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Hi,
sorry for the spam, but i didn't want to hijack another person's post.

I am new to Playing Warhammer (Collected Chaos and Tau a while ago, but never got around to actually playing a game) but recently myself and 2 other friends have decided to reconnect with that part of our past and have a go.

I will be going up against Eldar and Vanilla Marines. I chose Necrons, as back when i very first started they were the ones i always wanted but didnt want to waste my pocket money on as you got more models in a box of chaos than a blister of necrons

Anyway, based solely on that childhood memory, i picked up some necrons and then made the fatal mistake of picking what i liked rather than what would make a good army. My friends and i are going to be doing a 1k Army fight just to learn the basics etc and these are the units i have, could anyone recommend a good mix that would put up a fight? Also maybe suggest areas i could improve on?

(I apologise for the char names, hopefully there is enough for you to work out what i mean!)

the Wargear i have mentioned is what is on the model, luckily the guys i am playing with are pretty relaxed so, they will let me claim it to be something else should I want.

HQ-
Nemessor Zadrakh
Vagard Obyron

Royal Court
Necron Lord x1 (War gear undecided, reccomendations?)
- Orb
Cryptek x1 (Same as above)

Troops -
Warriors x 20
Warriors x 20
Immortals x 5
- Gauss
Immortals x 5
-Tesla

Fast Attack -
Wraiths x 3
- Whip Coils
Scarab Swarm x 10
Tomb Blades x 3
- Tesla
- Shadowlooms

Destroyer/Heavy Destroyer x3

Elites -
Deathmarks x 5
Lychguard x 5

Heavy Support -
Monolith x 1
Doomscythe x 1
Doomsday Ark x 1
Anihilation barge x 1

Other (Not sure where these fit!)
- acanthrites x 3

Like i said, i bought what i liked rather than what i should have. After the 1k battle, what areas is my list week in? The problem i am facing after reading the codex is that i have no idea how things relate, i think i need to get my hands on the big rule book as well, just to get a better grasp of the game.

In short, sorry for the noobishness.

Regards,

You know what does way better than 20 Warriors? 5 Warriors + 1 Cryptek w/ the 4 shot haywire staff in a Night Scythe. That unit will kill a Land Raider in 1 turn of shooting and you have str 7 shooting from the Scythe. It also increases mobility.

Also if your going to take a big warrior squad and not go Night Scythes I would put 1 to 2 Ghost Arks in. They can res warriors and keep those units going.

I don't recommend Destroyer/Heavy Destroyer x3 . Go Night Scythes, Anihilation barge, or Ghost Arcs.

Also a Lord on Chariot is fun and very tanky. Doesn't kill a lot but that is what the rest of your list is for.

Oh no, please tell me you didn't glue the gun on that Doomsday Ark and Deathscythe!
D:
(The Ghost Ark and Nightscythe are the superior build for each)

Well, even if you did, hopefully the guys you're playing against won't mind you using them as their transport equivalents.

Apart from that, if you could proxy those 3 Acanthrites as 3 Wraiths, you'd have a full squad of one of our best CC units.

As long as you don't include thw Lychguard and Monolith (two sub-par units) you should be fine.

Thanks for your input Mythra and skoffs.

I have read a bit about Destroyers (More specifically Heavy destroyers) being too expensive,to my (untested and novice) mind, a 36" range weapon with str 9 ap 2 would be good? Granted just one shot, maybe that is their down fall?

Is cost another issue for Lychguard? I was thinking they would be a good fit to stick with nemessor, but granted 200 pts for a 5 man squad (Probably a bit more as they have dispersion shields) is excessive.

I do concede that mobility is a major oversight, I will admit that this is because bigger guns are shiny and generally make more interesting models to paint. I also figured that in straight up fights having a superior range (to marines at least... i think) would mean that i could more or less let the fight come to me. Not sure how well that would work against eldar though, as don't they get to move after their shooting phase?

My DD Ark will be getting pulled apart soon - dodgy casting/over eager filing meant it isn't going together square. while it's apart i could just make the Ghost Ark. While the Night scythe sounds good, it has a larger capacity, i read somewhere (a thread on this forum i THINK) that it was pretty useless as a transport because it couldn't hover, meaning no units could embark/disembark other than jump troops, which take up more space. This was a couple of days ago, and i have slept since then so i may be getting my wires crossed. but thats the main reason i went Doom.

