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Hello all
Last time i decided to refresh wh40k. I bought miniatures 6 years ago(i had 11 years then), and i've started repainting them this year. Also i decided to start an eldar army. So ive bulided 2 armies:
Eldar - 500
Farseer with upgrades(singing spear, runes of warding, whitnessing) -130
Squad of 10 guardians with bright lance weapon platform -110
Squad of 10 da with exarch (diresword and shimershield) - 160
Squad of 6 banshies (exarch with executoner) - 100

SM -498
Captain(storm bolter, power sword) -110
squad of 6 tactical sm withrocked launcher - 99
squad of 6 tactical sm with flamer - 89
squad of 5 terminators(storm bolters, power fists) -200

Both armies are for 500 point games and i need help. How to change those armies, maby what to buy to make them better for 500 point games?
Also im compleetly new to 40k(i had miniatures for a long time, but i was too young to paint them, and now im mostly paintng them
Sorry for mistakes, im from Poland, and im sill learning

I hope you will help
Warlordus

Welcome back to 40k! There are a few things that you should consider in the current edition when building a list, namely units with Objective Secured, and mobility. There are also a lot of heavy vehicles out there to be dealt with, but not at that points level.

I don't have much feedback for the Eldar list, I'm a Space Marine player, but I know Wave Serpents are really good; and so are Warp Spiders and their jet bikes.

Anyway, in regards to the Space Marine list, a few questions: What Chapter Tactics interest you? Is there a particular unit you like to field? Getting a sense of these things will help me help you. There are so many possibilities now for Space Marines, a 500 point list could look way different depending on your style.

For instance, here's one that uses Imperial Fists Chapter Tactics and the Sentinels of Terra supplement:

Librarian - force staff
Tactical Squad (5) - rhino, melta, combi-melta
Scout Squad (10) - bolters
Devastator Squad (5) - missile launcher x2
Thunderfire Cannon
*There are lots of bolters to take advantage of "close range bolter drill" and some devastators with tank hunter. You also have mobile troops in a transport to protect and deliver your HQ. You could easily expand this list too by adding to the dev and tac squads and adding a Stormtalon next.


If you can help me understand more about your interests and play style I can start on a list.

Hope that helps...

As Clincher said, give us some direction and that will help build a list for your SM. Are you going for Fluff-centered? Competitive? All-around fun? I can't help you with the Eldar though.

This was a list I use to use back in 5th edition. It lacks mobility, but is a pretty decent all-comers. Just needs some mobility which can be achieved if you cut down the tactical squad and give them a rhino and a drop pod for the dread.

HQ:
Librarian - 100 Pts.

Elites:
Dreadnought - 125 Pts.
w/ Assault Cannon, CCW w/ Heavy Flamer

Troops:
10 Tactical Space Marines - 175 Pts.
w/ Missle Launcher, Meltagun

5 Scouts - 100 Pts.
w/ Heavy Bolter, 4x Sniper Rifles, Camo Cloaks

Honestly, i dont know what the chapter tactics are...
I,ve painted sm for red to go as blood angels, but i wondering about red talons(they are regular sm). I've heard that blood angels are mostly close combat, and they have some special meele units...
But i think about shooting army with many tac marines packed in transports

Warlordus wrote:
Honestly, i dont know what the chapter tactics are...
I,ve painted sm for red to go as blood angels, but i wondering about red talons(they are regular sm). I've heard that blood angels are mostly close combat, and they have some special meele units...

Honestly, the best thing to do then is pick up the Space Marine Codex and give it a read. You will certainly be able to find something in there that appeals, and from there we can continue. Here is also a list of the Chapter Tactics that Forge World offers (an alternate model and rules supplier)

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/F/FWchaptertactics.pdf

I was thinking about ultramarines tactic.

Ok, awesome! There are lots of cool things you can do with the Ultramarines Chapter Tactics.

They can take advantage of lots of marines on the ground with the Tactical Doctrine, they have some great options for HQ choices, and play pretty well-rounded.

