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I posted on the Kickstarter page, but the 105K goal (which is a ways away) should not be Hellscape. It is one of the less popular boards. Imo, it should be the Anime Wars board.

You say it will be easy to reach, but there are only about 11K of single early birds left. If I add in the 4x early bird level, it's about 17K. If I add in the Xmas Special (which is a whopping 33 pounds more than the single early bird ) it's STILL only about 35K.

If all of those go, and that's quite a bit, the pledge total will only reach 110K. Thus, the 105K goal matters quite a bit.

I really think it should be one of the more popular boards, rather than giving the Hellscape board a 6th option before any of the other 28mm designs. I like the DzC board being at 95K, as it will be VERY popular. But for the first 28mm board to get all 6 tile options, it should be anything BUT Hellscape. Obviously, I'd like it to be Anime Wars, but anything other than Hellscape would be an improvement... we just unlocked a Hellscape board at the current (75K) stretch. It should not be at 105K!

Honestly if the goals were closer together I think they'd go faster.
edit: As in, more people say "Oh, the 6th option is just that far away - I'll pledge a little more to get there." As it is the jumps between them seem giant.

And I'd rather Helscape but I may be biased because that's the one I'm likely going to get.

I'd rather the hellscape one as well. The secondary colour choice looks perfect for me.

I am getting condused. So, still no generic simple board (like RoB flat tiles but with out skullpits etc) ?

Is it meant to be an unlock? I am not putting money in hoping ti will be an unlock and then it not reaching it.

You did say at the beginning when asking for feedback that a basic generic would be available - why the change? That board out of all boards has got to be the one with the least amount of effort to produce.

@Ritides, your enthusiasm for Anime wars is infectious!

Based on current numbers you are correct. But give us some time to get all the add on products. As the average pledge per backer can change all those numbers you quoted. So once all the terrain kits are complete and more is offered, Case and more. It should change those numbers . Once the early birds go, and xmas rewards kick in it's a whole new page and then on to more good things. The Average pledge per backer will increase naturally.

35 Days to go. It's been awesome thus far and what is in store is equally exciting.


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 fullheadofhair wrote:
I am getting condused. So, still no generic simple board (like RoB flat tiles but with out skullpits etc) ?

Is it meant to be an unlock? I am not putting money in hoping ti will be an unlock and then it not reaching it.

You did say at the beginning when asking for feedback that a basic generic would be available - why the change? That board out of all boards has got to be the one with the least amount of effort to produce.

The main 5 themes designs where done by our partners. If we are able to do one within this KS it will be either a Hawk Wargames battle board or ND battle board. These are the battle boards they want to do initially. Hopefully we will get to a level we can do more


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New update, much work to do on our end, thanks for your support! Really appreciate it!

I'm in (and probably will stay in, but who knows what will happen in a month) for a Hellscape board. My only concern is that it looks like each tile will have some sort of feature and smooth edges which seems like it might make for some really noticeable tiling. I seem to recall a similar concern with the boards that Secret Weapon is making with regards to their scrap yard theme. Using 2x2 boards probably reduces this, and sticking some terrain over the bare patches probably helps as well, but I'm looking forward to seeing more images of the theme. At around 100USD *and* prepainted though... damn... going to be hard to say no.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
City boards never play well, in my experience. Long, straight open spaces are terrible. Might as well at least look good.

That where cars - both damaged an trashed - like the Antoceti (sp?) Workshop terrain for Mars Attacks comes in, not to mention Jersey barriers, rubble, etc, etc...

Back to Karkand!

I may not have done this correctly as I did it without making unreasonable demands of the project creator first, but I've dropped my pledge on this. I just don't think I'll get enough use out of the boards.

Riquende, that is the only, and I mean the ONLY, way to do it if you need to / must / etc.

The alternate Hellscape theme is a little better, so that's good. But I don't think we'll see the 6th tile of anything beyond that unlock, unless more Early Bird priced pledges are opened once these fill up as the holidays progress. Ah well, I'll just sit back and watch since my friend and I are in for 3 6'x4' boards and 6 trays if we count our pledges together (we're splitting a trays pack, so I can get 2 trays with felt in them for cheaper ).

One note G&G- You might not want to talk too much about "raising the average pledge per backer". That also sounds like, you know, squeezing us for money . Better to focus on getting the word out to new backers, and the average pledge will naturally take care of itself.

