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Hey Guys!

Hi just bought a huge army of IG from a friend to add it to mine ;-)

Got more then 250 guard, 25 Heavy weapon team, 4 squad of vet, 4 chinera, 10 russ, a basilisk, a wyvern, 2 banewolf and 10 sentinel and some other things...

Hi play Orks for 3 years now after putti g my IG army on a shelf cause i was happy to change style of play. I want to get back to it with my Guars so i bought the new codex.

I know their is a few tank tctics thats seems competitive, and its seems to have a few hordr army tactics and build that seems good.

Can anyone give me some tips to build a good competitive list without thinking of the models ( I really have nearly every combinason possible).

Thanks!

And may the emperor be with you!

Here's the way I use mine:

1. I want the Priest in the 40 man Infantry Platoon.He does infinite amounts of good things for them. the Zealot ability is tremendously important and valuable. It's also Dirt cheap and totally worth it. In melee he turns their STR 3 attacks into a murderous hurricane of blows on the charge and after the charge he helps you ground and pound the enemy unit into inevitable submission I don't find more than 40 Guardsman serves much purpose other than to soak up points so I keep it at 40. There actually IS such a thing as too much of a good thing. 50 man units are too many. 30 too few.

2. A Psyker in each Infantry unit is important. Not only does it provide important Deny the Witch bonus's, but having a level 2 Psyker provides the unit with the ability to get Forewarning which is a very good power for them. I take all three Psykers for this reason. They also happen to come with Force Weapons, which in no way sucks, and they actually have decent stats for IG. This added power weapon to what is already a pretty beefy hammer of a unit is just one more frustration for an enemy deathstar.

3. My Infantry units come with 4 LasCannons and 4 Power Axes. I suppose if you like you could add the grenades to the unit although the unit already clocks in at a healthy 340 points without that so it's up to you on that one.

4. The final bow on the gift is to add Ironhand Straken in his command vehicle. Furious charge and Counter attack on the units near him is absolutely NO JOKE. Straken is both not cheap AND worth it nonetheless. He stresses your army out when it comes to spending that much on such a little and relatively uninvolved unit, but the good he does in a majority of MY games has been immeasurable.

So with that setup you have your troops and HQ, with a stack of buffs a mile high. I can't lie and say it's inexpensive points wise. I can just say that the cost is justified.

Now the other thing you absolutely cnnot skimp on is Anti-Air capability. The blob is highly exposed to FMC spam, in particular Tzeentch, as well as the high rate of fire armies that can rain death from the skies. a Flight of VoidRaven Bombers can make any blob cry out and be suddenly silenced as well. You have got to give due respect to these kinds of things because at top tables you'll be seeing them.

The Hydra Flakk Batteries are indispensible additions to the force. Take three, and certainly no less than that. Keep the Heavy Bolters on them so they can influence the battle when the aerial targets arent yet on the board and remember that certain powers like Misfortune can be quite useful when firing at flyers with STR 5 Heavy Bolters and of course as an emergency anti-air countermeasure, STR 3 lasguns en masse when and if it comes to it as well. Oddly, Misfortune even allows thoe lowly Hydras to dink and dunk at the AV 14 that's on the board if there are no better targets. Worth a shot to at least begin the whittling. Dont count on it but its a definite point to be made.

Once anti-air, the HQ and the infantry are settled, It's time to look at the rest of the force. But that's how I would start any infantry based Imperial Guardsman.

Nice! Thank you!!!

You play it defenssive or ofenssive ? You run your guards and try to charge as soon as possible or you want them to move till their in range to shoot twice wìth rapid fire ? Or you stay back field and wait that your enemy come ?

With the 4 lascanon in the 40 man squad i imagine you stay back field and you try to put them to cover? Do you use cheap conscript for cover?

It really change a lot since 4th edition, it really becaume possible to do a big horde! Even biger then Ork (execpt the green tide formation).

A lot of the above is very true indeed. You do want to be throwing Priest and Psyker buffs on any unit of greater than 30 men, and then building on this with Orders and supporting units. So rather than cover the basics that have already been outlined, here are some of my favourite units for Foot Guard:

For any foot list, there are a few units you'll want to make heavy use of, and others that are more for filling specific gaps.

