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Does Crimson Slaughter have the same allies matrix as Chaos Space Marines?

In the BRB, it states:

In the case of older publications, the Faction of all the units described in a codex is the same as the codex’s title. In the case of codex supplements, the Faction of all the units described in that publication is the same as the codex it is a supplement of.

Which would stand to reason that it does. However, this also exists in the BRB:

On rare occasions, a conflict will arise between a rule in this rulebook, and one printed in a codex. Where this occurs, the rule printed in the codex or Army List Entry always takes precedence.

And Crimson Slaughter has an Allies section stating:

ALLIES
A Crimson Slaughter detachment can ally with a Codex: Chaos Space Marines detachment as Battle Brothers (and vice versa).

Now, in 6th edition, this was to say that Crimson Slaughter could ally with CSM but not with Daemons or other factions. However, with the way things are done in 7th, it's a whole different ball game, and it would stand to reason that they have the entire Ally Matrix as they are technically the CSM faction.

There is no contradiction the Crimson Slaughter gives you permission that you already have from the BrB. It gives no contradiction just becomes a redundant rule.

I don't see the issue. A Chaos Space Marines Detachment can ally with a Chaos Space Marines Detachment as Battle Brothers using 7th Edition.

Counting Crimson Slaughter as Chaos Space Marines just means a Crimson Slaughter Detachment can ally with a Chaos Space Marines Detachment as Battle Brothers... which is what the Supplement tells you. Both rules agree.

Am I missing your question?

I feel like you're implying that because the Crimson Slaughter book says they can ally with CSM, but doesn't mention other Factions that it must also mean you can't ally with other factions. This is a false assumption.

The BRB tells you how to ally CS with ALL Factions, including CSM. The CS book tell your how to ally with CSM, and it happens to agree with the BRB.

I was pretty sure that's how it worked, but I wanted to make sure before I made any purchases.

Allies are worked out on a unit basis rather than detachment.
It's how units view each other.
CS units still have the CSM faction.

Let's be clear. You cannot use the Allied Detatchment chart (the one hq, one troops chart) because that chart needs a different faction than your primary.

You are allowed to ally to Chaos Space Marines as a second Combined Arms Detatchment, which would count as Battle Brothers, but you need one hq, 2 troops just like a second FOC

----EDITED I misread your post, thinking it was the usual can CD ally with CSM question

Pretty sure sub-factions have the same faction as the their main faction, so ally as if they are the main faction unless the sub-faction codex says otherwise. I.e., Clan Raukaan are Space Marine faction, Iyandan are Eldar, Tempestus Scions are Astra Militarum, etc.. There is also the meta-faction "Imperial Armies" to which all Imperial armies belong, including Imperial Knights (no faction, has its own slot), Inquisition (Inquisition faction, has its own slot), Legion of the Damned (Space Marine faction, has its own slot). Other meta-factions are Eldar (Eldar, Dark Eldar, Iyandan, Harlequins), Tau (Tau, Enclaves), Chaos (Chaos Space Marines, Crimson Slaughter, Black Legion, Chaos Daemons), and Orks (Orks). Tyranids are technically not a meta-faction, because no one can ally with them. Necrons may one day be a meta-faction, yet aren't currently.

One day, GW may even fix their mess and post a faction chart covering all the different little polities of the 40k universe.

SJ

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
Pretty sure sub-factions have the same faction as the their main faction, so ally as if they are the main faction unless the sub-faction codex says otherwise. I.e., Clan Raukaan are Space Marine faction, Iyandan are Eldar, Tempestus Scions are Astra Militarum, etc.. There is also the meta-faction "Imperial Armies" to which all Imperial armies belong, including Imperial Knights (no faction, has its own slot), Inquisition (Inquisition faction, has its own slot), Legion of the Damned (Space Marine faction, has its own slot). Other meta-factions are Eldar (Eldar, Dark Eldar, Iyandan, Harlequins), Tau (Tau, Enclaves), Chaos (Chaos Space Marines, Crimson Slaughter, Black Legion, Chaos Daemons), and Orks (Orks). Tyranids are technically not a meta-faction, because no one can ally with them. Necrons may one day be a meta-faction, yet aren't currently.

One day, GW may even fix their mess and post a faction chart covering all the different little polities of the 40k universe.