I have personally maxed out already, though- I don't tend to slowly increase my pledge throughout campaigns, or at least I try not to- I pledge for what I think is appropriate and then tweak it at the end.

I did add on for trays, but that will be it for me!

1.) Someone should fix the title of this thread, esp. the kickstarter typo. E.g: "Games & Gears Battleboards Kickstarter - NOW LIVE"
2.) Funny how projects from UK always distringuish between UK and EU (UK is part of EU and Europe).
3.) Haven't read this thead, but I don't understand why the second, XMAS special pledge is much more expensive than the still available early bird, for the same content.

Well projects from the UK can ship to the UK a lot more cheaply than the rest of the EU.....

 RiTides wrote:


The alternate Hellscape theme is a little better, so that's good. But I don't think we'll see the 6th tile of anything beyond that unlock, unless more Early Bird priced pledges are opened once these fill up as the holidays progress. Ah well, I'll just sit back and watch since my friend and I are in for 3 6'x4' boards and 6 trays if we count our pledges together (we're splitting a trays pack, so I can get 2 trays with felt in them for cheaper ).

One note G&G- You might not want to talk too much about "raising the average pledge per backer". That also sounds like, you know, squeezing us for money . Better to focus on getting the word out to new backers, and the average pledge will naturally take care of itself.

I have personally maxed out already, though- I don't tend to slowly increase my pledge throughout campaigns, or at least I try not to- I pledge for what I think is appropriate and then tweak it at the end.

I did add on for trays, but that will be it for me!

We are in an awesome position of 800 backers and some time left to get more done on our end. We are on track to unlocking everything, some days we will have huge surges some days will be quite. But we are on track. Great thing is we can amend and be flexible when needed. Still not many people are aware of the KS since we have not banner adverts and it is an organic community word of mouth success. Open days and more neat stuff and also the community continue to spread the word of mouth will get us there .

On the AVPB, we are trying to have an honest conversation and be very open about the strategy as our backers are our investors. However you have a good point, our frankness and openness can be mis-interpreted to what people maybe use to culturally.

Lastly, thank sir for your support and everything else same goes to all who have backed us here. Just a real pleasure on behalf of the crew to do this project and you lot make it all worth it, seriously.






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 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Well projects from the UK can ship to the UK a lot more cheaply than the rest of the EU.....

Correct, there is no USPS version in the EU. So shipping to the Continent is different Thant the UK in terms of services available to us. When and if an EUPS is formed or a more harmonized postal service for the EU then no problem, but each nation has there own rules and customs.


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 Kroothawk wrote:

3.) Haven't read this thead, but I don't understand why the second, XMAS special pledge is much more expensive than the still available early bird, for the same content.

There is only under 180 EBs left at 62.00GBP and a few left at the x4 pledge. Once they go the Xmas pledge gets in, celebration of Hanukah & Xmas.

Regarding the banner, it's pretty cheap to get a banner ad on Dakka if you so choose, just FYI . I think you're already aware of that, but info is here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/core/services_advertising.jsp

Most people who follow N&R should know about your campaign already, of course! But it might give it a little more visibility for people who don't frequent this section of the site.

I'm starting to waver. Considering the difference between 6mm and 10mm...

Also, $200 would let me build a lot of table and terrain in the scale I want. I have no interest in resin terrain or the trays. To be honest, the terrain seems a little uninspired.

I'll keep my money in for now and see how it goes. C'mon 6mm...

Isn't the DZC cityscape like $36 from some places online? So, why do I want the pack you have for 25.00GBP, isn't that about $33? Bleh.

I don't think there are plans for 6mm in the short term, Kendachi, unless this skyrockets... the Hawk Wargames 10mm board is about the best you can do. Perhaps modify it for 6mm, it's got to be a decent starting point... rub off the painted lines on the roads and add an extra lane, etc?

The 6mm market is niche enough I can't see them going for that. The 10mm board makes more sense, since Hawk Wargames already had the designs made, and it can likely double up for 15mm if needed (I certainly plan to use it for such).

They already scaled it once to 28mm so, it's not impossible for them to do it again. But, that's the smallest concern for me, I can get over it.

I'm just weighing ease of use / preconstructed versus ultimate customization by building it myself.

Got another 30 days or so to see if it or I change.

 RiTides wrote:
Riquende, that is the only, and I mean the ONLY, way to do it if you need to / must / etc.

