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Someone asked a question, I answered.

I'm happy to drop it, unless Mel and co. want to attack me. In which case I'll respond.

 Melissia wrote:
Said hashtag was a social media campaign initiated by a group of people who wanted a bunch of idiots to cover for them while they attacked people they didn't like. Naturally, they found a bunch of suckers. As a result, it has thus far not managed to exceed its ignoble beginnings; quite frankly, it never will.

Zoe, Brianne and their merry bunch of SJW didn't invent #gamergate, the other side did.

GG thread #412374123742378 is a go?

Ima go get my popcorn.

Well to get to the OP it appears it is a VERY unanimous YES to being tired of gaming culture at least in the fun #Gamergate end of things.

I think it would be hard to be "tired" of it if there is little relevance to you personally. My part of being tired about it is people trying to force me to care.

As far as I go is do not mess with those fine people who make games I love. Pay them well and tell no lies on how good they are.

Gamergate =/= and has never equaled Gaming Culture.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Aye, the Kinect should never have been bundled in with the Xbone. Including an untested unproven peripheral that the average Gamer didn't want (We've had a Wii for nigh on 5 years now and neither I nor my brother have ever used it) bundled in with the basic console made it far too expensive.

But regarding the Playstation and Bluray. Aren't PS games based on BluRay tech? I thought bluray disks were an important technological advancement over DVD's.


From the very start of this generation, Video Game consoles should have come in multiple packages.

Gamer focused packages - cheaper, sans Kinect etc.

And Home Entertainment packages. All the extra bells and whistles.

Aye, I believe they are. My PS3 drive broke, so I can play DVD's, but neither PS3 games or Blu-Ray movies.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Gamergate =/= and has never equaled Gaming Culture.

Considering it's been a dominate theme in our discussion of gamer culture, it seems at least tangentially related though, don't you think?

Especially since it's not completely out of character for online behavior towards women. You can argue its an internet issue, and not a gamer issue, but that's starting to split some very fine hairs.

I think we can all agree that Gamergate was not gamings finest hour, and move on.

Compared to the admittedly lower grade, but for more common, hostility women and minorities face in gaming, GamerGate was flashier but not really the core issue.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Clearly we all get our info on it from different sources, which leads to different perceptions.

I imagine you lot read sites like Kotaku, Polygon and Gawker.

I read, gaming-related:
Ctrl+Alt+Del (webcomics)
Akward zombie (webcomic)
Manly guys doing manly things (webcomics)
The Humble Bundle newsletter
Strife's forum and subreddit
My Google+ feed
DakkaDakka
And, since learning about GamerGate in DakkaDakka, I created a Twitter account, so, Twitter.

I never go on Kotaku, Polygon or Gawker unless I find a link to there on, say, Dakka, or Twitter.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Plus theres the whole NotYourShield thing, which you seem to prefer to ignore...

NotYourShield is all about being a shield for GamerGate .

 Polonius wrote:

I think we can all agree that Gamergate was not gamings finest hour, and move on.

I would simply add that it wasn't feminism's finest hour either

 Crablezworth wrote:

 Polonius wrote:

I think we can all agree that Gamergate was not gamings finest hour, and move on.

I would simply add that it wasn't feminism's finest hour either

So?

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Sometimes I feel it is enough to stop gaming. First is the farce that is game journalism, the idea that these are somehow not all bought out by people.
And then comes the PC master race and console wars.
And then comes in those horrible gamer gate and Anita saarkeesion debacles that just seem old and out of date already.
the righteousness and blindness of gamers that refuse to acknowledge the problems with gaming?
It just feels stupId sometimes.
Why do we get caught up in this culture war and stuff and why can't we enjoy gaming?

Because setting yourself up with an opinion that is not worth a lot is actually worth something if you're bought out to shill them.
PC master race because there are misconceptions about PC gaming vs consoles
Ms.Sarkesian is not even worth discussing
What problems? Don't like the game = don't buy it.

 Polonius wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

 Polonius wrote:

I think we can all agree that Gamergate was not gamings finest hour, and move on.

I would simply add that it wasn't feminism's finest hour either

So?

And?




I guess I can't really distinguish gamer culture from internet culture. The net's a mixed bag but we keep comin back for more.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
NotYourShield is all about being a shield for GamerGate .

