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 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Spoiler:

This is the Dark Eldar Start Collecting. Am I alone in thinking that the Dark Eldar boxed set seems to be a much better value than the Eldar one? Sure, the Eldar set is valued in GW prices around the same as the Dark Eldar set, but the Dark Eldar set comes with ten whole miniatures more.

Depends whether you mean monetary value or model value.

The difference between the two is that you essentially trade the Farseer on Jetbike for 11 foot infantry (10 kabalites and 1 Archon). In terms of pure plastic weight, the Dark Eldar one is probably better. In terms of monetary value, both are roughly the same, which is mainly due to the farseer clampack costing way more than it should.

Then you have to think about the "playability" value. Without knowing what the Formations for each box do, the Eldar box is way better. Especially since the FAQ draft makes passangers Snap-fire if their transport Jinks.

And as mentioned, the Farseer Skyrunner can be used as a Warlock, the Fire Prism can be assembled as a Night Spinner. This means not only are the units more appealing, but are versatile. None of the Dark Eldar units can be assembled as anything other than what they are.

This could change if the DE formation is awesome AND the Eldar one is crap. But, honestly, how likely is that gonna happen?

--

 Lord Corellia wrote:

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
In terms of pure plastic weight, the Dark Eldar one is probably better. In terms of monetary value, both are roughly the same, which is mainly due to the farseer clampack costing way more than it should.

Which is one of the reasons my Eldar army fizzled and then was sold off. $40 for a single HQ choice I'll be needing at least 4 of? Ummm...Pass...

What GW is charging for a single character is crazy some days. At least he’s on a bike. The plastic monopose SM HQs are $30 each (US) so the $33 for the Farseer doesn’t seem quite as bad for a bike HQ.

Now, IMHO a monopose HQ of foot should be more like $20 then $30. Adding in the bike should maybe add another $5. But that’s another rant.

At least we can get some in bundles now. I think that is a major step from GW in realizing their prices are crazy. They aren’t lowering prices and formally admitting it, but with wide spread deals, the overall cost to play is going down.

 Nevelon wrote:
What GW is charging for a single character is crazy some days. At least he’s on a bike. The plastic monopose SM HQs are $30 each (US) so the $33 for the Farseer doesn’t seem quite as bad for a bike HQ.Now, IMHO a monopose HQ of foot should be more like $20 then $30. Adding in the bike should maybe add another $5. But that’s another rant.

For my Marines I bought up a couple of the multi-part Captains while they were still around. They were like $8 less than the ugly Ultra combi-grav clam pack Captain and combined with spare Vanguard and Sternguard parts and old metals I feel like I got my money's worth. Of course, they discontinued that kit, so...

 Lord Corellia wrote:

 Nevelon wrote:
What GW is charging for a single character is crazy some days. At least he’s on a bike. The plastic monopose SM HQs are $30 each (US) so the $33 for the Farseer doesn’t seem quite as bad for a bike HQ.Now, IMHO a monopose HQ of foot should be more like $20 then $30. Adding in the bike should maybe add another $5. But that’s another rant.

For my Marines I bought up a couple of the multi-part Captains while they were still around. They were like $8 less than the ugly Ultra combi-grav clam pack Captain and combined with spare Vanguard and Sternguard parts and old metals I feel like I got my money's worth. Of course, they discontinued that kit, so...

I did the same thing myself. Also picked up a GK strike box to make librarians. I joke that you can take a vanguard and sternguard box, shake them together and get a whole chapter’s worth of captains out of it. At $9 each, not bad for HQ picks. But when a clampack costs the same as a whole box, you can get a lot of milage out of a bit of creative construction.

When the last Eldar codex came out (not the current one) I kitbashed a jetseer out of a $20 plastic farseer and a $13 bike. So from that POV, the current one is not that bad. Still a little ouchy. It’s having to do the same thing for warlocks that really gets me.

Which is why I like to see bundles like this. It’s got stuff I need/want, at some savings.