Common message seems to be transports, which i will definitely focus on for my next pay check, So, as a starter-for-10 list (I cant believe i just used management buzz phrase!)

HQ:
Overlord in CCB

Troops:
Warriors x 14
+ Cryptek - Harbinger of the Storm (?)

Immortals x 10
- Tesla

Transport
-Ghost Ark
-Night Scythe

Fast Attack
Wraiths x 6
- Whip Coils
- Transdimensional Beamer
Scarabs X 10

Elites
Deathmarks x 5
+ Cryptek - Harbinger of Despair

Heavy Support
Anihilation Barge x2

(1692 points)

Does this sound good?



.

Transdimensional Beamer on Wraiths?!
NO!
Get it off, quick!
O_O
(it's a heavy weapon. Wraiths are fast. If they fire it, they won't be able to assault. You WANT Wraiths to assault.)
With Whip Coils, 3x in a unit of 6 is normally fine.

Also, you'll need more troops.
Rule of thumb usually is: 3 troops for ~1000 points, 4 for ~1500, 5 for ~2000.

As for transports, I don't know who told you that about Nightscythes, but they're dead wrong. Nightscythes are the best flying transports in the game (read the rules for Invasion Beams, they DON'T NEED to hover to drop their occupants).

How many Nightscythes do you have?
Reason being, you really want to have your Deathmarks + Despair-tek in a Nightscythe so you don't have to worry about them scattering, but you also want your troops to be in some as well.

For Doomsday Ark, to be able to fire it at full strength it needs to hold still. If it doesn't move, it's a sitting duck. Bad combination. Usually results in dead Doomsday Arks.
Yes, Lychguard and Destroyers are about 10 points more expensive than they should be for what they do.
Heavy Destroyers would be so bad if it wasn't for the fact that you're paying 60 points for a single wound, extremely vulnerable model. That's ridiculous.

 skoffs wrote:
Oh no, please tell me you didn't glue the gun on that Doomsday Ark and Deathscythe!
D:
(The Ghost Ark and Nightscythe are the superior build for each)

Well, even if you did, hopefully the guys you're playing against won't mind you using them as their transport equivalents.

Apart from that, if you could proxy those 3 Acanthrites as 3 Wraiths, you'd have a full squad of one of our best CC units.

As long as you don't include thw Lychguard and Monolith (two sub-par units) you should be fine.

I don't see how Monoliths are sub par units lol. They're the one of the heaviest armoured vehicles in the game, it has an excellent primary weapon IMO.
Acanthrites are pretty useful too. I murder units with them all the time!

 angelofvengeance wrote:
I don't see how Monoliths are sub par units lol. They're the one of the heaviest armoured vehicles in the game, it has an excellent primary weapon IMO.

They're not necessarily BAD, there's just better options (hence "sub par", or "below average").
1- Annihilation Barge
2- Sentry Pylon(s)
3- Spyders
4- Tesseract Ark
5- Doomscythe / Nightshroud Bomber
6- Monolith
7- Doomsday Ark

It can bring a C'Tan shard right behind enemy lines. Something to consider, if you have one in your list. Also, it gives reserve manipulation ability, in a sense by allowing you to pull units from reserves.

Ah cool,

I have 1 Night Scythe, but i could get another. Should i use one in instead of a ghost ark? or should i have a ghost ark for good measure? or is that just throwing points away?


I will get the beamers of, i'll be honest i didn't know about that rule for heavies - hence why i am here and asking, trying to learn!

I guess i will save the monolith to pad out for larger point battles, as there are potentially some uses for it? (The reserves thing as stated and the portal pulling).

Milkboy - what do you mean?

Having both is good. I tend to run at least one Ghost Ark for every two Nightscythes. Have been working wonderfully.

Remember: 6x Wraiths (w/ 3x Whip Coils) + Destroyer Lord (w/ Sempiternal Weave and Mindshackle Scarabs) = nasty little deathstar. You will often see that unit combo in Necron lists for a good reason.

Monoliths CAN be okay, but you tend to need to build the entire list around it to be able to make it work. You don't have the stuff yet to be able to do that.

I think Monoliths are probably not your top choice now as they do require a list built for it to maximize their effectiveness. So larger point battles like you said would be the way to go.

I was just listing some ways I would use the monolith. It's quite varied what you can pull through the portal. 6 wraiths, ten scarabs, 20 warriors. But it's risky as well, due to meltas and lances. At AV 14 it sounds strong but doesn't have the protection of say a Land Raider Archilles.