SJ

Tempestus Scions isn't a Supplement of Astra Militarum. It's a Codex in and of itself. Codex: Tempestus Scions is Faction: Tempestus Scions. Codex: Imperial Knights is Faction: Imperial Knights. Codex: Legion of the Damned is Faction: Legion of the Damned. But as you say, all Imperial Factions ally as Battle Brothers.

Basically, if the book has Codex in the title, the Faction is equal to the title of the book. If they book has Supplement in the title, the Faction is equal to the parent Codex. There are even a few Dataslates that have their own Faction, such as Officio Assassinorum.

Example...
"Codex Space Marines" is Faction Space Marines since it is a Codex.
"Clan Raukaan: A Codex Space Marines Supplement" is Faction Space Marines since the parent Codex is Faction Space Marines.
"Codex Legion of the Damned" is Faction Legion of the Damned since it is a Codex.

"Codex Chaos Space Marines" is Faction Chaos Space Marines since it is a Codex.
"Crimson Slaughter: A Codex Chaos Space Marines Supplemet" is Faction Chaos Space Marines since the parent Codex is Faction Chaos Space Marines.

You might want to re-check things. Knights are not a faction, other than "Imperial". The IK icon on their dataslates is the formation type they fill. Same with LotD and Inquisition. While we are using the term "faction" the way we learned to in 6th, 7th is showing a more umbrella style meaning.

SJ

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
You might want to re-check things. Knights are not a faction, other than "Imperial". The IK icon on their dataslates is the formation type they fill. Same with LotD and Inquisition. While we are using the term "faction" the way we learned to in 6th, 7th is showing a more umbrella style meaning.

SJ

Small Rulebook, Page 118, Factions Section - "All units belong to one of the many Factions that are fighting in the 41st millennium. This will often be represented on the unit's Army List Entry with a symbol, the key for which can be found to the right."

To the right is a picture with icons and names for Adepata Sororitas, Astra Militarum, Blood Angels, etc. Imperial Knights is on that list. So, you see, the icon is the Faction and not the Battlefield Role. I assume the Imperial Knights Unit Entries have the little IK Head icon. If not...

Small Rulebook, Page 118, Factions Section - "In the case of older publications, the Faction of all the units described in the codex is the same as the codex's title."

It's a Codex, so it's a Faction. Same reason Legion of the Damned or Millitarum Tempestus (which I think I inaccurately called Tempestus Scions earlier) are Factions.

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
You might want to re-check things. Knights are not a faction, other than "Imperial". The IK icon on their dataslates is the formation type they fill. Same with LotD and Inquisition. While we are using the term "faction" the way we learned to in 6th, 7th is showing a more umbrella style meaning.

SJ

Knights are in fact one of the 17 Factions listed in the rulebook.

"Imperial" however is not a Faction, but a collection of Factions used solely for the Alies Matrix.

Annoyingly GW have chosen to use the same icon for the Imperial Knights Faction as they do the "other" Battlefield Role.

 grendel083 wrote:

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
You might want to re-check things. Knights are not a faction, other than "Imperial". The IK icon on their dataslates is the formation type they fill. Same with LotD and Inquisition. While we are using the term "faction" the way we learned to in 6th, 7th is showing a more umbrella style meaning.

SJ

Knights are in fact one of the 17 Factions listed in the rulebook.

"Imperial" however is not a Faction, but a collection of Factions used solely for the Alies Matrix.

Annoyingly GW have chosen to use the same icon for the Imperial Knights Faction as they do the "other" Battlefield Role.

Yeah, short sighted mistake right there. How hard would it have been to come up with something new?

Is Codex Lost and the Damned the same as Imperial Armor volume 13: War Machines of the Lost and the Damned?

 Filch wrote:
Is Codex Lost and the Damned the same as Imperial Armor volume 13: War Machines of the Lost and the Damned?

There is no such thing as Codex Lost and the Damned

 Filch wrote:
Is Codex Lost and the Damned the same as Imperial Armor volume 13: War Machines of the Lost and the Damned?

http://www.blacklibrary.com/games-workshop-digital-editions/Codex-Legion-of-the-Damned.html

Legion of the Damned =/= Lost and the Damned.

Lost and the Damned was a one of the supplement lists in the Eye of Terror book, expanding the 3.5 ed chaos codex. Perhaps it means something different now, though?