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 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
It's only being accepted by goobs that might as well not bother using dice and just say "pew pew" at each other.

Really? You're seriously taking cracks at people for having different taste than you?

This is the same guy who compared a fully painted army to being in the military in regards to discipline so I am not surprised.

I think that many people, much like the people who hate FW in general are somewhat overreacting and going for the "op" argument which is not the case at all. You want to bring a 600+ point model to a 1500pt. game be my guest, already seen it happen and see it get wrecked.

Ravenous D wrote:Considering the few games Ive seen with super heavies and the faces and attutides of the players over this weekend I don't think this will be a thing. Because lets be real here, if you're the guy that keeps showing up with janky gak (even before this abomination) nobody wants to play you, and in tournaments there is already enough complaints against screamerstar and Jetstar that comp was already becoming a thing, no good tournament will allow this in.

Games last 30 minutes and only one person is happy during the game, just as I already said would happen. Nothing is worse in this game then being impotent to stop or counter something.

After people get stomped on by or stomp on super heavies the tune will change pretty quick. It makes for short uninteresting games. Escalation should be treated like the optional permission only expansions that it is.

Epic confirmation bias, bro. By the way, everything is optional permission only.

Ravenous D wrote:
First had no D. Lord of skulls was blown up in 1 turn and the game lasted 20minutes after that. Chaos guy was not impressed. The second had the D, transcendent C'tan moved up 18" with his D slide, sprayed his hellstorm D template followed by the S6ap2 hellstorm template and the game was basically over. Opponent refused to play against escalation bs ever again. 3rd was a proxy of what a revenant titan can do on a skyshield.

It's only being accepted by goobs that might as well not bother using dice and just say "pew pew" at each other.



The stronghold assault book is a little different, the fortification networks might as well be banned because they suck so badly or in the case of the void shield network is just too stupid good. And no one with any sense will allow the Macro cannon or vortex missile building, people already have problems with the fortress of redemption. The rest is actually not bad for normal 40k.

"People who like things I don't like are stupid goobs! Stop liking what I don't like!" 4/10 bait taken, I responded. I mean really now, all you've been doing is railing against this thing since day 1. Why so much anger? Run your tournament the way the players want it to be run, but don't run around and decry everyone who doesn't share your opinions.

 gmaleron wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
It's only being accepted by goobs that might as well not bother using dice and just say "pew pew" at each other.

Really? You're seriously taking cracks at people for having different taste than you?

This is the same guy who compared a fully painted army to being in the military in regards to discipline so I am not surprised.

You want to bring a 600+ point model to a 1500pt. game be my guest, already seen it happen and see it get wrecked.

Of course, weve all seen the revenant titan (900) wreck everything on the boaurd

 Ravenous D wrote:

First had no D. Lord of skulls was blown up in 1 turn and the game lasted 20minutes after that. Chaos guy was not impressed. The second had the D, transcendent C'tan moved up 18" with his D slide, sprayed his hellstorm D template followed by the S6ap2 hellstorm template and the game was basically over. Opponent refused to play against escalation bs ever again. 3rd was a proxy of what a revenant titan can do on a skyshield.

It's only being accepted by goobs that might as well not bother using dice and just say "pew pew" at each other.



The stronghold assault book is a little different, the fortification networks might as well be banned because they suck so badly or in the case of the void shield network is just too stupid good. And no one with any sense will allow the Macro cannon or vortex missile building, people already have problems with the fortress of redemption. The rest is actually not bad for normal 40k.

Curious If you guys played a standard Dawn of War mission or one out of the Escalation book.

According to the Escalation rules the players either agree on a mission or roll off to determine what mission table is used to determine it If only one player has a LoW than if that player wins the roll he must roll on the Escalation mission table.same for if both players have LoW choices.If the player not sporting a LoW wins then he can NOT roll on the escalation mission table and must roll on either the BRB DoW table (which screws him more I think) or on the Stronghold assault mission table.