Sorry for the late reply, for some reason the email gretchens decided not to let me know someone had replied... then i forgot!

Fair dos, i will keep my monolith as a show piece then (try and paint it properly!). I think they look cool and are rather symbolic of necrons imo, I will look forward to the day i can use it in battle!

So a local GW reseller is having a major sale (up to 40% off RRP!) to make way for new stock, what should i be on the look out for? (Aside from 2 barges and another night scythe)

I wanted a destroyer lord, but i wasn't sure if they were worth it, do i have to use it as an HQ choice? OR can i have more than 1 HQ choice? (I was just thinking as a previous recommendation was an overlord in Command Barge)

Destroyer Lords are pretty worth it as they are pretty mean cc monsters when geared up. They have quite a few uses. Together with Wraiths, he can act as a bullet tank as well as give Preferred Enemy to the unit.

If you are also keen on getting Destroyers, the way I would recommend to save some money is just get 2 boxes of 3 Destroyers. You can use bits from Lychguards and Deathmarks to convert 3 to heavy Destroyers and 1 to a Lord. This would give you a DLord and a Destroyer unit.

If you don't like using Destroyers, a box of 3 can get you 2 Destroyer Lords. Some people do play two. But probably in an extreme cc list.

1 Destroyer Lord leading a unit if Wraiths & 1 Overlord on a Command Barge make for a good Take-All-Comers list HQ choice (and yes, you can have 2 HQ in your lists).

Thank you so much for this help guys! It is really appreciated that you are taking the time to help someone who knows as little as i do!

So, I will field:

HQ:
Overlord + Command Barge
Destroyer Lord + 6 Wraiths (3 Whip coils)

Troops:
14 Warriors + Cryptek (Storm)
14-15 Warriors (Should i add lord or cryptek here?)
10 Immortals (Tesla)

(+ 10 More immortals if required?)

Transport:
Ghost Ark x 1 (For the Immortals? - Will need to check they will fit... But the codex is at home!)
Night Scythe x2 (1 for 14 Warriors + Cryptek(Storm) 1 for 14-15 Warriors)

Elites:
Deathmarks + Cryptek (Despair)

Heavy Support:
Anihilation barge x 2

(Points TBC when i get home!)

Is this a good starter for 10? Where do you think i could trim some fat to get better bang for buck against Eldar and Vanilla marines?

Milkboy: I would LOVE destroyers to be honest, i think they look awesome, but if they are not worth the points on the scale i am playing i may just have to give them a miss - hopefully things will escalate to the point i have a space for them, but i am not 100% sure if that will be soon.

Warriors have more synergy in the Ghost Ark because the GA regenerated warriors. Also, the GA cannt take immortals. Immortals may be useful in scythes. They are pretty survivable so you can drop them behind enemy lines. If you play against Eldar, I think gauss would be good since trying to pen a wave serpent is pretty hard. The list has anti vehicle, fair amount of gauss for anti infantry. You have the Dlord for MC and scythes for flyers. It should be ok I think. Maybe two GA with warriors? And if you want longer range anti vehicle, can consider a destructek with the warriors on the GA. Effective range of 48.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sorry should be 42. 48 will be snap shot eldritch lance. Not great.

Suggestions:
Give the Deathmarks a Nightscythe.
Give the Immortals a Veil-tek.
Split the Warriors up like this
- 5 in Night Scythe with Storm-tek
- 5 in Ghost Ark (preferably with a Destruct-tek who has a Solar Pulse)
- all the rest walking with a Lord (Staff of Light, Sempiternal Weave, ResOrb)

I'm assuming you've read how to properly outfit your Destroyer Lord and Barge Lord, so I'll skip that part.

List could use some Scarabs or even Tomb Blades for quick objective grabbing.

Whoops... there doesn't seem to be anything here.

Unless this is a casual list and he's trying not to spam...

Ha, i forgot to list my scarabs, apologies for that (In fact i think i forgot the entire "Fast Attack" section! ... aside from the wraiths obviously)

I have 10 Scarab swarms, will they be enough?

I also have 3 tomb blades, should i max out this squad or is 3 good enough? I also gave them teslas, but not sure that was the best move.

