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Clarification: This isn't necessarily a thread about gets hot blast weapons and re-rolling the gets hot roll, but it is related.

So I was reading about the whole gets hot and re-rolls thing after a local guard player got very... frustrated during a game he was playing in.

I was looking for comments on something I came across in the gets hot section. It states that:

"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit (including because of BS6+, or Twin-linked), a wound is only
suffered if the To Hit re-roll is also a 1; it may also re-roll Gets Hot results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit"

My concern came from "If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit"

What does this cover?
From what I can surmise, a model with Hatred can re-roll it's to hit rolls.
A model that has an allied battle-brother Fateweaver on the table can re-roll it's to hit rolls (until the ability is used that turn)
A unit with the chrono-cryptech can use a re-roll.

The list goes on. Basically, the stipulation for the ability to re-roll only requires the ability to re-roll it's rolls to hit, correct? It never states anything else, just the ability to re-roll rolls to hit.

I feel like I'm missing something. If what the rulebook says is true, I can put a chaplin with a group of devastators with plasma cannons, who can now re-roll gets hot rolls because they have the ability to re-roll their to hit rolls?

That's why I made this post. Please help cure this madness. I can't seem to find anything that keeps this from working besides logic, except GW rules don't follow normal logic...

The rules do not require how good the re-roll is, just that the model would be able to re-roll in that situation.

So for example, if a model has Hatred (Orks) and is shooting at them with a Plasma Cannon, it would not be able to re-roll, as Hatred does not grant a re-roll when shooting.
If, however, the model in question has Preferred Enemy (Orks), then it would be able to re-roll if shooting at an Ork unit.

Your input is appreciated. Can you show me where in the BRB that you would have to be able to re-roll in that situation so I can stop blowing my mind on this topic? Thanks.

 juraigamer wrote:
Your input is appreciated. Can you show me where in the BRB that you would have to be able to re-roll in that situation so I can stop blowing my mind on this topic? Thanks.

If you aren't able to re-roll, you don't have a re-roll available.

The question is: "Do you have the ability to re-roll that die?" and Hatred doesn't allow you to answer "Yes." if you're shooting.

This is a very similar sounding topic, one that gets debated here every few months because the Rules are very... vague... on this matter.

As the Authors did not create specifics for when this Rule is triggered, and a few others that will undoubtedly come to light in this thread in time, there simply is no Written section we can refer you to on how to resolve this. However, we can point out that the Written Rule does grant Permission to Re-roll and without a Restriction preventing it from being evoked there is nothing making it's use illegal. It doesn't matter if this leads to some very interesting and broken scenarios, and it will lead to some arguments without proper discussion ahead of time, as that is something only your opponent can assist you with. Should you want to take a spot beside me, this wall is fairly soft so pounding your head against it isn't as bad....

Rigeld, I see where logic comes into play here, but are we talking RAW or RAI for the ability to re-roll in question? As far as I can tell, the only stipulation for triggering the ability to re-roll the gets hot roll in this case is if the model has the ability to "re-roll it's to hit rolls" and nothing else.

I'm not looking for an exploit, I'm looking for clarification and if the rule is as silly as it sounds, more reasons to demand a BRB FAQ.

 juraigamer wrote:
My concern came from "If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit"

What does this cover?
From what I can surmise, a model with Hatred can re-roll it's to hit rolls.
A model that has an allied battle-brother Fateweaver on the table can re-roll it's to hit rolls (until the ability is used that turn)
A unit with the chrono-cryptech can use a re-roll.

The list goes on. Basically, the stipulation for the ability to re-roll only requires the ability to re-roll it's rolls to hit, correct?

Yes. What was the specific situation for the AM player? Was it the Pask led army, with plasma-cutioner Leman Russ tanks. Pask, having Preferred Enemy allows him the re-roll to hit. Then the Gets Hot! section allows for the reroll on if the PlasmaCannons get a . Connecting the dots to keep his Executioners from Hulling themselves to death?

Juraigamer,
This lack of Restrictions has existed for many Editions now, do not hold your breath that it will be ever addressed.

 juraigamer wrote:
Rigeld, I see where logic comes into play here, but are we talking RAW or RAI for the ability to re-roll in question? As far as I can tell, the only stipulation for triggering the ability to re-roll the gets hot roll in this case is if the model has the ability to "re-roll it's to hit rolls" and nothing else.

I'm not looking for an exploit, I'm looking for clarification and if the rule is as silly as it sounds, more reasons to demand a BRB FAQ.

I'm talking the actual rules. It doesn't help when you only partially quote them.

Since you can't choose to do so with Hatred after firing a Blast weapon, Hatred doesn't grant the re-roll. You don't have the ability to. It's actually fairly clear.

While that's true for a completely un-related question, my question was simply the part concerning blast weapons and gets hot were it says:

"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit (including because of BS6+, or Twin-linked), a wound is only
suffered if the To Hit re-roll is also a 1; it may also re-roll Gets Hot results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit"

It never talks about this needing to be an ability to re-roll a shooting attack, though that can be inferred via RAI.