Tactical Squads are going to be your go-to units for taking objectives, and are really good with their tactics. I would maximize the use of the Tactical Doctrine (basically re-rolling failed shots from Tactical Squads) by taking a full unit of 10 with a special weapon and matching combi-weapon; they are good at being shooty rather than engaged in close combat.

I would get used to delivering them with a rhino or drop pod, whichever fits your style better.

I don't recommend taking heavy weapons on Tactical Squads because they're often moving towards objectives and you will have to snap fire them (hitting on 6's only that turn). You can always combat squad and leave the heavy weapon behind, but I prefer to keep the tactical squads together, even if that means advancing as 2 squads of 5.

Other neat tricks are using the Devastator Doctrine to give your Devastator Squads relentless for a turn; you can hide a small unit behind line of sight blocking terrain turn 1, then use the doctrine to move them out and open fire to full effect!

Other units that are really nice in low points games are Thunderfire Cannons, thanks to their versatility of ammo types and barrage... and at 100 points it's a pretty good deal!

As far as HQ choices go, if you like a lot of Tactical Marines (albeit at a higher points level) Calgar is the man... double use of one doctrine, ability to manipulate the warlord table, gives all tac marines the choice of passing or failing combat results, etc. so awesome! BUT... he's really expensive lol You also have access to one of the best psykers in the game, Tigurius. Also a bit expensive for small games, but a beast when the points limit opens up.

At lower points games you'll be sticking to a cheap HQ like a Librarian, Chaplain, or Captain depending on your army style.

Hope some of that helps, why don' t you post some units up you would like to use and we'll start building a list!

The eldar list could be fun, but it could use some work.
Drop banshees.They suck up points and are the worst units in all of the codex eldar. In there place I would take a warlock for the guardians, and then a war walker (with x2 bright lances)

Thanks for replies and help

Right now i have marines from black reach starter plus a few extra, so i have that 2 squads of 6 men. I,he heard about splitting tactical squad for 2 combat squads. Are there then 2 troop choices? What do you think about exchanging terminators for dreadnought and somthing else(assault marines maby). About chapret tactic: in each turn i can decide which doctrine i want to use?

Can i use Ultramarines chapter tactics for red talons? I mean can i choose chapter tactics for any chapter, or i mus play for example: salamander chapter tactics for salamanders chapter?

About eldar- I like the banshies models, so i would like to find a place for them, but what do you think about exchanging banshies for striking scorpions, or maby adding a wrathlord?

If you decide to make up your own chapter you can use whatever chapter tactics you want! That's one of the nice things about going generic, which is what I've done. You can test out different combinations and rules every time you play! I would recommend it. Even if you want to paint them red, you can run them as an Ultramarines successor chapter and use the Ultramarines Chapter Tactics.

As for combat squadding, you can take one unit of 10 and split them into 2 units of five before the game starts. They still only take up one force organization slot as a unit of 10, but operate independently once the game begins and they've been deployed separately.

In regards to the doctrines, yes. You can use a single new one each turn, and can only use them each once per game.

For swapping out the terminators, I'd look into an Ironclad Dreadnought if you are looking to use a walker (they are armour 13 in the front, so much harder to kill) and have some neat equipment options (like double heavy flamers!). I would stay away from Assault Marines.. long-story-short they will not impress you.

Unfortunately i only have marines from black reach starter set plus 2 tacticals at the moment.

But if my brother wants to bulid salamanders he has to use their chapter tactic?

Yeah, if he paints them up exactly like Salamanders, and if he includes any of their chapter specific units (like Vulkan) you are bound to their Chapter Tactics.

You could always just build them up as a "generic green army" and pretend they are Salamanders one day, but a different the next!

The point is, there's nothing binding you to a specific Chapter Tactics except for the special units that explicitly say so (mostly HQ choices) which is all listed in the Codex.

Pick favorite chapter color. Use that. Then whenever you want whsm. Successor of another.

So what should i buy next to marine? As i wrote, i have 12 tactical with one sergeant(when i split them combat squads i need 2 sergeants?), 5 terminators, captain and dreadnought. Next some dedicated transport, devastators? More tacticals? Baisicly i wan to made universal army, which can handle range and little bit of close combat, and i heard that ultramarines are good for that.