The alternate Hellscape theme is a little better, so that's good. But I don't think we'll see the 6th tile of anything beyond that unlock, unless more Early Bird priced pledges are opened once these fill up as the holidays progress. Ah well, I'll just sit back and watch since my friend and I are in for 3 6'x4' boards and 6 trays if we count our pledges together (we're splitting a trays pack, so I can get 2 trays with felt in them for cheaper ).

One note G&G- You might not want to talk too much about "raising the average pledge per backer". That also sounds like, you know, squeezing us for money . Better to focus on getting the word out to new backers, and the average pledge will naturally take care of itself.

I have personally maxed out already, though- I don't tend to slowly increase my pledge throughout campaigns, or at least I try not to- I pledge for what I think is appropriate and then tweak it at the end.

I did add on for trays, but that will be it for me!

RT - I agree with what you've said here, and was making similar noises at the start of the campaign. Every time I get a G&G update extolling the virtues of going out there and recruiting more cult members for the cause and increasing the average pledge amount per backer by "just" another £10, or £50 it raises the hackles in the back of my neck. Personally at least, it bothers me quite a lot to be "spoken" to in that manner, and makes me wonder when they intend to send the women out to do some flirty fishing.

In the opening day, when I asked about how I'd add a third board to me 2x pledge for £64 and they said "upgrade to four" it flagged this stuff early. I got my wife's account to pledge for a single board, so now I have the option of keeping one, two, three or of course, none. Again, to be decided in the last day. Christmas Day, as it happens. (Is there a more inappropriate time to end a campaign? Especially one that's constantly sending out requests to "upgrade" pledges?) So anyway, I'm currently down for 3 boards over 2 backers. I've got no interest whatsoever in expensive trays, or expensive resin scenery, or any of that other gak.

The other two things that bother me about this campaign are - firstly something I brought up a week or so ago - the £10k stretch goals that each unlock one tile per style, when the initial £35k somehow "unlocked" 20 tiles. WTF is up with that? Either they needed a lot more than that to hit their real target, or they need a feth load less per additional tile. Either way, it feels dishonest - because it clearly is. When a campaign creator is clearly being so dishonest with the numbers, it erodes whatever trust you might have in them. And, well, that's a bit of a problem. Of course, this being perceived as a "negative" question, or trying to look behind the curtain, or too intrusive, or whatever - means it just gets ignored by G&G - when it just means I can do basic mathematics - choosing to ignore this kind of question outright simply doesn't help trust.

The other is simply that G&G only appear to respond at all to positive feedback. GW cops so much flak for "this is great news", but G&G have taken this to comedic extremes. Well-written and/or reasonable posts that point out issues or concerns get ignored, or perhaps a small aspect of the post gets picked up "great to see you're so enthusiastic about the Anima Tactics board!" - and again, it engenders a distrust and makes G&G seem a bit ...slimy. It's all very used-car-salesman crossed with the most extreme of "this is great news".

And of this is the kind of communication we can expect during the "give us money" phase...

The other is simply that G&G only appear to respond at all to positive feedback. GW cops so much flak for "this is great news", but G&G have taken this to comedic extremes. Well-written and/or reasonable posts that point out issues or concerns get ignored, or perhaps a small aspect of the post gets picked up "great to see you're so enthusiastic about the Anima Tactics board!" - and again, it engenders a distrust and makes G&G seem a bit ...slimy. It's all very used-car-salesman crossed with the most extreme of "this is great news".

This has been one of the driving factors as to why I haven't felt the need nor the want to back their product, even though DZC is becoming bigger in my local play area and the DZC board would be the perfect way to get the game off the ground where I play. I feel like every time I have tried to offer criticism of a product to improve the product, it's ignored and people that are like, "WE LOVE THIS STUFF" get the responses. So I feel like G&G only see me as a wallet or an ATM instead of an investor in their product and design (of which a KS backer is essentially in most cases).

The problem is that with the successful kickstarter (which at this point would take an act of God to prevent), Games and Gears is being validated that they can get away with a semi-decent product as long as they make their 'early adopters' (if you'll allow me to borrow from the tech world) happy. It's the same sort of vibe I get when I walk into an Apple store.

Lol... Azazelx lol.

I think they have a solid KS. Seems they answered everything on the KS. Communication is the best I have seen out of any KS. My club has backed them to the hilt... And I don't think that post deserves a response from G&G.. But continue to bash to your hearts intent!! Lol




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Lol been lurking and a few of you are just relentless. Funny

Yeah, this is the givemeyourmonies phase, of course they're talking.

