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My regular opponent just painted up a Land Raider Kroosader. Dat's da big tank wiv all da gunz on it. He must have been pissed after the beatdown I gave his Marines in our last game!

We are just getting back into the hobby and we only have enough painted miniatures to play roughly 1000-pt games. I have mostly footslogging boyz with a few bikes and buggies. I am thinking all the anti-infantry firepower on that thing will whittle my boyz down pretty quickly, even with my Painboy. The only things in my army that can penetrate the armor are a few rokkits and the power klaws. The Warboss can wreck it, but even a nob charging will have a tough time and that is assuming he can survive the firepower to get close enough. So what are my options?



The usual Ork response to a super tough unit is to just tarpit it with expendable models and keep it from contributing to the mission objectives. So I started wondering if this tactic was viable against vehicles. Could I use a few empty trukks (after dropping off the boyz) or buggies to park in front of it and keep it from moving where it wants to go? If it tries to ram through, then it has to move in a straight line only and fire Snap Shots, right? And the Termies inside can't disembark? If it shoots "through" the vehicles at my boyz, they get a cover save for an intervening unit, right? If the Land Raider targets my empty trucks or a barebones buggy with an entire turn of shooting, that is a win for me as the damage it can deal is limited to 25 - 35 pts per turn, assuming all the guns have to shoot at a single trukk. Does anyone have any experience with this tactic? Let me know your thoughts.

Another idea would be to try some wreckin' balls on the trukks so they can cause some damage to the tank while tarpitting it and help ensure he doesn't try to just ignore the empty trukks. I know with d3 S9 shots at BS 2, I will only land an average of 0.22 hits that glance or penetrate per turn, but it is vastly better odds than just shooting rokkits! I see a lot of folks on here take rams for their trukks, but I can't see how that would help me much against Marines that automatically rally from a Tank Shock and have vehicles mostly too tough to hurt with a S7 ram attack. I never see anyone take wreckin' balls, but do they have a place in this tactic?

Please help out a fellow Ork player against those weedy beakies! Thanks!

The thing is they don't take the rams to tank shock (unless it's after dropping off their boyz), they take them to reroll dangerous terrain and hopefully not get immobilized. A useful upgrade for just 5 points, and I know I take it every time.

Land Raiders are a bit of a pain. AV 14 can really be a bane to Orks in general as we already have a difficult enough time with the likes of AV12 a majority of the time. Honestly, Land Raiders are not a thing we should really worry about TOO much. They are expensive and used mostly just to tote termies or their ilk around. Yes, they can have some spooky guns on them, but they are often wasted points on Ork armies mostly due to how little armor we often bring. Wasting TL S8 shots on Boyz is just wasteful.

Every time I've faced a Land Raider, I really just ignore it, and focus my attention on other things, or I get my units stuck in as quick as I possibly can so the LR can't make pot shots at my boyz/bikes/koptas or the times I bring my Kanz.

You could try to play interference with Trukks/Buggies to cut off travel paths and force him to expend his shots on cheap, weak vehicles or otherwise give you cover saves. I wouldn't waste points on the Wreckin' Balls as if you're going to use them as sacrificial lambs, keep them as cheap as you possibly can.

If you're really wanting to try to wreck the LR, you could TRY using Mega Nobz will Killsaws to try to hack them open, but you might face the wrath of the LR occupants if they haven't dropped them off, or if they fail to kill the LR, it will just away, you might get some insa dead Manz if they decide (and they'd be foolish not to) shoot their big ol gunz at them in retaliation.

Basic tips: Stay out of the Land Raider's sight. Use blocking terrain on your board to hide behind. Keep the Land Raider's juicy armored targets out of it's retacle by distracting it or by getting it's primary target stuck into combat before they get in range to shoot them. Otherwise, just ignore it as we have very little effect on that armor. Even Tankbustas can have a rough time with glancing it to death.

Thanks for awesome and in-depth reply, Malevolence. I agree with everything you said. If it was just twin-linked lascannons I would ignore it for sure, but the Crusader is harder to ignore due to the Hurricane Bolters and TL Assault Cannon. If he's within 12" he can put out something like 16 twin-linked shots plus another multimelta shot. That will wreck my boyz mobs and light vehicles in no time!

I think I'll need to invest in some Mega Nobz after Christmas!

It's more tricky to deal with at 1k pt games.

MegaNobz is one way to do it, Tankbustas is another. They'll make short work of it in combat. Just need to keep their Trukk alive for a turn (you can get a 2nd turn charge with anything in a Trukk quite easily).

Nobz in boyz mobs with a powerklaw is one way as you know, 4 Str9 Attacks on the charge isn't bad.

I learned to play warhammer with orkz and recess was with a friend who put two DA LR Redeemers on the table with a Vindicator in the middle.

I learned really quick that I wanted a power klaw in any squad that could take it... That was the only thing our old codex could really do to them, if you didn't blow it up it backed up and put two flame templates on your boyz in the edition where the 24" Storm Bolter or w/e on top made flame templates kill for days.

The most important thing to know is that the Land Raider is a very expensive turret with a very expensive (usually assault based) unit inside. Smart, meta friendly, strategies involve moving around it and assaulting any of it's support. If you take it head on the ideal thing is 6 Tankbustas in a trukk (on the assault with tankbusta bombs), 3 Meganobz (with killsaw) in a trukk, Big Mek with a Killsaw, Warboss with a Powerklaw. If you fielded one you might run a deffdread or other such walker at it in hopes that the Land Raider won't vomit it's contents onto your slow walker. In bunches of at least two you might try boyz with a PK nob or other such unit.