The reason I mention this is the new missions are more geared toward lessening the impact of the LoW`s on the smaller scale battles they are in..well except the Revenant,that thing is just OTT.

So the way the game is now for randomly determined battles we either bring a super heavy and or fortifications because if you don't your list will have inherent weaknesses when playing against the LoW`s or Fortifications in standard DoW missions.

well i spose out of all the outcomes im glad this came along, the FW inclusions that is... if i have to id MUCH rather drop a warhound on the table than a lord of skulls and save a DP in points lol

What is escalation is for: getting to use superheavies more, and providing a space for "sub-optimal" superheavies to be used

What escalation is (according to the internet): Cheesemongering.

Everything in 40k is breakable,increasingly so in fact. If one is able to demonstrate some restraint, and use fluffy, fun or good looking super-heavies over "what's the most powerful thing I can get my hands on," it's a much more enjoyable experience.

A Brass Scorpion, Macharius or Heirodule do not break the game; finding the largest D delivery system does.

I, for one, would like to field a Macharius Vulcan with my Death Korps, and I dare someone to call it cheesy; 420 points for what amounts to a large number of autocannon shots.

My group is still trying to come to a conclusion on it; we like Stronghold assault, but the power gamers don't like Escalation, while the casual players do, so far.

 MajorStoffer wrote:
What is escalation is for: getting to use superheavies more, and providing a space for "sub-optimal" superheavies to be used

What escalation is (according to the internet): Cheesemongering.

Everything in 40k is breakable,increasingly so in fact. If one is able to demonstrate some restraint, and use fluffy, fun or good looking super-heavies over "what's the most powerful thing I can get my hands on," it's a much more enjoyable experience.

A Brass Scorpion, Macharius or Heirodule do not break the game; finding the largest D delivery system does.

I, for one, would like to field a Macharius Vulcan with my Death Korps, and I dare someone to call it cheesy; 420 points for what amounts to a large number of autocannon shots.

My group is still trying to come to a conclusion on it; we like Stronghold assault, but the power gamers don't like Escalation, while the casual players do, so far.

There's always a lot of resistance against change of all kinds. Give it some time. Escalation and Stronghold Assault will get banned a lot at first, then they'll either become accepted completely or players will come to some type of a compromise (some houserules, for example counting strength D as S10 AP1). In the end I'm sure you'll get to play with your Macharius.

No one will buy a FW model if he doesn't know , if others will let him use its rules. Few if any have enough spare cash to buy crap FW units , so the ones that will be used will be most offten tbe the ones that are in escalation and are good. Which more or less boils down to shadow sword and the eldar titan


But maybe if the avarge salary is 4 times higher then it is now , it may change . Otherwise I don't see people agreing to FW being legal ever.

Makumba wrote:
No one will buy a FW model if he doesn't know , if others will let him use its rules. Few if any have enough spare cash to buy crap FW units , so the ones that will be used will be most offten tbe the ones that are in escalation and are good. Which more or less boils down to shadow sword and the eldar titan


But maybe if the avarge salary is 4 times higher then it is now , it may change . Otherwise I don't see people agreing to FW being legal ever.

FW is already legal wether people like I or not.

Minijack wrote:
Ok so the Orks can use the Kustom Stompa...

Lets see if I got this correct;

It has a base weapon array of :

Deth Kannon-72" range Str10/Ap1 massive blast

Gigashoota 48" range Str6/Ap4 Heavy 6d6

Supa Rockets X3 unlimited range Str8/Ap3 on shot

Supa Skoprcha Template Str6/Ap3

Supa Gattler 48" range Str7/Ap3 Heavy 2d6 ( I assume the new rules for its use in the Apoc book apply?)

Big Shoot 36" range Str5/Ap5 Assulat3

Now for the decent options

Deff Arsenal +120 pts 120" range Str9/Ap3 Heavy 3d6 shots

red paint +25 pts

And finally Gaze of Mork +25 pts for the 60" range one shot D weapon...the only rules I could find on it were in the new Apoc book...is there an old version of this ability that is waay different than the new one?..reflecting is listed low price.