Right...so I suppose for all the women posting under that tag, their opinions don't count? They should be ignored? They have a..what's the term...internalized misogyny?

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Ahem.

Both sides find it convenient to blame the other side for this trolling to discredit opposing views.

False centrism does not equal wisdom. This may be surprising, but it's actually the opposite.

 Melissia wrote:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Ahem.

Both sides find it convenient to blame the other side for this trolling to discredit opposing views.

False centrism does not equal wisdom. This may be surprising, but it's actually the opposite.

Neither is ignoring the sins of your own side and adopting a holier than thou attitude.

People in GamerGate have been trolled, harassed and doxed too, but I bet you either didn't know or don't care.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Right...so I suppose for all the women posting under that tag, their opinions don't count?

No, their opinions count as much as anyone else opinion. Are you using them to shield GamerGate from criticism? You seem like you are doing just that.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Right...so I suppose for all the women posting under that tag, their opinions don't count?

No, their opinions count as much as anyone else opinion. Are you using them to shield GamerGate from criticism? You seem like you are doing just that.

What...the feth... I really...don't get your logic.

I'm not, No.

You do realise what NotYourShield is don't you? Women in gaming, speaking out and making their opinions heard. If anyone is using women as a shield, its video game journalists trying to shift the media narrative away from their own scandals.

No, their opinions count as much as anyone else opinion.

Meaning you ignore them...

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
You do realise what NotYourShield is don't you? Women in gaming, speaking out and making their opinions heard.

Yeah, some women in gaming speaking out and making their opinions heard, and that is supposed to somehow show that GamerGate is awesome and you should not criticize it. What about this not being a shield?

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Meaning you ignore them...

I am not ignoring them any more than I am ignoring you. What do you want me to say? “Gamergate is a super-duper awesome consumer revolt that only cares about video game journalists corruption and nothing else because a woman on Twitter said so”?

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
I am not ignoring them any more than I am ignoring you. What do you want me to say?

To condemn those involved in scandals regarding corruption and collusion...

People make allegations of unethical behaviour by journalists > all you ever care about is talking about how those people are sexist.

In all the months that this controversy has been dragging on for, I've never once seen you say "Actually, that is quite a serious allegation. Journalists really shouldn't be doing that".

Ad hominem is your M.O.

Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

Because one is threats of violence indicitive of a lynch mob mentality. The other is a "Scandal" about people writing stories about toys.

The general thought seems to be mocking the people that actually had faith in game reviews.

 Polonius wrote:
Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

Because one is threats of violence indicitive of a lynch mob mentality. The other is a "Scandal" about people writing stories about toys.

The general thought seems to be mocking the people that actually had faith in game reviews.

Why are we talking only about the death threats to Women? Why not the Pro-GG Journalists who were sent syringes with the notes "I hope you use me " with them? Why does THAT always get glossed over?


The "Feminist" side shouldn't have received death threats, everyone agrees on that. But nore should the GG side, and no one seems to acknowledge that those even happened.

 Polonius wrote:
Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

The vast majority of which were made by anonymous, possibly third party trolls who have not been identified as Gamer Gaters.

And btw, people on the gamer gate side have been also been trolled, harassed, threatened and doxxed. Not that you care.

 Slarg232 wrote:

 Polonius wrote:
Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

Because one is threats of violence indicitive of a lynch mob mentality. The other is a "Scandal" about people writing stories about toys.

The general thought seems to be mocking the people that actually had faith in game reviews.

Why are we talking only about the death threats to Women? Why not the Pro-GG Journalists who were sent syringes with the notes "I hope you use me " with them? Why does THAT always get glossed over?


The "Feminist" side shouldn't have received death threats, everyone agrees on that. But nore should the GG side, and no one seems to acknowledge that those even happened.

That and it's never been proven, but people doubt some of those "death threats" ever even happened. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure some people were sent them, but the amount seems blown out of proportion.

P.S. not saying it's right, just saying that I feel in this "war between sides" a lot of gak got way out of hand.

 Polonius wrote:
Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

Because it's framed as one vs the other?

I care about both. I condemn both. But it's annoying when certain peoplw only want to talk about the former, and ignore the latter.

 jreilly89 wrote:

 Slarg232 wrote:

 Polonius wrote:
Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

Because one is threats of violence indicitive of a lynch mob mentality. The other is a "Scandal" about people writing stories about toys.

