you can do with a straight to DVD animated film isnt the same as what you can do in a big budget live action film, and the audiences and return on investment have a different scale.