Honestly the most effective build for it is just two kill blastas or whatever they're called, and a bunch of cheap grot bomms. For c.500pts (instead of 770pts) you get a standard stompa that trades all its reasonable guns for two 7" D blasts per turn, and which can hold 30 models instead of 20. That allows it to take the regen build *and* scoring troops (edit: potentially 2x scoring units) or assault MANz, or at double force take an unholy 18+ repair rolls per turn. The two are just utterly incomparable power wise.

Now just because its more effective doesn't make it better. It'd be far *better* for super competitive tourney games that allow escalation and FW, and far *worse* for garagehammer and casual games.

Gaze of Mork only goes D on a strength roll of 11 or 12 IIRC.

Feeling slightly annoyed that i had just finished putting together and painting an actual 1750pt chaos marine army when i could have just taken a reaver, a lord and 40 cultists to capture whatever objectives aren't vapourised.

Lol don't worry about it man, theres nothing *forcing* you to play titanhammer

 Dakkamite wrote:

Minijack wrote:
Ok so the Orks can use the Kustom Stompa...

Lets see if I got this correct;

It has a base weapon array of :

Deth Kannon-72" range Str10/Ap1 massive blast

Gigashoota 48" range Str6/Ap4 Heavy 6d6

Supa Rockets X3 unlimited range Str8/Ap3 on shot

Supa Skoprcha Template Str6/Ap3

Supa Gattler 48" range Str7/Ap3 Heavy 2d6 ( I assume the new rules for its use in the Apoc book apply?)

Big Shoot 36" range Str5/Ap5 Assulat3

Now for the decent options

Deff Arsenal +120 pts 120" range Str9/Ap3 Heavy 3d6 shots

red paint +25 pts

And finally Gaze of Mork +25 pts for the 60" range one shot D weapon...the only rules I could find on it were in the new Apoc book...is there an old version of this ability that is waay different than the new one?..reflecting is listed low price.

Honestly the most effective build for it is just two kill blastas or whatever they're called, and a bunch of cheap grot bomms. For c.500pts (instead of 770pts) you get a standard stompa that trades all its reasonable guns for two 7" D blasts per turn, and which can hold 30 models instead of 20. That allows it to take the regen build *and* scoring troops (edit: potentially 2x scoring units) or assault MANz, or at double force take an unholy 18+ repair rolls per turn. The two are just utterly incomparable power wise.

Now just because its more effective doesn't make it better. It'd be far *better* for super competitive tourney games that allow escalation and FW, and far *worse* for garagehammer and casual games.

Gaze of Mork only goes D on a strength roll of 11 or 12 IIRC.

Ahh yeah was wondering about that as I dont have the IA8 book and was just using the army builder roster options for the "Kustom Stompa IA" listing.Thnx for clarifying the Gaze of Mork ability,I was sure I was missing something on that with such a cheap cost.

I think our group is just going to stick with whats in the Escalation book when it comes to allowed LoW choices anyway.

Represses urges to buy evyerthingggggg.

Sigh my CSM could use a warhound and my future DKoK assault brigade could us a macharius

 gmaleron wrote:

Makumba wrote:
No one will buy a FW model if he doesn't know , if others will let him use its rules. Few if any have enough spare cash to buy crap FW units , so the ones that will be used will be most offten tbe the ones that are in escalation and are good. Which more or less boils down to shadow sword and the eldar titan


But maybe if the avarge salary is 4 times higher then it is now , it may change . Otherwise I don't see people agreing to FW being legal ever.

FW is already legal wether people like I or not.

Correction. Forge World is 'official'. Its up to the players to determine what is 'legal' when they decide to play.

So. Has anybody out there fielded the fell blade yet? I'm very interested in this rather funky looking tank and am considering it for escalation purposes. I just wanna get some feedback on its general use and performance. Is it worth it?

Cheers