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JWBS wrote:
That sounds more like an Acastus problem than anything else though. Taking 4 Knights of any type shouldn't be game-breaking no matter what the force organisation rules might be.

It's both that the acastus is under costed and given their rarity it shouldn't be possible to see 4 together.

Chopstick wrote:
The Acastus weapons stat are completely garbage made up and does not scale accordingly to the HH/8th ed rule. Range is too long, missile pod had more range, is stronger and does more shot than intended, blast is not big enough to be considered a blast weapon in AT.

Agreed, it's 40k version is nowhere near as powerful as the AT version. They're basically just really big lascannons.


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 Sherrypie wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

 Sherrypie wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:
Yeah but the multiple maniple thing has taken on a whole new dimension with custom legio rules from ryza, it's not so much multiple maniples being the prob, it's that they can be different legios that makes things a bit nuts with ryza, in addition to running 4 total acastus/asterius

Not sure I follow. How is running multiple legios any different than it has been from the very beginning? Mostly you're weakening your ability to focus and giving the other side stratagem points unless the game is over 3k points or something and you really need that flexibility for a specific plan. Also, how does that relate to the Acastii in any way?

You can maximize both legios's maniples to an insane degree given the wargear and traits and still take 4 acastus, something that's already game breaking.

Those are completely separate things, I don't get why you brought the legios up in this instance. Ryza legios also aren't that wacky. Of course you can focus more on any single aspect of the game with them, but not to any degree I'd call insane.

Because you can do both, create 2 custom legios, one for each maniple, in addition to running 4 acastus.




Back to the styrix, disappointed that voidbraker isn't per shot but per weapon, so volkite doesn't seem that great. The siege claw though is interesting because it's 2 attacks per claw, so I could see trying dual claw. Graviton doesn't seem worth it.

 zedmeister wrote:
Voidbreaker applies for each time the weapon hits?

Each volkite that causes at least a hit causes one additional hit. I thought it was per shot initially. The styrix can take two volkites, still seems sorta meh.

 zedmeister wrote:
You get 4 shots so each of those that hit gets and additional voidbreaker hit. Not too shabby. They’ll not do anywhere near as much work on unshielded targets though

It's conditional on if the weapon hits, it's not per hit. If the weapon hits, voidbraker adds x hits.

The range and the 360 arc is also a pretty nasty combination, and it's secondary weapon is barrage so not a lot of hiding from them given the 360 arc like a reaver's carapace.


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 zedmeister wrote:
Not how I read it. I read it for each hit, in a similar way to the rapid trait

Word for word "If a voidbraker WEAPON hits a target with active void shields, the target's controlling player must make a number of additional saves as shown by the number in brackets after the trait." in this case (1) so what it says is provided a weapon with the voidbraker trait hits at least once, it causes 1 additional save if the void shields are active. It's not per shot, but you're required to hit at least once against a target with active void shields to cause 1 more save. Now that's per weapon, so two volkites would each benefit once provided each one hit at least once againt active voidshields,

Hey at least dual claw on either one seems cool, lots of attacks.



I'm wondering how the atropos will work, can't see there being more than 2 in a banner, figuerd it be just one due to rarity. Given it's weapon may have the vortex trait.

 zedmeister wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

Word for word "If a voidbraker WEAPON hits a target with active void shields, the target's controlling player must make a number of additional saves as shown by the number in brackets after the trait." in this case (1) so what it says is provided a weapon with the voidbraker trait hits at least once, it causes 1 additional save if the void shields are active. It's not per shot, but you're required to hit at least once against a target with active void shields to cause 1 more save. Now that's per weapon, so two volkites would each benefit once provided each one hit at least once againt active voidshields,

See, I read that the other way. With four shots, if you hit twice, that weapon has hit twice triggering the effect twice. The community article also hints towards it as well:

These have the Voidbreaker (1) trait, meaning that enemy Titans must take an additional shield save every time this weapon hits

Also, having the Volkite weapon cause damage per additional hit fits in with how it works in 30k.

RAW it's 1 additional save if you hit, not per hit.

"These have the Voidbreaker (1) trait, meaning that enemy Titans must take an additional shield save every time this weapon hits" Meaning exactly that, if the weapon causes a hit, the titan must make one additional save. It's not indicating per hit, merely that you must cause a hit to benefit from the enemy having to take 1 additonal save. It's entirely possible we see voidbraker weapons where's voidbraker 2 or voidbraker 3. X indicated if anthing even further that it doesn't function like rapid.

Rule as intended it's possible they meant per shot, rules as written it doesn't say that.