The Regulars:

Platoon Infantry Squad, Lascannon, Meltagun: Clocking in at 80 points for just one infantry squad, this might seem expensive, but when you're taking multiples of them and buffing them with Orders and other command options like psykers, it's easy to see where the value is. Guard excel at bringing more of a given weapon than the enemy can deal with, and in this setup, 3+ squads combined will put out enough firepower to down tanks at range, and with the meltas, threaten anything that comes close. These are probably the staple of a FootGuard list.

Platoon Command Squad, 4 Flamers: this unit, as well as providing valuable orders to the Infantry units they come with, also makes a great counter attacking squad. It is a reality that the enemy, if they are trying to, will break your line at some point, and the best way to greet them is with 4 Flamer templates right behind the Infantry. This puts out enough damage to kill or cripple almost anything that gets through, from an Ork Horde to a Terminator Squad, and if they try to charge you, a potential 12 automatically hitting Overwatch shots. At 50 points, this unit is to good to dismiss, especially as you have to take them anyway to unlock Platoons.

20-30 Conscripts, Priest: possibly one of the best points-to-effectiveness objective holders in the game, 21+ Fearless wounds is nothing to be sniffed at for as little as 85 points, not to mention the fact that, should you need to fix bayonets and get stuck in, they will be rerolling hit and possibly wound or save rolls, which can be quite the shock. Their cheapness also offsets the relatively expensive Lascannon/Melta Infantry Squads.

These three will form the core of most Foot Lists, and you can use the units below to plug meta/army specific holes.


Special Weapon Squad, 3 Sniper Rifles: Clocking in at only 36 points, they are the cheapest Objective Secured scoring unit in the book, and, when mixed in with larger squads, can cause some interesting target priority issues for the opponent. Do they shoot the larger squads, leaving the SWS to score untouched, or do they target the SWS, probably overkilling them, and leave the blobs alone? Taken in multiples, they can also do a good job of removing Special Weapons or taking wounds from MCs.

Veteran Squad, 3 Melta/Plasma, Grenadiers: This unit offers several things over the Platoon at the cost of some durability and ablative wounds. They have a better point-to-damage/footprint ratio due to the extra Special Weapons they can bring, and shoot them at a higher BS, so will land more hits. They concentrate this firepower into a much smaller footprint, and so are easier to hide and you are more likely to have the weapons where you need them against a given threat.

Tempestus Scions squad, 2 Plasma/Melta, 5-10 Men: While not packing as many special weapons as a veteran squad, the Scions bring something arguably more valuable and certainly harder to come by in a foot list- mobility. Deep Striking a squad or two of these can not only threaten enemy assets with a hail of Special Weapons fire, but also allow you to put units right in the enemy territory, diverting attention and possibly scoring Malestrom objectives in the process. Often, an opponent will not expect this type of reach or aggression from Foot Guard, so Scions can be a very nice trick to have up your sleeve.

Ogryn squad: Much like Veterans, Ogryn largely offer what the Infanty Squad does in a more concentrated form, but instead of the upgrades, they reflect the anti-infanty firepower and sheer wound count of a combined infantry squad on a much smaller footprint. This makes them ideal units to counterattack or spearhead an advance, able to dish out and absorb damage without leaving a gaping hole in your battle line.

Aegis Defence Line: Quite simply by providing a 4+ Cover Save, this fortification doubles the survivability of the Guardsmen behind it against most guns. It does bring a drop in mobility as it can force you into a fairly static position, but if you were planning on remaining still it can invaluable.

Yeah, the defense line look very good. i really want to put them in my list if i have a few Heavy Weapon teams and/or some tank with camo.

For a CCS, I really like to keep my warlord cheap and safe. I like a mortar and a MoO. They can just hide out of los and plink away while giving orders.

 calarok wrote:
Nice! Thank you!!!

You play it defenssive or ofenssive ? You run your guards and try to charge as soon as possible or you want them to move till their in range to shoot twice wìth rapid fire ? Or you stay back field and wait that your enemy come ?

With the 4 lascanon in the 40 man squad i imagine you stay back field and you try to put them to cover? Do you use cheap conscript for cover?

It really change a lot since 4th edition, it really becaume possible to do a big horde! Even biger then Ork (execpt the green tide formation).

I play very aggressively with mine. As long as you dont move the Lascannons themselves, they can fire normally every round until youre forced to move them. Just trail a couple dudes back as needed. So no I dont stay in the backfield at all.

