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Death company have rampage. That's where the attacks come from.

The thing about flyers though...they can't score and stay in the air. In Maelstrom, that's a massive disadvantage. When people are talking about ignoring flyers, it all depends. For one of my lists, I have next to no anti-air, but I'm positive that no flyer currently in the game poses much threat to my units. I like to play without AV values (except Eldar War walkers, but they're almost more like heavy infantry, rather than armour), no matter the army, and most flyers are all about air-superiority and precision AV killing. So I can ignore them with my SW. With my Eldar, I do have to be careful, because flyers are mobile, which means they can do to me what I do to marines every battle, make them react to me, not the other way around. Fortunately, I also have easily available decent AA in the guise of S6/7 spam, so again not a huge deal if I have to face 2-3 flyers. More than that, and you're shooting yourself in the face, imo. FMC are a whole different story. Meta should care more for those than AV air.

 warpspider89 wrote:
Death company have rampage. That's where the attacks come from.

Rage. Not rampage.

 Araenion wrote:
The thing about flyers though...they can't score and stay in the air. In Maelstrom, that's a massive disadvantage. When people are talking about ignoring flyers, it all depends. For one of my lists, I have next to no anti-air, but I'm positive that no flyer currently in the game poses much threat to my units. I like to play without AV values (except Eldar War walkers, but they're almost more like heavy infantry, rather than armour), no matter the army, and most flyers are all about air-superiority and precision AV killing. So I can ignore them with my SW. With my Eldar, I do have to be careful, because flyers are mobile, which means they can do to me what I do to marines every battle, make them react to me, not the other way around. Fortunately, I also have easily available decent AA in the guise of S6/7 spam, so again not a huge deal if I have to face 2-3 flyers. More than that, and you're shooting yourself in the face, imo. FMC are a whole different story. Meta should care more for those than AV air.

Many flyrs have hover. and then they score.

The scary thing about trying to get behind these flyers is that they do hold 3x tactical squads and have that homing setup, I don't think they fear coming on in hover mode, dropping out tactical squads to shoot down some of your force and still get the 1st DS and assault from droppod unit.

A hovering flyer is a dead flyer. And in Maelstrom, you need to score T1-5/6/7. Not just 5/6/7. That's the issue with this list. Honestly, other formations seem a lot more balanced than this.

Truthfully the thing you'll have to worry about is the Fury formation mixed with another, perhaps the Wrath that does VV and 2x ASM squads, or something simple like Corbs, Dante, some JP DC, and a Fragnaught or two. You can still out shoot BA quite easily, so figure on doing so.

Honestly, expect DS-heavy lists but I think for anything 1500 and below you won't be seeing the 'no scatter and assault' shenanigans very often, if at all. 1850+? It's almost a guarantee along with some of the other formations. Haven't played against Tau in forever, but from what I remember they chewed through marines through volume and quality of fire - BA still suffer from that.

Can't be sure what you're running list/army wise, but if you have Kroot, they're your best friends. Use them to chew up charges and then murder the piss out of anything that makes it through them. You're not going to out melee BA, out shoot, yup. Out maneuver? Possibly, just have to force the BA player to commit to a killzone, once they do, erase their newly arrived DS units.

in 1850 you can fit something roughly like this:

Archangel Formation:
-Terminator Librarian ML2 Stormshield Force Sword
-Furioso Dreadnought Fragcannon Droppod
-7x Vanguardvets 6xmeltabombs Relicblade Droppod
-7x Sternguardvets Droppod

Archangel Spearhead
-Stormraven LC/MM
-Stormraven LC/MM
-Stormraven LC/MM
-10x Tacticals Flamer Heavy Flamer Power Sword Hand Flamer + Free TH
-10x Tacticals Plasmagun Heavy Flamer Combi-Plasma + Free TH
-10x Tacticals Meltagun Heavy Flamer Combi-Melta + Free TH

This list gives you some nice variety to drop turn one inside of the Spearhead range for either vanguardvets or Furioso turn 1 assault. Sternguard for thir special ammo goodness to deal with various threats that need precison.

This setup also gives you the reroll warlord trait as well as +1 I on assault rule to the important veterans.

I just wish I had points to kit out the librarian more and give the Stormravens Hurricane Bolters. Maybe give the sternguard combi-weapons, but at 10pts each, I'm not a fan of giving them combi-weapons. Lastly I'd like to get a droppod with a Culexus Assassin, to deal with Invisible units/casters.

 Araenion wrote:
A hovering flyer is a dead flyer. And in Maelstrom, you need to score T1-5/6/7. Not just 5/6/7. That's the issue with this list. Honestly, other formations seem a lot more balanced than this.

Perhaps but the focus of my thread here is what to look out for and how to prioritize.

It seems that killing the CENTER Storm Raven is going to ba a good call, no matter whose in it. Thats one thing ive come up with so far in this discussion which is good information.

I also think Null Deployment would, as it does in many cases, solve a lot of problems against this formation. I was talking to a friend who I have played many times and he has beaten me a few of them. and his comment was that he was worried about exactly that.

So i am starting to form a picture of the threat this can be and what to do about it. productive discussion so far.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Coyote81 wrote:
in 1850 you can fit something roughly like this:

Archangel Formation:
-Terminator Librarian ML2 Stormshield Force Sword
-Furioso Dreadnought Fragcannon Droppod
-7x Vanguardvets 6xmeltabombs Relicblade Droppod
-7x Sternguardvets Droppod

Archangel Spearhead
-Stormraven LC/MM
-Stormraven LC/MM
-Stormraven LC/MM
-10x Tacticals Flamer Heavy Flamer Power Sword Hand Flamer + Free TH
-10x Tacticals Plasmagun Heavy Flamer Combi-Plasma + Free TH
-10x Tacticals Meltagun Heavy Flamer Combi-Melta + Free TH

This list gives you some nice variety to drop turn one inside of the Spearhead range for either vanguardvets or Furioso turn 1 assault. Sternguard for thir special ammo goodness to deal with various threats that need precison.

This setup also gives you the reroll warlord trait as well as +1 I on assault rule to the important veterans.

I just wish I had points to kit out the librarian more and give the Stormravens Hurricane Bolters. Maybe give the sternguard combi-weapons, but at 10pts each, I'm not a fan of giving them combi-weapons. Lastly I'd like to get a droppod with a Culexus Assassin, to deal with Invisible units/casters.

That suggestion on the Culexis is absolutely great. That would be a very good thing to do. Not as useful vs. my Tau but in a tournament setting in general its a fantastic idea.