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SamusDrake wrote:
Cheers for that, Mr_Rose.

The fluff was they're very rare and used often to combat specifically xenos. In 30k it basically can leave a 5 inch blast that ends up moving around, so hoping it gets vortex.

the_scotsman wrote:
Where can the full rules be found for these mechanicum knights?

If you pause at the right times you'll see the rules


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 Sherrypie wrote:

 zedmeister wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

RAW it's 1 additional save if you hit, not per hit.

"These have the Voidbreaker (1) trait, meaning that enemy Titans must take an additional shield save every time this weapon hits" Meaning exactly that, if the weapon causes a hit, the titan must make one additional save. It's not indicating per hit, merely that you must cause a hit to benefit from the enemy having to take 1 additonal save. It's entirely possible we see voidbraker weapons where's voidbraker 2 or voidbraker 3. X indicated if anthing even further that it doesn't function like rapid.

Again, I see it the other way. Every weapon hit triggers the effect as in every succesfull hit. I'm tempted to e-mail the Forgeworld lads, see if I get a response...

You would simply be wrong. Rulebook page 39: "If a Voidbreaker weapon hits a target with active void shields, [...] a number of additonal saves as shown in brackets after the trait." It does not say "For each hit" like Rapid does, as an example. The same is said in Quake, Concussive and so on. Knights attack with a one combined weapon at a time, so until errata'd the whole Banner gets +1 out of their Voidbreaker shots. Not too impressive, really.

So it's even worse than thought, dang. Guess it's all about them claws.


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 zedmeister wrote:

 Sherrypie wrote:
You would simply be wrong. Rulebook page 39: "If a Voidbreaker weapon hits a target with active void shields, [...] a number of additonal saves as shown in brackets after the trait." It does not say "For each hit" like Rapid does, as an example. The same is said in Quake, Concussive and so on. Knights attack with a one combined weapon at a time, so until errata'd the whole Banner gets +1 out of their Voidbreaker shots. Not too impressive, really.

I've stuck in a query so who knows if I get a response or not.

As you explain it, it makes the Styrix seem a bit shabby. Not sure why they didn't just go with rapid instead to bring them inline with how Volkites work in 30K (i.e. hits giving additional hits). A full banner would, on average with a 4+ BS would get 6+1 hits. Nice models, crap rules. Perhaps they're being cautious with the Knights after the Acastus debacle...

Still, nice models regardless of rules, and I'll have at most a banner of each with my Makabius lads.

On the plus side, there's now a 140pt all cc option if you do 4 claws. The rending and amount of attacks is decent. Also nice to regen on 6's in the damage control phase. Might fit better into some lists than lancers.

 Sherrypie wrote:
Yeah, the option for claws is an interesting one. 4 attacks per knight and one heck of a Charge isn't the worst deal if you can also run a couple of surprise Gravs in their midst to mess with your opponent's positioning for long range units to exploit. The Gravs might still be mostly for funsies, they don't really need them except to auto-Shake other knights due to Concussive.

The gravs I'm not sold on, my fear is rotating the enemy titan and losing side or rear arc or worse potentially bringing their fron arc to bear and making it so they can hit back in their activation. I like the pushing result that can cause a titan collide with stuff but it's hard to guarantee.


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 zedmeister wrote:
Don’t forget they also get to reduce the strength of incoming blast weapons as well so you can avoid a complete toasting from plasma blastguns...

Yeah, my hope would be with a 2 knight banner to just hide them as much as possible.

I can't explain how much they messed up the gun on that thing, a damn shame. The lascutter seems underwhelming, they describe it like cutting legs off of titans. Disappointed.

SamusDrake wrote:
Certainly eating those words...

Another FW release so the next GW titan should be with us shortly...

At this rate I don't want another titan, they'll just mess it up. It really feels like whoever wrote the rules for these don't play the game.

 Sherrypie wrote:
"A Strength of 6 and 3” Blast means units of smaller foes will be torn apart, and not even the thick armour of Battle Titans will be proof against such force."

Ahhahaa, in what universe
Right, that is just hilarious. I don't doubt the gun can actually do things, Str 6 can do work in numbers and so on, but to say it's something impressive in a couple of Blasts is just pure marketing spiel. For some reason these bits always seem to think low strength shots are effective against Knights.

The cutter on the other hand can be pretty nice, because that actually can be massed and the d10 does hurt. When you're looking at results of 11 on the average and more when your nippy Knights are positioned to someone's sides, piling on those attacks will kill Titans.