Again, forgive my noobism, but, what is the benefit of splitting the warriors like that? is it just efficiency? (I mean less point cost but just as killy)

- 5 in Night Scythe with Storm-tek : Anti-vehicle unit. Pinpoint insert them next to a tank and they should wreck it. The Warriors are mostly just there so the Storm-tek has something to attach to, but they add extra glances in as well.
- 5 in Ghost Ark (preferably with a Destruct-tek who has a Solar Pulse) : Destruct-tek in a Ghost Ark = AV13 skimmer with 36" S8 AP2 gun, meaning anti-vehicle as well as anti-MC duty. The Warriors are again mostly there for the Cryptek to attach to, but late game they can jump out to claim an objective while the Ghost Ark motors off to claim another one.
- all the rest walking with a Lord (Staff of Light, Sempiternal Weave, ResOrb) : Warrior blob. Super resilient, hard to shift off of objectives. Typically you'd want to walk them up the table with the Ghost Ark ahead of them to provide cover, as well as to Res any Warriors who failed their RP rolls.
- Immortals and a Veil-tek : super mobile scoring. They can teleport anywhere on the table to either claim an objective, or to deny your opponent from claiming one.

Both Scarabs and Tomb Blades are good. Don't know how many you'd be able to afford to add, though. If you need to free up points, drop some Warriors where you've got extras.
3 Tesla Tomb Blades are excellent objective grabbers. Their guns are twin linked so don't care about snap firing, meaning they can jink without worry.

Brilliant! That was really helpful!

for my Warrior blob how many do you think i could cut down to? counting the 10 that have been taken by the crpteks, i have 30 models left, so i could have a max of 20 and i would have still saved 130 points by dropping 10 warriors which should help make room for some scarabs (I forget the cost). Or would it be best to have 10 warriors as backup somewhere?

Together in a single blob, you never want to go less than 15 if you've got a ResOrb attached.

You could add in another 10 Warriors somewhere, but yeah, a bunch of Scarabs would probably be better (especially if you don't have any method of transport for the new unit of Warriors)

holy cow! looks like i am finally starting to get this!

Thanks so much for your help, and thanks to everyone else too!

I think that's all my questions answered for now, but i'll be back with more soon, no doubt!

No worries! As long as you have a fun game! Enjoy!

Hey all,

Just thought i would update you with progress, and resulting question (I bet you all thought you had escaped!).

The sale at the local 40k retailer has been and gone and i got the 2 barges i needed, along with a cryptek (to make 2 in total) and a dlord upgrade kit. So i am well on my way to having that list! (Just got the NScythe and Wraiths (Unless i proxy with the arcanthrites) + 1 more Cryptek to go!). I also need to ge to work on my ghost ark, thats half built atm awaiting the arrival of some superglue debonder!

Anyway!

I have a question, as part of the sale there were a load of old blister packs being sold for dirt cheap (a friend of mine got some metal Chaplins at £3 each!) In this box was a solitary Tomb Spyder, which i couldn't just leave there as i do like the look of the unit, i got it for a whole £7! (As opposed to the £20 of the modern day Canoptek Spyder). While i got it primarily as it seemed like a good deal (more than to add to the list) would there be room for it in my list? Just at a basic glance (as that's all i have had of the rules) The ability to spawn scarab swarms and repair my barges sounds like it could be worth it. but obviously may not a priority. What do you guys think?

If you've got multiple vehicles, yeah, a repair Spyder can be useful. Just be aware they're really slow.
If you want them for their Scarabs spawning ability, it's better to have multiple Spyders.

And you have Arcanthrites?? Dude, run those! They're awesome with Destroyer Lords!

Thanks, i will (by the time this list is complete anyway) have 3 barges (1 CB 2 AB) 1 GA and 2 NS so that might quality as multiple vehicles Would 1 be enough for those? I'm not planning on buying anymore and to be honest i was just thinking of using it seen as i have it, but there would be no point using it if the one model is going to be useless.

I do, originally you (I think) Said to use them to increase my wraith squad up to 6 units rather than the 3 i have. Should i use these with the dlord instead of the wraiths? Why are they better?

Again, thanks for the help

Well, he might not be competitive by himself, but I'd try him out in friendly games (he'd follow your ghost ark around, repairing hull points and protecting your Warriors from assault).

Either of those options with a D.Lord are vicious, but you need to have the numbers to make them work (5+). Until you pick up some of either, use the others as proxies.

Awesome, i will go home and work out the points etc. I have really learnt a lot from this thread!

Ah i see, Well, i will probably just stick with Wraiths as i need CC, and my anti-Tank should be relatively sound.

just out of interest would you recommend Flayed ones? or are they just too flimsy?