Which would lose in a fight- an Avatar of Khaine or a Bloodthirster?

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**EmpNortonII**

Fluff-wise only.

Given that, in fluff, both seem to exist mostly for showing how awesome space marines are, which one would lose to show how awesome the other is in a fight between the two?

**Quickjager**

Bloodthirster, killing one is SUPPOSED to be an achievement rivaling a primarch, almost always involves the death of a couple score of guys. Avatar of Khaines... get instagibbed a bit too frequently.

**Vespid**

The avatar of khaine because hes a god, and he put up a good fight against slannesh, well until khrone decided to come along to use him as a club to bet up slannesh causing him to break into shards. Then again as a result Khorne did beat the newly borne slannesh.

**BlaxicanX**

Both job amazingly hard, but Bloodthirsters on the whole have (slightly) better feats- so the Bloodthirster imo.

**Vespid**

In the fluff he was able to defeat the night bringer during the war in the heavens shattering him into shards, then again thats back when they were both at full power

**BlaxicanX**

Yeah, it's worth noting that Khaine, and the Avatar of Khaine aren't the same, nor are they on the same power-scale. An Avatar is literally just a shard of Khaine's potential. So what Khaine was doing before Slaanesh beat him up doesn't really reflect on the capabilities of the Avatar.

**Matt.Kingsley**

Unless there's some bit of fluff from the current Eldar codex I haven't seen, the Necrons shattered the Nightbringer when the shattered the other C'Tan, not Khaine.

But in any case, BT>AoK

**DanielBeaver**

It's like a cat tied to toast.

**Grey Templar**

Fluffwise, an Avatar is way more powerful than a bloodthirster.

An Avatar is a shard of an actual god, a not insignificant chunk either. Bloodthirsters are, for all their power, still just a regular old daemon.

**Wyzilla**

Probably a Bloodthirster. Avatars have a tendency to get demolished by just about everyone. Avatars suffer from Worf Syndrome 24/7, while Bloodthirsters only have the Worf Effect during the Horus Heresy when Primarchs were beating them left and right.

IIRC there was one space marine that defeated a Bloodthrister, but that was a Rune Priest who probably bypassed the Collar of Khorne.

**BrianDavion**

the obvious, if somewhat cynical answer is "whose codex is the battle being described in?"

**koooaei**

EmpNortonII wrote:
Fluff-wise only.

Given that, in fluff, both seem to exist mostly for showing how awesome space marines are, which one would lose to show how awesome the other is in a fight between the two?

It's like leman russ tanks exist only to show how xeno tech is awesome and get blown up squadrons after squadrons?

**Orblivion**

Wyzilla wrote:
Probably a Bloodthirster. Avatars have a tendency to get demolished by just about everyone. Avatars suffer from Worf Syndrome 24/7, while Bloodthirsters only have the Worf Effect during the Horus Heresy when Primarchs were beating them left and right.

IIRC there was one space marine that defeated a Bloodthrister, but that was a Rune Priest who probably bypassed the Collar of Khorne.

Dante beat Skarbrand, reportedly.

**lcmiracle**

An'ggrath got off'ed by an Inquisitor...

**Furyou Miko**

Grey Templar wrote:Fluffwise, an Avatar is way more powerful than a bloodthirster.

An Avatar is a shard of an actual god, a not insignificant chunk either. Bloodthirsters are, for all their power, still just a regular old daemon.

Uh, all aligned Daemons are also fragments of their deific patron. As in, a daemon is a part of their God, except Nurgle ones because he's Special.

So... really, Bloodthirsters are to Khorne what the Avatar is to Khaine... and since Khaine is more an assassin type (murder) than a battlefield type (blood), the Bloodthirster probably would win in an even fight.