I just can't believe they forgot they wrote rules in the core rulebook for vortex and then didn't use them. This thing should have been an incredibly rare deadly killer and instead its a likely over costed joke. Was reading fluff of one of them cutting the leg out from one titan to have it fall into the other, doesn't seem remotely possible with these rules.


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Chopstick wrote:
Castigator got plastic but Atrapos didn't.

Great choice.

It's even more lazy for a resin kit, same leg pose as plastic one, not even an open version of the gun.

But then again, resin = wallet saved, so It's a win for me either way.

Agreed and if it was a plastic kit they'd pack in in a box of 4 anyway

Chopstick wrote:
Also these don't seem to come with the crotch banner, come on, even the plastic one on a tiny sprue had them, what's the excuse for the resin kit? Too lazy? Too incompetent?

Just checked crucible of retribution and the artwork shows the thigh armour too just like the 30k/40k model.

JWBS wrote:
Good news is that we only have Dominus and and Asterius to go now before the Knight well runs dry and they're forced to make something new for a new release.

Ya true, which reminds me I probably should paint my asterius conversion.

Chopstick wrote:
There're knight preceptor and chaos knights also.

Well if the preceptor has the same weapon as the atrapos I can see it being sorta hit and miss. Chaos knights sound awesome, but honestly hope they get their own plastic, which sadly is not likely. Probably just resin kits or upgrade kits.

Chopstick wrote:
It's not the same weapon, Preceptor las impulsor is a gun, not a melee weapon. Atrapos lascutter is a welding tool, las impulsor is more of a laser shotgun.

You had me at laser shotgun

SamusDrake wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

SamusDrake wrote:
Certainly eating those words...

Another FW release so the next GW titan should be with us shortly...

At this rate I don't want another titan, they'll just mess it up. It really feels like whoever wrote the rules for these don't play the game.

Quite surprised you would feel that way. Has the Warbringer upset that balance in the titan roster, do you think?

I dunno, I find warlords too unwieldly most of the time, so warbringer has certainly become my preference over warlord. Rapier sounds cool but warhound is about as light a titan as I want, unless it's just the same as a warhound with lighter armour/faster movement. Something conceiveable between warhound and reaver but I dunno.

 zedmeister wrote:
To be honest, we're not going to see another Titan release until at least the next book so January at the earliest. The next Engine Kill will probably have a teaser.

These knights are to fill the gaps. Shame they haven't done some of the more esoteric Titan Weapons or even just a Reaver Carapace Plasma Blastgun for example or the Saturnyne Lascutter for the Warlord

We could see a new warbringer anytime seeing as they've shown it with other arm weapons.


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 zedmeister wrote:

SamusDrake wrote:
As the Acastus provides firepower to rival a titan, maybe the Rapier is the titan's answer to the speedy-melee advantage of the knights?

That would fit in with the rumour the Raiper is supposed to represent the uncorrupted Questor and Subjugator Slaanesh Scout Titans. A pair of powerclaws would do some work:

Yeah if it was cc for arms and center gun it'd be cool. In terms of reactor and shield track, it'd have to be the same as warhound or risk being too light imo.


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SamusDrake wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

I dunno, I find warlords too unwieldly most of the time, so warbringer has certainly become my preference over warlord. Rapier sounds cool but warhound is about as light a titan as I want, unless it's just the same as a warhound with lighter armour/faster movement. Something conceiveable between warhound and reaver but I dunno.

Thats a good point as the Warhound and Acastus make up that fine line between titan and knight. As the Acastus provides firepower to rival a titan, maybe the Rapier is the titan's answer to the speedy-melee advantage of the knights?

A titan between the hound and reaver would be ideal. The reaver and hounds are our preferred titans but we'd like another option. If such a titan is released and uses weapons from either the Warhound or Reaver, we'll be pleased.

Glad to hear you have taken a shine to the Warbringer. Its point value is still steep( for a low point game ) but its stats do look good. Was hoping its price would have been inbetween the Reaver and Warlord, but sadly not to be. Still, its one we keep in mind just incase...

I've liked the warbringer more since upgrading the top to belicossa volcano cannon.

So here's hoping somehow you can just add a single atrapos to an existing banner instead of having to take two minimum. It's unfortunate that we'll have to wait until someone receives their atrapos before we see the command terminal.


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 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
For a game called "Adeptus Titanicus" there sure isn't a lot of Titans and a lot of Knights, huh?

The knights are good but the titan's are still the main attraction, the modular nature of their weapons mounts makes the game actually have a lot of playability without needing to add new models all that often.

Truly disappointing, should have been a banner of one with a bad ass vortex gun.