I'd not change a list to counter a single landraider. In all fairness, if it's not a dark angel landraider with dakkabanner it's damage output is rediculously low. Just mathhammer it. 6 tl bolter shots from afar ~ 2-3 wound or 12 tl bolter shots up close ~ 4-6 wounds but it's in a danger of getting powerklawed this way , 4 tl AC shots ~3 Wounds. Before cover or fnp. Even if he's shooting boyz in the open without a painboy, he's killing around 5-8 boyz. And when you factor in cover and fnp, he's killing 2-5 boyz. With a vehicle that costs like a landraider so much.

The stuff inside is more dangerous.

But if you feel you got to absolutely wreck landraiders, give saws to your meks. This extra 3 s7 armorbane attacks paired with 4 s9 attacks will almost guaranteerly cripple it hard or plain destroy it. And they're not bad at killing 2+ / 3+ guyz without a need to sacrafice a character in challenges. Just deny, nob doesn't strike - you got 1 less ap2 attack but you still strike and noone needs to die in challenges for no reason.

A friend of mine plays orks, and I've seen him get pretty good use from tankbustas. Yes, it's really risky getting them up close enough to do anything to it, but they'll crack it open quick enough.

Alternatively, the suggestions of duck and cover are very sound. In general, big guns can't hurt you if you're out of los (barrage excluded). Kill everything around it, take all the obectives, and when it does happen to spit out its terminators hit them with dakka. While it isn't as satisfying as blowing the thing up, it is good if you're being competitive.

Thanks for all the advice. To summarize, it sounds like the favored option is to ignore it or avoid it. Second choice seems to be to go after it with Power Klaws, Killsaws and Tankbustas. Those both seem like sound tactics. Koooaei, I like the idea of nob with klaw and mek with saw working together. Sounds like I need to get a mek converted and painted up quickly for our next game. What model do you use as a base for a mek with saw? Maybe a burna/loota model with the buzz saw arm from the nob box?

I guess no one was too keen on blocking the LRC out with low-cost vehicles. I still kind of want to try this approach just to slow it down and frustrate my opponent into making poor decisions. He'll have so many points tied up in the unit that if I can keep it away from the main action for even a few turns, it would give my army a huge advantage against the rest of his force.

I greatly appreciate everyone's input. Thanks and Merry Christmas!

The Riddle of Steel wrote:
Thanks for all the advice. To summarize, it sounds like the favored option is to ignore it or avoid it. Second choice seems to be to go after it with Power Klaws, Killsaws and Tankbustas. Those both seem like sound tactics. Koooaei, I like the idea of nob with klaw and mek with saw working together. Sounds like I need to get a mek converted and painted up quickly for our next game. What model do you use as a base for a mek with saw? Maybe a burna/loota model with the buzz saw arm from the nob box?

I guess no one was too keen on blocking the LRC out with low-cost vehicles. I still kind of want to try this approach just to slow it down and frustrate my opponent into making poor decisions. He'll have so many points tied up in the unit that if I can keep it away from the main action for even a few turns, it would give my army a huge advantage against the rest of his force.

I greatly appreciate everyone's input. Thanks and Merry Christmas!

I use barebones meks. Basically, blackreach boyz with some self-made wrenches and welding masks. They're mandatory for dying in challenges while your more valuable HQ with power klaws do their thing. Also, as a character for mob rule in case your nob gets barraged to death.
Killsaws are quite expensive costing you 30 pts on a 1-wound 6+ guy with 2 base attacks. But if you count in armor-bane, they're statistically better at penetrating thicker armor than pk nobz. s7 + 2d6 instead of s9 + d6. So, yep, they're reasonable vs landraiders and knights. And not completely worthless otherwise. But i just have a warboss with DLS and paired with nob he ruins landraiders anywayz...so, it's up to you.

If you want a killsaw mek without much trouble, just take a rebular boy with a chainsword and paint it differently. Or you could use a chainsaw/harpoon hand bit from nob'z box if you have one. Or simply make it yourself using something with kinky edges. The main thing is that you must believe that it's a chainsaw. And it will be one.

Take killa Kans dude.

Big Guns or walkers.

 Xenomancers wrote:
Take killa Kans dude.

While I do have a soft spot for Kans, they are a terrible choice against a Land Raider.

They can't damage it at all in close combat, and only if they take Rokkits/mega blastas can they glance it. They can't score a pen.

 Xenomancers wrote:
Take killa Kans dude.

Kanz are s7. The best thing they can do is glance a raider with a rokkit or kmb.

I know this thread is old now, but I wanted to post an update on how my Orks did against that Land Raider Crusader.

If you are interested, go check out the Battle Report:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/630654.page


Thanks again for all of the advice, everyone!

Tankbustas in a trukk will get the job done cheaply. The occupants of the vehicle will either slaughter them in response or ignore them in favour of scarier threats.

Three meganobz in a trukk with a single pair of killsaws will be even more effective. They will probably get wiped out by the terminators inside, but they will still do a lot of damage in return because of the number of attacks they have.

IMHO I wouldn't rely on boss nobs' power klaws to do it unless the opportunity really presented itself. Use the boyz to attack weaker targets. As people have said, land raiders' resilience far exceeds their actual damage output, for the most part.