I dont use conscripts for cover. I try and use my Psykers powers for cover and failing that, you can use your tanks for cover. But I definitely am aggressive with them.

 Jancoran wrote:

 calarok wrote:
Nice! Thank you!!!

You play it defenssive or ofenssive ? You run your guards and try to charge as soon as possible or you want them to move till their in range to shoot twice wìth rapid fire ? Or you stay back field and wait that your enemy come ?

With the 4 lascanon in the 40 man squad i imagine you stay back field and you try to put them to cover? Do you use cheap conscript for cover?

It really change a lot since 4th edition, it really becaume possible to do a big horde! Even biger then Ork (execpt the green tide formation).

I play very aggressively with mine. As long as you dont move the Lascannons themselves, they can fire normally every round until youre forced to move them. Just trail a couple dudes back as needed. So no I dont stay in the backfield at all.

I dont use conscripts for cover. I try and use my Psykers powers for cover and failing that, you can use your tanks for cover. But I definitely am aggressive with them.

Good points here. I don't have my codex with me but one of the orders also allows you to shoot all your weapons, including the las canons and get a D6 move forward. You won't get anywhere fast but it is an option some times when you want to advance and lay down some covering fire.

Yes the Orders make IG blob aggrerssion very easy and since movement is done per model the Lascannons need not even move at first, though the shoot and run order does permit it.

Whats the best psyker power you can use in tbe Horde army? Is it worth the point to take the psyker lvl 2?

Never played with psyker before...

You could ally in a psycher xeno inquisitor with nades and/or Azrael, put them in a platoon of 50 men and roll across the board murderisng everything in mellee. 3-4 Power axes, 20-30 krak nades and a couple of meltas and you're good to go.

 koooaei wrote:
You could ally in a psycher xeno inquisitor with nades and/or Azrael, put them in a platoon of 50 men and roll across the board murderisng everything in mellee. 3-4 Power axes, 20-30 krak nades and a couple of meltas and you're good to go.

This is my favorite way to use horde guard. Azrael gives the entire unit an invulnerable save, and the mandatory 5 tacticals (what I use for the troops of the allied detachment) are good to sit on home objectives. Normally I'd never run 50 man units but with Azrael it's a good way to get the most out of his points. Which, are a LOT. The drawback is that if you don't use your points effectively, Azrael will hinder you more than help.

Of course, Psykers give you a chance at a 4++ anyways with divination which could make Azrael redundant.

Edit: spelling, using a keyboard that knows italian not English

 calarok wrote:
Whats the best psyker power you can use in tbe Horde army? Is it worth the point to take the psyker lvl 2?

Never played with psyker before...

Its been worth it in all my games.

I prefer a commissar. I usually run my blobs as a gun line. Commissar lets me go to ground while still pretty much benefiting from fearless. Also, stubborn is awesome and so is his leadership for receiving orders.

going to ground with 40 dudes? No thanks. Not me. Not if I have forewarning

Another thing that was always a favorite of mine is to take an Ordo Xenos inquisitor at mastery level 1 and with rad and psychtroke grenades. Runs in at 85 points or so, but you get a force weapon, 2 absolutely fantastic grenades for assaulting with weak guardsmen and hammerhand on the entire unit. If you can get furious charge you will have strength 5 guardsmen on the charge with the enemy at -1 toughness.

So many options. Those blobs are just begging for add ons.

I'm planning to run 30 conscripts with comissars down each flank of the board and a 30 man combined squad with meltabombs, krak grenades and a priest down the middle of the board.
Behind each conscript squad I plan to run a PCS with grenade launchers to provide first rank, second rank.
This comes to 550 pt.

I expect that this will give me good board control through the footprint of three blobs, and each blob can put down a SM combat squad if in rapid fire range.
I have not yet tried this tactic, as I am still painting my conscripts, but I have faith that this will work. ;o)
I anyone has an opinion upon the proposed tactic, please let me know.

I think it's going to run into three REAL isues.

1. They're not fearless. the commissar Lord helps but does not guarantee.

2. Deployment. If you go first, the enemy can simply strong side you and wipe one blob at a time out as they come to them. They may never need to engage. So your plan requires lots more plans in it to make this work but just pointing out a fairly obvious piece of the puzzle. Your ranges, firepower and accuracy are inferior to most of the things that will do this to you and once its done the other two blobs pretty much literally cease to matter as long as the enemy has a plan in place to assure contesting is posible at games end.

