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I have been looking at forgeworld and fell in love with the beautiful and cool models such as the Eldar super heavy grav tank and most recently... the Tau Manta.
I googled and looked around but I can only find the Tau forgeworld "update" rules that dont have all of their products listed, where can I find the rules for the Forgeworld units?

Also, I hear that forgeworld is GW "sister" company, so does that mean the models are legal for use in games, but you should check with your opponent to see if they wish to face FW?

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Imperial_Armour_Books

Forge world release their model's rules in their own books called imperial armour books. They are legal in games, but some players get upset about them so it's probably best if you ask if it's OK to use them.

Did you happen to see the price on the Manta?

They release books called Imperial Armour, although some of their army lists are released free on .pdfs on their website.

Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
They release books called Imperial Armour, although some of their army lists are released free on .pdfs on their website.

Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

Playing Devils advocate here. Just like what you said, is just a houserule or opinion.

If talking about what is legal, the Rule book keeps mentioning Citadel Miniatures. No where does it say Forge World, or Privateer Press or any other company that can be used with 40K. Yes FW is a Games Workshop company. You would think they would have been mentioned in the rule book. For years when GW did Tournaments FW wasn't allowed. So that shows you how "Legal" they were in their own games.

Davor wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
They release books called Imperial Armour, although some of their army lists are released free on .pdfs on their website.

Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

Playing Devils advocate here. Just like what you said, is just a houserule or opinion.

If talking about what is legal, the Rule book keeps mentioning Citadel Miniatures. No where does it say Forge World, or Privateer Press or any other company that can be used with 40K. Yes FW is a Games Workshop company. You would think they would have been mentioned in the rule book. For years when GW did Tournaments FW wasn't allowed. So that shows you how "Legal" they were in their own games.

And now Forge World is legal in GW tournaments, so what does that say about GWs acceptance of Forge World?

By your logic Black Library books are not canon. The only fluff we can go by is in GW-written books.

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
They release books called Imperial Armour, although some of their army lists are released free on .pdfs on their website.

Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

While im 99 precent sure the original post is a troll, this advice is not true. You still need permission to use them, and your goint to be very sad if you dont ask around first in your area and find out you end up with a thousand dollar paperweight, because nobody allows forgeworld against them, or is willing to let you use the manta at least.

 Orock wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
They release books called Imperial Armour, although some of their army lists are released free on .pdfs on their website.

Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

While im 99 precent sure the original post is a troll, this advice is not true. You still need permission to use them, and your goint to be very sad if you dont ask around first in your area and find out you end up with a thousand dollar paperweight, because nobody allows forgeworld against them, or is willing to let you use the manta at least.

How do you think i'm 'trolling'? I know my local store allows them for non tournaments so it wouldn't be useless, and any reason why I need permission?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Toastaster wrote:
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Imperial_Armour_Books

Forge world release their model's rules in their own books called imperial armour books. They are legal in games, but some players get upset about them so it's probably best if you ask if it's OK to use them.

Fantastic, thank you. any idea which one has the Tau army list in it?

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

Per the rulebook they require the agreement of both players, so saying they are legal in 'any game' isn't quite true. They're legal if both players agree that they're legal.

 Ghaz wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

Per the rulebook they require the agreement of both players, so saying they are legal in 'any game' isn't quite true. They're legal if both players agree that they're legal.

Which page is that on?

 Ghaz wrote:
Per the rulebook they require the agreement of both players, so saying they are legal in 'any game' isn't quite true. They're legal if both players agree that they're legal.

Everything else also requires the agreement of both players, including putting tactical squads in your list, playing lists of equal point value, etc. FW units do not require any special agreement beyond what is required for any other unit.

This topic has come up over and over again. I'd recommend the OP doing a search for them.

It's always the same every time, too. The argument basically boils down to .

Side A: GW is magic and you have to do whatever they say. If they pooped in a box, it would be legal for 40k, because it was GW doing the pooping.

Side B: That's an argument from authority fallacy. Want to make an argument based on logic? Let me know when you find where in the rules say forgeworld stuff is the same as the other rules.

And it's exactly the same every time. A deluge of people hating in favor of forgeworld, and everybody else waiting patiently for a real, rational argument.

In any case, it wouldn't hurt to talk to the people you regularly play with. It's usually not going to be an issue.

 Ailaros wrote:
Side B: That's an argument from authority fallacy.

No, you just don't understand what an argument from authority fallacy is. It's not a fallacy when the authority you're citing has the authority to make the decision. If the people who write the rules for a game say "these are the rules for a game" then that's just how it is, no matter how much you whine about fallacies.

It's legal to use.
But I would advice against the Manta unless you play a lot of Apocalypse.
It is expensive like gak and costs more points than an entire army.
Just look at the size: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Images/Product/AlternativeFW/xlarge/Manta8.jpg

Davor wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
They release books called Imperial Armour, although some of their army lists are released free on .pdfs on their website.

Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

Playing Devils advocate here. Just like what you said, is just a houserule or opinion.

If talking about what is legal, the Rule book keeps mentioning Citadel Miniatures. No where does it say Forge World, or Privateer Press or any other company that can be used with 40K. Yes FW is a Games Workshop company. You would think they would have been mentioned in the rule book. For years when GW did Tournaments FW wasn't allowed. So that shows you how "Legal" they were in their own games.

as per 7th ed rulebook rules and models can come from ANY games workshop publication which includes FW dataslates etc.. unless you wanna say WD doesnt count or the dataslates which are BL produced....

cosmicsoybean wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

Per the rulebook they require the agreement of both players, so saying they are legal in 'any game' isn't quite true. They're legal if both players agree that they're legal.

Which page is that on?

