Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Try to find some elevated terrain. There is a good deal of leeway placing forts. I agree with nos... It's very straight forward.

Sirlynchmob, I'll explain it one more time as simply as possible and see if you can grasp it...

When you elevate grots to see over an ADL, your knowingly trying to gain an advantage. Your intent is to abuse that advantage every game by sticking your grots behind that ADL.

Someone who takes the time and effort to create a scenic base which just happens to also on RARE occasions cause that model to see over something, is not even remotely the same thing.

Fact is most people would be happy to ignore the advantage they may get with their cool scenic base because they are not trying to cheat.

When you intentionally elevate your model so you can continually gain an advantage your a cheater.

Are we on the same page yet?

 BarBoBot wrote:


When you intentionally elevate your model so you can continually gain an advantage your a cheater.

Are we on the same page yet?

I get what you're saying. everyone with decorative bases are cheaters.

Gotcha.

And anyone who tries to justify their cheating while calling others a cheater are hypocrites.

You just assume the ork player is doing it to cheat and not just Someone who takes the time and effort to create a scenic base.

Right, the guy who has his HQ on an elevated base that on occasion MIGHT cause an advantage is equal to the guy who in every game sticks his elevated grots behind an ADL so he can have an advantage.... Laughable

 BarBoBot wrote:
Right, the guy who has his HQ on an elevated base that on occasion MIGHT cause an advantage is equal to the guy who in every game sticks his elevated grots behind an ADL so he can have an advantage.... Laughable

Did the guy with his elevated HQ use the base it was supplied with? no, ergo pg 3 says he's cheating.

What if his HQ is behind a ADL on the quad gun, is he cheating now?

wouldn't it be safe to assume that if grots are on decorative bases then the rest of the ork army is probably on the same decorative bases?

If you allow decorative bases, then you allow them for everyone. If you pick and choose who is cheating for something that is allowed, that makes you a hypocrite.

Are we on the same page yet?

so is this considered a decorative base?

sirlynchmob wrote:

 BarBoBot wrote:
Right, the guy who has his HQ on an elevated base that on occasion MIGHT cause an advantage is equal to the guy who in every game sticks his elevated grots behind an ADL so he can have an advantage.... Laughable

Did the guy with his elevated HQ use the base it was supplied with? no, ergo pg 3 says he's cheating.

What if his HQ is behind a ADL on the quad gun, is he cheating now?

wouldn't it be safe to assume that if grots are on decorative bases then the rest of the ork army is probably on the same decorative bases?

If you allow decorative bases, then you allow them for everyone. If you pick and choose who is cheating for something that is allowed, that makes you a hypocrite.

Are we on the same page yet?

Sorry but intent says alot. The guy who puts his dred on a rock so that both guns can shoot over the rhino in front of it, and runs it like that every game is a cheater. Same with someone elevating grots to see over their ADL every game.

The guy who models his dread on a scenic elevated base but DOESN'T choose to abuse it is not a cheater. It the rule of cool.

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
I asked in the previous 3 threads that go on for 5 pages before they get locked and have yet to have anyone do it. Prove that the tippytoe grot in question was never ever ever sold in a blister. Then and only then can you claim it is a WHFB model only.

And the reason that people keep ignoring it is that it is a ridiculous argument.

Your opponent doesn't need to 'prove' that the model you are using is not the 'correct' model. He just has to refuse to play against you if he doesn't approve of the models you are using.

You are a absolutely correct there. Though I can say that in over 20 years of gaming I have never had anyone refuse to play a game when I field all GW models in the roles that the models were built and made for and use GW rules in a game produced by GW.

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
You are a absolutely correct there. Though I can say that in over 20 years of gaming I have never had anyone refuse to play a game when I field all GW models in the roles that the models were built and made for and use GW rules in a game produced by GW.

So using a fantasy model in 40k is the role they were built and made for?

Only when you prove it was never sold in a 40k blister or show me where a model with gretchin on his mounting tab is different from another.....wait for it....... model with gretchin on his mounting tab.

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
Only when you prove it was never sold in a 40k blister or show me where a model with gretchin on his mounting tab is different from another.....wait for it....... model with gretchin on his mounting tab.

Thats not how it works.

We can prove it is a model sold for WHFB so we can use it for Fantasy.

You have to Prove it is a model sold for 40K if you want to use it in a 40K game.

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
Only when you prove it was never sold in a 40k blister or show me where a model with gretchin on his mounting tab is different from another.....wait for it....... model with gretchin on his mounting tab.

Odd, I could have sworn it was permissive. So it is! Show proof it is a 40k model. Do you have any? Or just more of your trolling behaviour on this topic?

nosferatu1001 wrote:

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
Only when you prove it was never sold in a 40k blister or show me where a model with gretchin on his mounting tab is different from another.....wait for it....... model with gretchin on his mounting tab.

Odd, I could have sworn it was permissive. So it is! Show proof it is a 40k model. Do you have any? Or just more of your trolling behaviour on this topic?

You do remember they took WYSIWYG out of the rules right? There are also no rules telling you that you can use a ork boy as a ork boy in the rules. Or that the names on the packages mean anything game wise. RAW speaking, Even though 99% of people will make that logic connection.