Ninja Division was all over the Robotech KS comments, post-campaign... ninja vanish!

darkeldarcrone wrote:
Lol... Azazelx lol.
I think they have a solid KS. Seems they answer everything on the KS. Communication is the best I have seen out of any KS. My club has backed them to the hilt... And I don't think that post deserves a response from G&G.. But continue to bash to your hearts intent!! Lol
Lol been lurking and a few of you are just relentless. Funny

Yeah, I'm going to put you on ignore now. Grown-ups are talking - seeya! (or not!)

 Alfndrate wrote:

The problem is that with the successful kickstarter (which at this point would take an act of God to prevent), Games and Gears is being validated that they can get away with a semi-decent product as long as they make their 'early adopters' (if you'll allow me to borrow from the tech world) happy. It's the same sort of vibe I get when I walk into an Apple store.

I'm actually pretty sure that the product will be of good quality - especially for the price (a 6x4 GW felt mat costs $50 here, after all), and they're at least being upfront about things like the depth and such. I think the cobblestone streets board looks unnatural with the razor-sharp gutters, and while they've chosen to ignore what is reasonable feedback on it - at least they're openly showing what it looks like - so we all have the option to buy or not.

I'm also not butthurt about the KS being successful. I'm happy that it is successful, since they look like the kind of products I want to purchase. I simply wish they felt more honest as creators. Perhaps I've been spoiled by creators like Mark/DFG who listen and actually take on feedback, as opposed to treating us like their little army (I get that it's meant to be "in character" or some such, but it's not well written enough to be humorous or self-depreciating/modest enough to not irk me.)

Backed Robotech . One reason I backed this one was based on my mate backing the brushes, they kept communication up till the end and there after service according to him was top notch. But the Ninja's are a little quite, still getting Robotech updates so seems good.

darkeldarcrone wrote:
Lol... Azazelx lol.

I think they have a solid KS. Seems they answered everything on the KS. Communication is the best I have seen out of any KS. My club has backed them to the hilt... And I don't think that post deserves a response from G&G.. But continue to bash to your hearts intent!! Lol




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Lol been lurking and a few of you are just relentless. Funny

Yeah, with a post count of 100 and ~60 of those in this very thread, I think, with all due respect, people would be totally understandable in questioning your objectivity.

 Azazelx wrote:
I'm actually pretty sure that the product will be of good quality - especially for the price (a 6x4 GW felt mat costs $50 here, after all), and they're at least being upfront about things like the depth and such. I think the cobblestone streets board looks unnatural with the razor-sharp gutters, and while they've chosen to ignore what is reasonable feedback on it - at least they're openly showing what it looks like - so we all have the option to buy or not.

The DZC board I saw at GenCon was not to my liking, but I will admit that perhaps I am not their target audience for that board as RiTides, whom I consider a reasonably level headed fellow disagreed with me on that board, but the brick work and the cobblestone on the fantasy board could have easily been fixed with a few minor changes and been 10 times better, the space Anime Wars board was okay, if a little bland (in my opinion), but the hellscape board was a bit of a misstep and boring (I believe RiTides said that a cracked earth would have been a better choice/idea and I agree with that assessment, regardless of who said it)

I'm also not butthurt about the KS being successful. I'm happy that it is successful, since they look like the kind of products I want to purchase. I simply wish they felt more honest as creators. Perhaps I've been spoiled by creators like Mark/DFG who listen and actually take on feedback, as opposed to treating us like their little army (I get that it's meant to be "in character" or some such, but it's not well written enough to be humorous or self-depreciating/modest enough to not irk me.)

There has only been one Kickstarter that I've seen that I honestly wished was not successful, this is not it. My problem with this kickstarter being successful is that G&G is putting out what I think is an inferior product to what they could (see my suggestions earlier in the thread) and having people being okay with an inferior product simply because of the price/"deals" (also that GW mat doesn't exist anymore, sadly), thus why I compared it to how I feel whenever I walk into an Apple store. They have put out a good product, and they're very good with their image, but they try to sell you an inferior product and people lap it up because of some reason or another.

wow what happened here.