(resists another rant on the inconsistency of GW pricing)

 Nevelon wrote:
One thing with the DE box is the redundancy of the archon. How easy is it to mod him, and how many do you need in a list? A lot of the start collecting boxes are going to generate a pile of useless HQs if you pick up more then one or two of them.

One thing with the Eldar box is the farseer on bike can be built as a warlock. Either to join the bike squad, or as part of a council.

I think that's intentional. They don't want to sell stuff TOO cheaply. Cheap starting set to hook customer good, cheap box that can be multiplied to get like 70% of army cheaply, no

Still better than nothing. Can't wait to get the eldar + battleforce! Am already thinking of scenario. Whether to have IG/eldar alliance against orks or eldar vs one of the two...Humhum. Also need to come up with rules for fireprism and wave serpent.

 Nevelon wrote:
I did the same thing myself. Also picked up a GK strike box to make librarians. I joke that you can take a vanguard and sternguard box, shake them together and get a whole chapter’s worth of captains out of it. At $9 each, not bad for HQ picks. But when a clampack costs the same as a whole box, you can get a lot of milage out of a bit of creative construction.

When the last Eldar codex came out (not the current one) I kitbashed a jetseer out of a $20 plastic farseer and a $13 bike. So from that POV, the current one is not that bad. Still a little ouchy. It’s having to do the same thing for warlocks that really gets me.

Which is why I like to see bundles like this. It’s got stuff I need/want, at some savings.

The thing that bugs me is that most of the Start Collecting! sets has a discount without considering the character, sometimes a substantial one at that (the Tau and AdMech ones are the most prominent, followed by Militarium Tempestus). The eldar box though feels like the only real discount is a "free" jetseer. At least in canada, if you discount the jetseer you only get a 10 dollar discount, which isn't much when you compare it to either the Tau, AdMech or (cross game systems) the Lizardmen/Seraphon box (which is RIDICULOUS savings).

Similarly, the Dark Eldar one feels like "buy a Raider and Reaver squad, get the kabalites for 5 and a character for free!". It just feels a bit more substantial.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
The thing that bugs me is that most of the Start Collecting! sets has a discount without considering the character, sometimes a substantial one at that (the Tau and AdMech ones are the most prominent, followed by Militarium Tempestus). The eldar box though feels like the only real discount is a "free" jetseer. At least in canada, if you discount the jetseer you only get a 10 dollar discount, which isn't much when you compare it to either the Tau, AdMech or (cross game systems) the Lizardmen/Seraphon box (which is RIDICULOUS savings).

Similarly, the Dark Eldar one feels like "buy a Raider and Reaver squad, get the kabalites for 5 and a character for free!". It just feels a bit more substantial.

At firestorm games fireprism+bikes alone are 50.4£. Start collecting is 42.5£. 8£ off plus farseer is hardly a bad deal. Especially if you can find usage for prism/night spinner(if not the deal is not that good albeit).

Alternatively you get the tank for 2£. Not too bad.

Weakest part of the set is actually by far the tank since that makes it harder to buy multiples. Something other instead and you could easily buy like 4, 5 boxes in a heartbeat. Still I doubt there's like any new eldar player who shouldn't buy at least 1 box of this. 2 isn't that unreasonable. You are buying those bikes and farseers anyway and if nothing else you should be able to sell those tanks if you really can't find use for them.

(warp spiders instead of tank and this would be ultimate "spam this box" start collecting box!)

We get far less of a saving over here in canada, which is probably why it seemed far less appealing. For you it's almost a 20% discount on the items while for us it's barely 10, and both items are rather overcosted in terms of money already. By comparison the Raider and Kabalites haven't received as much price creep (which did happen to them) so it feels like you're getting a lot more bang for your buck.

If the Fire Prism had been a Falcon I would have picked up two of these boxes immediately. As it stands now I'm going to see about finding/building/cheating a Falcon turret onto the kit when it gets here.

Don't mind a Fire Prism but I'd much rather the Falcon. I don't think it's a hugely good deal, but it doesn't have to be. My issue is that it can't be comical price gouging.

Getting the box for $64 to me is fair. Not amazing, but very fair.