**epronovost**

@Furyou Miko

Khaine was viewed has the God of Murder AND War by the Ancient Eldar. He was in fact the God of War well before the God of Murder, title he received after he got jealous of Eldanesh and killed him in a duel (Eldar gods were really Greek in their personna). On who would win I declare a tie. Is that possible? If I am really forced to choose, I would say the Avatar of Khaine because he can shape shift his weapon to suit his needs while Bloodthirster can't.

PS: Bloodthirster are really use to often to describe how badass a little guy is (Space Marines, Imperial Saints, groups of psykers).

**Redseer**

Depends on whose codex I'm reading. Honestly I like to think that they're evenly matched. But I am biased as I would actually cheer for the Avatar.

**Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl**

I could see the double KO here !

**Pilau Rice**

Vespid wrote:
The avatar of khaine because hes a god, and he put up a good fight against slannesh, well until khrone decided to come along to use him as a club to bet up slannesh causing him to break into shards. Then again as a result Khorne did beat the newly borne slannesh.

Was an even battle between Khorne and Slaanesh at the time.

WD: 127 When Kaela Mensha Khaine, the Bloody Handed God of the Eldar, fought with Slaanesh the Lord of Pleasure, he was quickly overwhelmed and his energy captured by the newborn God. For the Bloody Handed God was as much a part of Slaanesh as of Khorne - being a product of that part of the Eldar nature which finds gratification in murder and pleasure in bloody violence. Khorne the Blood God, the Patron of War, Murder and Battle, roared with rage to discover one of his own taken from him in this way. Then Khorne and Slaanesh clashed headlong, the Blood God fighting to recover the portion of his power that had been robbed from him, Slaanesh driven by his uncontrollable hunger to consume everything in his path. The Bloody Handed God of the Eldar was tossed this way and that, at first grasped by Slaanesh, then tugged back into the compass of Khorne.

Eventually the rage of the Blood God and the passion of the Lord of Pleasure were exhausted, and the boundaries between them were established. Like a leaf in the eye of a hurricane, Kaela Mensha Khaine fell among the calm, down through the Realm of Chaos and into the material universe. As he entered the material universe he divided into many shards of energy, scattering his power so that neither Khorne or Slaanesh could ever find him again. Each shard entered the body of an Eldar, filling the body with his own mind, possessing it, so that it became a virtually indestructible blood-lusting murderer - the material manifestation of the Bloody Handed God. These are the Avatars of the Bloody Handed God.

Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Unless there's some bit of fluff from the current Eldar codex I haven't seen, the Necrons shattered the Nightbringer when the shattered the other C'Tan, not Khaine.

But in any case, BT>AoK

It's an old piece of fluff. It from the Dawn of the C'Tan - The Birth of Fear that was on the old old GW website. It's basically the War in Heaven, which is different from the initial telling before Necrons were available.

Birth of Fear
http://web.archive.org/web/20080406181835/http://uk.games-workshop.com/necrons/eldar-mythology/

Furyou Miko wrote:
Grey Templar wrote:Fluffwise, an Avatar is way more powerful than a bloodthirster.

An Avatar is a shard of an actual god, a not insignificant chunk either. Bloodthirsters are, for all their power, still just a regular old daemon.

Uh, all aligned Daemons are also fragments of their deific patron. As in, a daemon is a part of their God, except Nurgle ones because he's Special.

So... really, Bloodthirsters are to Khorne what the Avatar is to Khaine...

What Miko said

**Bharring**

A Bloodthirster is probably stronger than an Avatar.

However...
A Bloodthirster gets its power from Khorne
With that power, it drives the bloodlust of everything nearby into overdrive
An Avatar of Khaine, with Khaine's power fully drained, gets its power from Eldar bloodlust
Thus, a Bloodthirster would supercharge an Avatar.

So, despite probably being stronger, a Bloodthirster would be hard countered by an Avatar of Khaine.

(I think the Avatar would be more skilled. Khaine was more about skill then strength, and Khorne is more about strength than skill, even though Khorne likes both)

**thenoobbomb**

BlaxicanX wrote:
Both job amazingly hard, but Bloodthirsters on the whole have (slightly) better feats- so the Bloodthirster imo.