The general thought seems to be mocking the people that actually had faith in game reviews.

Why are we talking only about the death threats to Women? Why not the Pro-GG Journalists who were sent syringes with the notes "I hope you use me " with them? Why does THAT always get glossed over?


The "Feminist" side shouldn't have received death threats, everyone agrees on that. But nore should the GG side, and no one seems to acknowledge that those even happened.

That and it's never been proven, but people doubt some of those "death threats" ever even happened. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure some people were sent them, but the amount seems blown out of proportion.

P.S. not saying it's right, just saying that I feel in this "war between sides" a lot of gak got way out of hand.

Oh totally, I won't disagree with that.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

 Polonius wrote:
Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

The vast majority of which were made by anonymous, possibly third party trolls who have not been identified as Gamer Gaters.

And btw, people on the gamer gate side have been also been trolled, harassed, threatened and doxxed. Not that you care.

You still don't seem to be getting it.

I don't care about the issue at all. But I know that when you ask the average person what they care about more, "harrassment of women" will usually rank ahead "ethics in game journalism."




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Crablezworth wrote:

 Polonius wrote:
Do you know why people care more about rape and death threats to women than about the ethics in gaming journalism?

Because it's framed as one vs the other?

Not really, its because most people don't care at all about gaming journalism. You can't make them care.

Which is why, good or bad, right or wrong, people almost always side with the feminists on this one.

Most people aren't gamers. We're not talking about most people. We're talking about gamers. Gamers care.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
To condemn those involved in scandals regarding corruption and collusion...

I do not read what those journalist write, therefore I admit I tend to not care that much about them. And beside, all those “scandals” seemed quite shady. But yeah, I have a hard time considering them

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
People make allegations of unethical behaviour by journalists > all you ever care about is talking about how those people are sexist.

Well, I cared about how those people were sexist before they ever made any allegation about unethical behavior by journalists. I still do. And I will. Even if I start to take their allegation seriously I will still care about the fact they are sexist.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
In all the months that this controversy has been dragging on for, I've never once seen you say "Actually, that is quite a serious allegation. Journalists really shouldn't be doing that".

That is because I do not think I ever saw journalists clearly doing something that really they should not do.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
We're talking about gamers. Gamers care.

This thread has a couple of gamer that seem to disagree, including me.

Yeah I feel I have to point out that plenty of women are on the side of the "Anita Sarkeesian was talking out of her arse" team... probably the majority if the rest of the feminist issues are anything to go by. I mean, I pointed this out when Mel and I were talking about feminimisms image problem, its a well known fact that more women sigh and shake their heads when the feminists show up than go "yay you go sister!"

Incidentally, I feel as though the whole Fifty Shades of Grey outrage is relevant as well.

Loads of militant feminists are kicking off about it saying "Mr Gray is a rapist" when literally 99% of the market is women. Men don't read that gak, men didn't care about the movie, it was women, so they pit themselves against other women but seem to like to pretend like it is all Mattys fault even though he wouldn't read that gak if you paid him.

I am personally really tired of militant feminism, they cry about banning gak that other women like, even though they are a minority. More women like FSOG than despise it, and the majority certainly dont want to see it banned. As a libertarian and someone who believes in freedom of speech and deed I think its really disgusting the way they behave.Seriously what percentage of women want to see FSOG banned? Maybe 5% tops? Ive met loads of women who love that stupid gak, I havent in person met a single one who wants it banned. I think 3 or 4 girls at my work loved it and went to see it, and maybe 5 or 6 didnt care, but I haven't met a one who thinks Mr Gray is a penis-wielding oppressor.

Why do they get to be in charge of everything?

And when the majority of women say "don't read it if you don't like it" their only retort is "educate yourself and you will agree with me"

I think its really condescending, really arrogant, and really poisonous.

FSOG is gak, and crappy sexist games are gak, and Sports Illustrated is gak, and FHM is gak, and misogyny is really gak and I have got no time for it. As a married non-religious man with a smart and excellent wife I am all for total equality, but all of this "your hobby is against women" gak is just fething tiresome. I am really really tired of the noise this minority of really bad-tempered militant women make. As I have always said, they have a major image problem and they need to stop kicking off about minor gak if they want to be taken seriously, especially gak that 99% of the market for is bloody women!