Okay, nothing should have the vortex rule then, which is the current state of things. Better?




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 Sherrypie wrote:

 gorgon wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:
Truly disappointing, should have been a banner of one with a bad ass vortex gun.

No, it shouldn't have been that.

Yeah, as much as I'd have liked to see something a bit more interesting with the gun, knight banners simply shouldn't start from one in any default scenario in the current mechanical framework. Cheap activations that are hard to remove due to firepower splitting should be very sparsely available for under 200 points.

It's meant to be incredibly rare, now apparently it's so rare you can take 2-4 of them in a banner. Would much rather had it been 0-1 and decently cool.

 Sherrypie wrote:

Chopstick wrote:
Vortex grenade is a thing.

It is, but it's effect is rather limited. A traditional 40k blast template doesn't even register on the scale where AT operates, and as I said, "on the scale implied in the rules" where Vortex weapons leave rolling warp holes the size of buildings on the table and hit harder than most titan scale weapons bypassing shields... just don't put that on knights, where it doesn't belong.

Just a suggestion, perhaps take a gander at the 30k atrapos rules. It literally has a chance of generating a roaming template that eats stuff, much like a vortex grenade. It wouldn't need be every shot, could be like on 6's or something. There's a description of an atrapos in the latest book killing two titans by running between them and cutting the leg of one so if fell into the other, they're meant to be quite the knight.


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changemod wrote:

 ImAGeek wrote:
I’m confused why we’re arguing about what weapons the Atrapos should have, when we know what weapons it has from 40k and neither of them are vortex weapons?

Because it has a wandering template in 30k/40k that still used templates.

Anyhow yes it can’t be *too* devastating because it’s a knight weapon in a titan game, but I think most people were expecting a literal black hole gun to be more exciting than “S6 shot”.

Exactly that.

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 Sherrypie wrote:


Regarding that leg-cutting, it's pretty good at that as is. Two attacks, hitting on 2+ rerolling ones against non-Warhound titans and from behind the you have a 60 % chance per hit to score at least Devastating hits against Reavers. A pair of those guys can rather reliably cut down a titan on Charge.

Would really have preferred it being a unit of one, one the upside apparently it comes with a thick card terminal, hoping that becomes a trend.




Reading the open engine war cards, vox screech (battlefield effects) they mention psi-titans and corrupted titans are unaffected by this rule. So hopefully we'll see some more teased on that front. The titanicus video game has a cool corrupted warlord with a tail and they're apparently attempting to release the single player campaign by xmas.

I think instead of new titan classes I'd rather see variants like lucius pattern version of the current mars titans. The classes are all pretty well spaced out in terms of scale/armour. The varients could just offer different stats at that scale, like a lucius warhound could be slightly slower but have better armour, same exact weapon options and so on.

I think regardless of a corrupted titan kit being plastic or resin, they really should consider simply a chaos plastic sprue or sprues to truly render one's legion traitor/chaos af. Late stage, like corpses hanging on chains level chaos should you wish.

Corrupted is tough if it's resin because they'll likely have to gear it towards one of the chaos gods so it's likely to look khorne or nurgle af. Again a plastic kit with a lot of bits would be preferable if one wishes to take a more individed approach or just to have variance out there.

SamusDrake wrote:
Awwww fiddlesticks. Thought I was on to something there...

I'm hoping you're right and they fix the porphyrion's terminal if/when the asterius comes out.

They'd need to lose blast or something for that tho

With the atrapos getting card terminal do we think there will be a chance fw switches the psi titan's terminal to card?

changemod wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:
With the atrapos getting card terminal do we think there will be a chance fw switches the psi titan's terminal to card?

All I know is I got a nemesis warbringer in today and now I’m a bit irked that it came with a paper thin terminal with no punched holes.

Yeah sadly the only current way to get the card one is in the box of 5 terminals.

They're slightly reformatted too I think, little smaller than the old ones.


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So bad news, either fw is lying or there was a miscommunication but no card terminal, still paper with no holes punched

 Alpharius wrote:
Along those lines, as I'm going to make a go of building my own Warlord Sinister, is there a download available of its terminal and cards, and/or are they available for purchase in one of the terminal/card packs?

It's more or less the same as the warlord terminal just different point cost and locked in left arm weapon. But I believe the armour values and pips are all the same otherwise.

Yeah it's a bit weird they won't even give us the option to self gouge ourselves. Double weird on the card front, they had no prob doing one off card prints in the warbringer's box. There's pics of the sinistre tenebre card in shadow and iron I think.