Since hatred grants the ability to re-roll hits (even though they are melee attacks) it still qualifies as an ability to re-roll it's hits right? There's nothing I can find in the Gets Hot or Blast weapons that states otherwise. I'm only trying to discuss the way that the Get's hot section is worded, unless someone can (hopefully) prove it must be a re-roll for a shooting attack.

 juraigamer wrote:
While that's true for a completely un-related question, my question was simply the part concerning blast weapons and gets hot were it says:

I've answered that.
"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit " means you have to ask yourself this question:
"Do I have the ability to re-roll this To Hit roll?" With Hatred and a shooting attack, the answer is distinctly no.

In the back of the AM book it specifically states that preferred enemy allows you to reroll gets hot. I only get digital versions now...


As far as RAW... I would say that if you have a reroll to hit, then you can reroll gets hot...

RAI and HIWPI - If you have a rule stating that during the shooting phase you have the ability to reroll to hit, then you can reroll gets hot!

A vehicle instead suffers a glancing hit on a further roll of a 1, 2 or 3.

If Pask (or whoever) rolls a 1 on his gets hot roll for firing a plasma cannon/etc on a vehicle, then he gets a reroll of the gets hot result, and per the rules:

A vehicle instead suffers a glancing hit on a further roll of a 1, 2 or 3.

Having a twin linked plasma pistol or whatever does NOT give you a reroll to hit in CC because to trigger the gets hot/twin linked reroll you need to:
[quote When firing a weapon that Gets Hot,

rigeld2 wrote:

 juraigamer wrote:
While that's true for a completely un-related question, my question was simply the part concerning blast weapons and gets hot were it says:

I've answered that.
"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit " means you have to ask yourself this question:
"Do I have the ability to re-roll this To Hit roll?" With Hatred and a shooting attack, the answer is distinctly no.

You just answered it for me. If the phrase included "re-roll this to hit roll" then we wouldn't be having this discussion. Instead it states "re-roll it's rolls to hit"

I'm sorry if I am coming across as difficult, but the more I look at this specific rule, the more I see a very stupid reason that having the ability to re-roll for any reason lets you re-roll the gets hot roll.

Lets back up. Were can I find a rule that tells us this gets hot rule re-roll must be a shooting re-roll?

 juraigamer wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 juraigamer wrote:
While that's true for a completely un-related question, my question was simply the part concerning blast weapons and gets hot were it says:

I've answered that.
"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit " means you have to ask yourself this question:
"Do I have the ability to re-roll this To Hit roll?" With Hatred and a shooting attack, the answer is distinctly no.

You just answered it for me. If the phrase included "re-roll this to hit roll" then we wouldn't be having this discussion. Instead it states "re-roll it's rolls to hit"

I'm sorry if I am coming across as difficult, but the more I look at this specific rule, the more I see a very stupid reason that having the ability to re-roll for any reason lets you re-roll the gets hot roll.

Lets back up. Were can I find a rule that tells us this gets hot rule re-roll must be a shooting re-roll?

Context. What's causing the Gets Hot rule to be invoked - a shooting attack or a close combat attack?

Well of course it's a shooting attack, and logically you would refer to shooting rules to handle this. I just can't see a rule that tells me this (or I'm blind)

Lets ignore the hatred thing for now. If a team of plasma cannon havocs have an allied fateweaver on the field, do they have the ability to re-roll their attack rolls? If so, can they re-roll the gets hot roll until fateweavers re-roll is used that phase?

 juraigamer wrote:
If a team of plasma cannon havocs have an allied fateweaver on the field, do they have the ability to re-roll their attack rolls? If so, can they re-roll the gets hot roll until fateweavers re-roll is used that phase?

They don't have the ability unless Fateweavers ability is used. If you say they do, please cite the rule giving them that ability.

The havocs themselves do not have the ability to reroll their to hit roll. Fateweaver does.

 juraigamer wrote:
"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit (including because of BS6+, or Twin-linked), a wound is only suffered if the To Hit re-roll is also a 1; it may also re-roll Gets Hot results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit"

My concern came from "If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit"

You are confusing this rule a lot it seems.

"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit" does not in any way grant you a re-roll.

That entire rule you quoted does not grant you a re-roll.

That rules states that "if the To Hit re-roll is also a 1" you don't suffer a wound. IE If you use a re-roll, you get an added bonus from this rule (not suffering a wound). Nowhere does the rule itself grant one.

 BlackTalos wrote:

 juraigamer wrote:
"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit (including because of BS6+, or Twin-linked), a wound is only suffered if the To Hit re-roll is also a 1; it may also re-roll Gets Hot results of 1 for weapons that do not roll To Hit"

My concern came from "If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit"

You are confusing this rule a lot it seems.

"If a model has the ability to re-roll its rolls To Hit" does not in any way grant you a re-roll.

That entire rule you quoted does not grant you a re-roll.

That rules states that "if the To Hit re-roll is also a 1" you don't suffer a wound. IE If you use a re-roll, you get an added bonus from this rule (not suffering a wound). Nowhere does the rule itself grant one.

^this Nothing about the rule is granting a re-roll, it's just holding off judgement of the Gets Hot effect until a re-roll (IF you have one) is resolved.