If you want to buy 30 grots and field them as a unit of ork boys, There are no rules against it, just like there are no rules saying if you buy 30 citadel miniatures of ork boys you can use them as ork boys in the game. (wheres the permission)? this is why scratch built models are accepted, as any rules saying just ork boy citadel miniatures can be used as ork boys would remove all creative scratch built models, and conversions.

so any model you buy to represent a gretchin is fine. And we should feel free to mount the model on a base of appropriate size (if you wish)

As long as both players agree with it, and/or the TO, you could even use a blob of clay on a bottlecap as any model you want.

nosferatu1001 wrote:

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
Only when you prove it was never sold in a 40k blister or show me where a model with gretchin on his mounting tab is different from another.....wait for it....... model with gretchin on his mounting tab.

Odd, I could have sworn it was permissive. So it is! Show proof it is a 40k model. Do you have any? Or just more of your trolling behaviour on this topic?

So you are saying a permissive ruleset does not allow a model with a mounting tab that say gretchin to be used as a ....oh I don't know. ....oh I got it. A gretchn. Those are some pretty odd house rules you use at the LGS. Let me guess you don't allow IG players to use LRMBTs as a LRMBT either since this house rule you have doesnt give you permission to

A fantasy model is a fantasy model no matter how many times you claim it isn't.

Hasn't it been pointed out several times how ridiculous your arguement is?

 BarBoBot wrote:
A fantasy model is a fantasy model no matter how many times you claim it isn't.

Hasn't it been pointed out several times how ridiculous your arguement is?

so you can't use fantasy demons for 40k demons either right?

That was my next question. When playing against a Daemon army do the houserulers here demand to see the box those bloodleters came out of to see if it says WHFB or 40K on it? Oh wait the box doesn't, it says Bloodletters. Gee I'll bet those Daemon players are disheartened when you tell them they have an illegal army since there is no WHFB or 40k box separately marked.

The demons packaging clearly says 40k and warhammer right on the box. In fact, the packaging for demons is not the same as other fantasy or 40k models. Its unique to demons, so what makes you think they are "fantasy" only demons?

Really? Out of curiosity is this guy a WHFB or 40k mini?

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1300009a

I have a few of these as well. None of them the packaging denoted 40k or Fantasy on it.

I'm have several boxes of demons that I'm looking at in my hands now, and they have the logos for 40k and fantasy on them.

And my grot has gretchin on his tab just like all my other grots.

Interesting that a bloodletter is a bloodletter and a screamer is a screamer but a gretchin is not a gretchin

 BarBoBot wrote:
The demons packaging clearly says 40k and warhammer right on the box. In fact, the packaging for demons is not the same as other fantasy or 40k models. Its unique to demons, so what makes you think they are "fantasy" only demons?

Being a permissive rule set though, which models do we have permission to use in 40k? Can you point to these rules you keep claiming exist that further define which models are and which models are not allowed?

I see we do have permission to use citadel miniatures and refer to them as models in the rules. aren't fantasy models citadel miniatures? This is the only critera in the BRB about what models we can use. Any other statements about models and how to use them are house rules.

There's the permission to use fantasy gretchins as 40k gretchins. And if were going to start drawing hard RAW lines then Scratch built models are illegal, and conversions are illegal.

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
That was my next question. When playing against a Daemon army do the houserulers here demand to see the box those bloodleters came out of to see if it says WHFB or 40K on it? Oh wait the box doesn't, it says Bloodletters. Gee I'll bet those Daemon players are disheartened when you tell them they have an illegal army since there is no WHFB or 40k box separately marked.

Ta da. Your argument is silly and now defunct.

Now look at the metals. Or do you not allow them to be used?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here you go. Fantasy or 40k?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Old-style-Bloodletters-of-Khorne-new-in-blister-Warhammer-Daemons-of-Chaos-/251375862017

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
Now look at the metals. Or do you not allow them to be used?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here you go. Fantasy or 40k?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Old-style-Bloodletters-of-Khorne-new-in-blister-Warhammer-Daemons-of-Chaos-/251375862017

Considering metals are replaced by Finecast, I'm sure you meant this style of model. Because, hey, looky there: Warhammer and Warhammer 40k right there on the pack. Now stop arguing such a needless, futile point. No one's going to make a stink about Chaos Demon players because the models are intentionally designed to be used by both systems. A Goblin/Snotling crewman from Fantasy is not the same as a Grot/Gretchin for 40k. Just give it a rest; this topic comes up all the time and your camp has yet to be convincing to the contrary.

Odd i say the same thing. Now if the mounting tab said Snotling you would have a point but since it says Gretchin your point is mute. Good one though you didnt answer the question.

Your question isn't worth answering. Your arguement is silly.

Boss GreenNutz wrote:
Odd i say the same thing. Now if the mounting tab said Snotling you would have a point but since it says Gretchin your point is mute. Good one though you didnt answer the question.

So you would be fine with me using an Epic scale Avatar in a regular game, just so I could get better cover from an ADL?

 BarBoBot wrote:
Your question isn't worth answering. Your arguement is silly.

Says the one without being able to quote a single rule to prove his case.

you're also projecting again.

we have permission in the rules to use any citadel miniature in the game.

You have no argument to make otherwise.