If you are really passionate and really want to have a good discussion about certain aspects and help us constructively then send us a PM. As we have not received any from those few same posters who may have issue... and received a lot from those who are interested and want to see us do more and improve here since the inception of the this thread which has been here for a long time . We understand trying to sway and change perceptions for the better or worse. The best we can do is make good products and give good value to our backers .




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to brighten up the mood here for all .

Here is some pics of the Deadzone 3" Square Grid available on our Kickstarter. These are really sweet. We look forward to the Mantic Open Day. It's going to be good!

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.645240875498445.1073741859.475726182449916&type=3

Azazel, I guess I've come round on the tone. People communicate in different ways, it's not something I'm going to get too concerned over. As for content, I made the above post regarding that, and Games & Gears have actually listened about the content of their posts previously. So, I think that's actually something you can discuss and have your feedback taken on. But tone is harder- maybe they're just that enthusiastic about the product . I certainly like it a lot, and think the value for the money is pretty insane! But, I just don't think tone is something a person can change as easily- ah well, like I said doesn't really bother me

I do think a compromise is possible- Games & Gears, for example, a number of folks have mentioned the border of the anima tactics (fantasy) board. If the border of the roads was not so straight, the cobbles would look a lot more natural. Do you think you could look into changing that, or is it already set?

Azazel, regarding pledge total- it's very likely G&G raised funding on their own for the initial 20 boards, and just needed 35K or the like to complete the funding. So, I don't necessarily see a discrepancy there- just that the initial goal is discounted due to their covering the rest of the cost.

Dreamforge augmented their KS funding with outside sources too, I believe... it makes sense that a company that wants to put out a product would put in some traditional investment, too.

 RiTides wrote:


I do think a compromise is possible- Games & Gears, for example, a number of folks have mentioned the border of the anima tactics (fantasy) board. If the border of the roads was not so straight, the cobbles would look a lot more natural. Do you think you could look into changing that, or is it already set?

As mentioned on the KS comments section and updates. The Anima Battle Board is being revamped on and the roads are changing to that specification. The Ninja's are on it!


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[quote=RiTides 520449 6267174 6454506fab8c9cd02a431ae6f9f92f4f.jpgmaybe they're just that enthusiastic about the product .

GamesNGears wrote:
As mentioned on the KS comments section and updates. The Anima Battle Board is being revamped on and the roads are changing to that specification. The Ninja's are on it!

I had totally missed this, and that is excellent!

Now if the Hellscape board could just have that pentagram type logo removed from the one board, it could basically double as "cracked earth" (which I had not mentioned, but came up above) which a lot of folks were interested in . Especially with that alternate scheme. Cheers

If at first you dont succeed rethink replan and try again.

Selling single pieces of 1x1 board at £8 doesn't work.

Selling a full 6x4 of pieces for £62 does. However its the DZC tie in, and others, which fixes this.

We went berserk backing this on the DZC forums, I bought one and regretted not buying two, so I made a second account to do so. As I made the first account for this project you could pretty much say I'm a fiorm backer.

 RiTides wrote:

GamesNGears wrote:
As mentioned on the KS comments section and updates. The Anima Battle Board is being revamped on and the roads are changing to that specification. The Ninja's are on it!

I had totally missed this, and that is excellent!

Now if the Hellscape board could just have that pentagram type logo removed from the one board, it could basically double as "cracked earth" (which I had not mentioned, but came up above) which a lot of folks were interested in . Especially with that alternate scheme. Cheers

If and when cracked earth makes a return it will be part of the Hellscape Series . As a Ninja Division battle board. We need to get approval and insure it fits the theme.


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 Orlanth wrote:
If at first you dont succeed rethink replan and try again.

Selling single pieces of 1x1 board at £8 doesn't work.

Selling a full 6x4 of pieces for £62 does. However its the DZC tie in, and others, which fixes this.

We went berserk backing this on the DZC forums, I bought one and regretted not buying two, so I made a second account to do so. As I made the first account for this project you could pretty much say I'm a fiorm backer.

Thanks and well said. Very much appreciate your support and everyone else. We sincerely are still blown away with the fantastic support. Hope the tone is ok... But we cannot be thankful enough. Just cannot wait to get the Battle Boards to you. Lets smash through the stretch goals .

On that note. Hawk Wargames will be demoing the G&G Dropzone Commander Battle Board at the Mantic Day Open Day. So if you are able to make it. Make sure you get a game on it!


Pic below is the Hellscape Alt base painted variant.