"Which would lose in a fight-"

**Jambles**

They both lose, because everybody loses when we resort to violence to solve our problems.

Right? ... guys?

**Iron_Captain**

Jambles wrote:
They both lose, because everybody loses when we resort to violence to solve our problems.

Right? ... guys?

*shoots Jambles*
Nyet!
That is talk of cowards, deserters and fascist spies! You have been executed for displaying defeatist attitude.

Also, the Avatar will win. He can grapple the Bloodthirster by his horns and ride him like a rodeo.

**Wyzilla**

Orblivion wrote:
Wyzilla wrote:
Probably a Bloodthirster. Avatars have a tendency to get demolished by just about everyone. Avatars suffer from Worf Syndrome 24/7, while Bloodthirsters only have the Worf Effect during the Horus Heresy when Primarchs were beating them left and right.

IIRC there was one space marine that defeated a Bloodthrister, but that was a Rune Priest who probably bypassed the Collar of Khorne.

Dante beat Skarbrand, reportedly.

Well then they're equal levels of Worf-iness. In that manner then the Bloodthirster would probably win a duel given flight and its stature. Greater Daemons can be huuuuuuge.

**Warboss Gorhack**

Regardless of which of these entities 'wins', everyone else in the region loses. "When Elephants fight the grass gets trampled."

If you really care, compare their game stats and make your own call. Otherwise it depends on whose book you're reading. If it's an Eldar book the Avatar wins. If it's a Chaos book the Thirster wins.

And if it's an Imperial book the imps lose, as per my first paragraph.

My two teef.

**Ratius**

I used to run an arena of death back in 2nd ed, picking the best hth fighters in the game (and boy in 2nd were there some).
More often than not it came down to these two in the final with the Avatar having a slight edge if you took it that his weapon was a sword with parry.

**Envihon**

I have to go with the Avatar of Khaine since Khaine is suppose to be the original and is older than Khorne but at the same time that is a piece of his power instead of the whole thing. Still got to give to Khaine though, I feel like that ancient battle prowess would win against a Bloodthirster.

**EmpNortonII**

thenoobbomb wrote:
BlaxicanX wrote:
Both job amazingly hard, but Bloodthirsters on the whole have (slightly) better feats- so the Bloodthirster imo.

"Which would lose in a fight-"

Given how most people have phrased their answers, I suppose that the poll is meaningless.

**Wyzilla**

Warboss Gorhack wrote:
Regardless of which of these entities 'wins', everyone else in the region loses. "When Elephants fight the grass gets trampled."

If you really care, compare their game stats and make your own call. Otherwise it depends on whose book you're reading. If it's an Eldar book the Avatar wins. If it's a Chaos book the Thirster wins.

And if it's an Imperial book the imps lose, as per my first paragraph.

My two teef.

It doesn't matter if it's an Eldar book, they'll still lose because, Eldar.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Envihon wrote:
I have to go with the Avatar of Khaine since Khaine is suppose to be the original and is older than Khorne but at the same time that is a piece of his power instead of the whole thing. Still got to give to Khaine though, I feel like that ancient battle prowess would win against a Bloodthirster.

Khorne is both older and butchered Khaine when he was still a god.

Also, being "ancient" has feth all to do with actual combat prowess. It just means you're old. It doesn't mean you have actual experience.

**Envihon**

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Envihon wrote:
I have to go with the Avatar of Khaine since Khaine is suppose to be the original and is older than Khorne but at the same time that is a piece of his power instead of the whole thing. Still got to give to Khaine though, I feel like that ancient battle prowess would win against a Bloodthirster.

Khorne is both older and butchered Khaine when he was still a god.

Also, being "ancient" has feth all to do with actual combat prowess. It just means you're old. It doesn't mean you have actual experience.