From 'Choosing Your Army':

Before any game, players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use.

That is an all-inclusive statement and covers everything from codices and Forge World to house rules.

 Ghaz wrote:

cosmicsoybean wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

 BrotherOfBone wrote:
Forge World units are 100% legal to use in any game of Warhammer 40k, and anything anyone else says is just a houserule or opinion.

Per the rulebook they require the agreement of both players, so saying they are legal in 'any game' isn't quite true. They're legal if both players agree that they're legal.

Which page is that on?

From 'Choosing Your Army':

Before any game, players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use.

That is an all-inclusive statement and covers everything from codices and Forge World to house rules.

So, technically, you have to agree whether you want to use Boltguns at all in the game. But you wouldn't do that, because that's a stupid idea! Why would it be different for anything else?

Sorry, but those are the rules. Forge World requires both players to agree, whether you like it or not.

 Ghaz wrote:
Sorry, but those are the rules. Forge World requires both players to agree, whether you like it or not.

Where does it specifically say Forge World? Why is Forge World different from C:SM? You'd have to agree that you were allowed to play C:SM, or any other codex or unit in the book.

Where does it say that it doesn't include Forge World? It doesn't. It is all inclusive in it's wording. It covers everything as I've already stated, from codices to Forge World to house rules.

Oh great.

Before this descends into another highly constructive "debate" on the legality on FW:

OP: FW is just as legal as anything else, FW is not a sister company of GW, it's a division of the company, the rules for the units can be found in the Imperial Armour books (or, in a few cases, on FW's website under the downloads section), but FW units are commonly disallowed in tournaments, stores and gaming groups.

Ask the people you play with whether or not FW is allowed.

Ever since 6th Edition at the latest, Games Workshop has been clear in its core rulebook that you can play anything you want, as long as everyone agrees.

The concept of "legality" seems very much overrated, and to be something the playerbase just came up by itself, making assumptions, presenting them as supposed truth, and then spreading them via word of mouth much like the nonsense about "canon". The game - which means its rules as well as its background - is, in the opinion of GW, much more open than a lot of players would seem to like. It almost seems as if just asking is too hard for some people.

I've always had game clubs treat Forge World like an expansion to the core game Much like you get things like Cities of Death - Forgeworld adds additional units to the core codex released by GW. Those additional contents have to be agreed for use by all parties playing the game.

And that's really how most clubs and competitions play.

Sure you can make endless "FW is part of GW" arguments, but the end result is until FW model rules are in the core codex for the factions they will remain an optional expansion content that players will agree with each other to use (or not to use) on a game by game basis.

The issue of whether or not FW is legal in game is kind of moot, the simple question you should ask is whether or not you'll be able to play a game, and whether or not that game will be fun, Some people won't want to play against them, and that's fine, that's their opinion. Others will let you play using pieces of paper you cut out yourself, and that definitely isn't legal in GW tournaments.

So, you really should ask around the people in your local area and shop if they would be willing to play against the Manta for instance, and then think about spending the money on it.

'Legal' is what you and your opponent agree can be used in your game. A better term for Forge World products IMHO is 'official', as in published by Games Workshop for use in Warhammer 40,000.

 Overread wrote:
Sure you can make endless "FW is part of GW" arguments, but the end result is until FW model rules are in the core codex for the factions they will remain an optional expansion content that players will agree with each other to use (or not to use) on a game by game basis.

And with the wording in the rulebook, even playing against a codex requires both players to agree. Don't want to play against a specific codex? By the rules if both players can't agree on the use of that codex, then the game doesn't occur. Don't want to play against Riptide spam? By the rules, if both players can't agree on the use of Riptides in the game, then the game doesn't occur. While in the past this was always dealt with socially, it was added to the rules specifically because of the frequency of the Forge World 'legality' question (IMHO).

Ghaz I suspect its simply GW trying to cover themselves rules wise and cut down on some questions; but yes everything has to be agreed upon in any game between the players - that's the same for any game.

Generally though if its in the big rulebook or the codex its normally assumed ok without having to ask these days. In the past Special characters had to be asked about using (because some were very powerful and game changing). That's mostly been dropped now so all the core codex is accepted unless you say otherwise specifically.

Expansions are the other way around; its assumed not allowed unless you ask for it .

 Overread wrote:
Generally though if its in the big rulebook or the codex its normally assumed ok without having to ask these days.

Except as noted, the actual rules say otherwise. If you're playing with an established group that's one thing. If not, it's best not to make any assumptions.

 Overread wrote:

Sure you can make endless "FW is part of GW" arguments, but the end result is until FW model rules are in the core codex for the factions they will remain an optional expansion content that players will agree with each other to use (or not to use) on a game by game basis.

Wrong. GW explicitely allows FW to be used in every standard 40k game. Get your facts straight.

Your opponent has to accept playing against FW, that's correct.

He also has to accept that I spam flyers. Or field Wave Serpents. Or play a gunline. Or field HS units.

Your opponent has to agree with EVERYTHING you field. Else there is no game. Not allowing FW units is the same as not allowing your enemy to use Fortifications. Or Fast Attack units.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Wrong. GW explicitely allows FW to be used in every standard 40k game. Get your facts straight.

Your opponent has to accept playing against FW, that's correct.

He also has to accept that I spam flyers. Or field Wave Serpents. Or play a gunline. Or field HS units.

Your opponent has to agree with EVERYTHING you field. Else there is no game. Not allowing FW units is the same as not allowing your enemy to use Fortifications. Or Fast Attack units.

Relevant rules quotes please, because the rulebook says just the opposite.

Not sure on which part.

The first is part of any FW GW publication - I don't think I need to quote that. Are you referring to the latter?