3. the unit down the middle has melee on its mind but because of isue number two, it would be out of position to do much more than help EVENTUALLY with one squad and only if its strong enough by then. Again there are solutions to this but leaving the unit with only one purpose when it can have two seems an unwise course.

Cthugha wrote:
I'm planning to run 30 conscripts with comissars down each flank of the board and a 30 man combined squad with meltabombs, krak grenades and a priest down the middle of the board.
Behind each conscript squad I plan to run a PCS with grenade launchers to provide first rank, second rank.
This comes to 550 pt.

I expect that this will give me good board control through the footprint of three blobs, and each blob can put down a SM combat squad if in rapid fire range.
I have not yet tried this tactic, as I am still painting my conscripts, but I have faith that this will work. ;o)
I anyone has an opinion upon the proposed tactic, please let me know.

Just add a priest to each squad. Priests are spectacular in hordes and heavily outperform commissars.

What point level will you be fielding this at?

I did advise him to use the Priests. Exceptional for their cost.

@Kodi I am planning this for 1750, I am trying to sqeeze them in at 1500, but I'm not happy with my 1500 pt list at this point, so lets say 1750.

@Jancoran
I disagree that a Priest is better than Commissar with a conscript blob.
I would rather have my priests with my infantry squads or veterans than spend them on my conscripts.

I do not understand how Fearless is better than Stubborn and Summary Execution, on a 10+/2d6(~16%) I do loose a 3 pt model to pass my moral tests, but that is negligible.
I can detach the priest if the blob is decimated, but what are the odds that a suitable squad is near the priest at this point, I really doubt how often this is actually going be useful.
So for conscripts I believe the Commissar is the better choice.

I agree that I am vulnerable to a strong side attack in my front rank, but unless you castle this will always be the case.
And ignoring a 30 man object secure squad on the other flank may turn out to be a bad idea, depending on the mission.

I do agree with your last point, and this is my biggest concern. Will I be able to make this work?
The intention is that the infantry can support the conscripts, but they are not exactly mobile.

I am going for a list where I try not to cover too many roles with each unit, this is to field MSU.
I am looking forward to fielding this list and seeing how it works.

Have you real what the Priest does?

ZEALOT on a blob is fan-freaking-tastic. THAt ALONE puts it heads and tails above. You can stuff power weapons into the unit til the cows come home so it isnt as if you have a shortage of options if that's why you want stubborn instead. unless you're going to ground...

Since you're looking for advice, try a list tyhat uses the advice you sought and then if we are wrong, tell us so. But I wager there are few if any things in any codex as valuable per point as the Priest is.

I combine that all with Strakens bubble to make a truly fierce pair of Blobs.

Comissar, on the other hand, provides you with ld9 for orders and semi-fearless. Means you can still g2g and more reliably recieve orders. So, it's not an easy question on who's better a comissar or a priest.

Mostly depends on what you need.

If you've got a mellee-oriented blob with power weapons and krak nades, a priest should be there as you're gona need hatred and fearless in mellee. While ld8 and a vox caster will help you out with orders making a comissar not so important. It's sometimes worth it to put 2 priests in such an expensive blob to make their mellee ld-oriented buffs more reliable. For example, rerolling 5+ armor or 4++ from Azrael or divination power is no joke.

If you're running a backfield unit with long-ranged weaponry, i'd go for a comissar. Ld9 for orders and ability to g2g is great.

For conscripts anything will do, really. Zealot helps them out in mellee, however comissar allows them to reliably recieve frfsrf or move move move which are super important for the squad. Going to ground is helpful too. Opponents will avoid shooting at conscripts when possible - at least for the first part of the game so the chances of them getting somewhere on the point or running around and blocking the way to an IK are good enough. In this case you want to g2g to minimise losses.

I run my infantry squads in blobs of 20-30, and my morale buffers are either Priests, Inquisitors or a Commissar, though I'm leaning on replacing my Commissars with Priests. Tanks/Knights handle the nasty stuff.

I play strictly offensively, and very rarely take HWT's. I prefer mobile infantry over static infantry, as I honestly fail to see the logic in spending 210 points on 3 BS3 Lascannon shots... in a tri-squad blob. If you want them to hold a position, you need to pay a points tax for a Priest/Commissar too. If you want them to be barely decent, you need to pay for a CCS and vox network on top of that. Anything with strength equal to or greater than a full size Tactical Squad is going to roll over them. You're forced into making a large part of your army static, as if you put offensive elements forward the LC blob can only throw some mediocre LC fire down to save them. This encourages you to castle completely so your opponent has to deal with the full strength of your army at the same time. Good luck taking your opponent's objectives either way.

Considering that everyone and their dog seems to be fielding the same Conscript-Priest abuse/Pask-Punisher/Psyker spam/HWT blob stuff, and losing badly with it so say statistics, I've stayed away from all 4 like the plague, and I'm still doing fine. I favour Pask-Executioner, don't bother with Conscripts, despite them looking the most usable of the 4, I only ever take at most an Inquisitor and Astropath as an LD10 stubborn melee-er with added divination is worth it, and the Astropath provides both an extra warp charge at extra warp charge price and the potential for shrouding/invisibility.

3 level 2 psykers is 225, which is considerably more than an Executioner that puts out 5 PC shots a turn. Hell, for that amount of points, you could take almost 4 Wyverns. Even if, say, you're taking a HWT blob list, paying 75 pts for guaranteed oppurtunities to maybe get re-rolls to hit on 3-5 BS3 Lascannons in (woop de doo) and also maybe get another decent power is something I cannot understand. Let's add another maybe ; maybe your opponent takes a psyker heavy list and you've just wasted 225 points.

The Inquisitor-Astropath combination lets you hold the line in place strongly, costs 5 points more than a Lvl 2 Psyker effectively, provides a fairly interesting beatstick, gives you an offensive power on your CCS that can do hilarious things to any non-vehicle unit within 18'', and a 1/3 chance to score 1 of 2 broken telepathy powers.

If you really need more Warp Charges after that, you can get 1-3 warp charges for 18-54 points by buying 1-3 psyker-henchmen retinues.

 koooaei wrote:
Comissar, on the other hand, provides you with ld9 for orders and semi-fearless. Means you can still g2g and more reliably recieve orders. So, it's not an easy question on who's better a comissar or a priest.

Mostly depends on what you need.

If you've got a mellee-oriented blob with power weapons and krak nades, a priest should be there as you're gona need hatred and fearless in mellee. While ld8 and a vox caster will help you out with orders making a comissar not so important. It's sometimes worth it to put 2 priests in such an expensive blob to make their mellee ld-oriented buffs more reliable. For example, rerolling 5+ armor or 4++ from Azrael or divination power is no joke.

If you're running a backfield unit with long-ranged weaponry, i'd go for a comissar. Ld9 for orders and ability to g2g is great.

For conscripts anything will do, really. Zealot helps them out in mellee, however comissar allows them to reliably recieve frfsrf or move move move which are super important for the squad. Going to ground is helpful too. Opponents will avoid shooting at conscripts when possible - at least for the first part of the game so the chances of them getting somewhere on the point or running around and blocking the way to an IK are good enough. In this case you want to g2g to minimise losses.

you'd already have a 9 for LD with the Psyker.

 Mr.Omega wrote:


I play strictly offensively, and very rarely take HWT's.

I usually take HWT in my squads but having said that:

HWS have always been a bad expenditure of points. Very expensive and fragile. They also have a giant shoot me/chop me to bits sign on them. I haven't tried them since the new codex but in the last codex the only thing worth taking on a hwt was the mortars. Everything thing else made them too costly and too targeted. those mortars though you can put them behind stuff so they are less likely to be killed instantly and they are typically ignored due to everyone thinking they suck balls (they do suck balls on a 1 turn basis but if they are allowed to be unmolested for a few turns they can land a surprising number of wounds against even meq and of course if your oppenent is running horde nid, ork or guard it can really clear a lot off the board).

I did always like using sws though, especially with flamers or grenade launchers due to low point cost for the firepower. (tbh I am a sucker for grenade launcher in general, I Just think it adds a good amount of flexablity for very few points)

I know I suggest this as the answer to anything but a powerfield Librarian allied in from DA is a fun option since you can give multiple blob squads a 4++ and hide the Librarian in one of them so the other guy has to chew through a lot of models to get to it.