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I got back into 40k just before 6th, with the revamp of Necrons. i hadn't played since second, mainly due to chaos cheese. I had, however, been picking models and starter sets, just not playing with anything.

i've mostly been playing with my son, and we've been having a pretty good time. he's running chaos marines, while I've been rotating through Tau, IG, Marines (Ultramarine derivities), Necrons, and Tyranids. My brother has played a game or two as Eldar, and my younger son has an Orc force we've toyed with in a multiplayer game Tau vs. chaos w/ orc "allies" - at least until the tau died).

We have a strict rule of no characters, and because of our available models, there's no unit duplication outside of basic troops. we're still using 6th edition rules for our games. I can't remember running into any rule issues (other than forgetting a unit's special abilities here or there), but we generally only play once month or so.

I'm not saying there aren't any issues with the rules, I can definately see problems with some units, but overall we have been having moderate fun with the game (time to play I think is our biggest enemy so far). How about your own experience with non- tournament games for 40K? have they been enjoyable or not?

It sounds like you're playing in the exact environment in which 40K still works.

Around 6 months ago I came to the conclusion that this was the way forward, and I now restrict my games to opponents who approach the game in a similar manner to myself (and, from the sounds of it, like you) and not just wander into my local club each week for a pick up game, which could see me dealing with some of the less fun builds and units in circulation.

What this has meant in reality is I still paint, but most of my gaming is now X Wing.

But yes, when I do play a game of 40K, I do have fun, but I have to be proactive about it.

Casual games of 40k can be a blast, especially when you're playing with someone as close as your son and you're free to make changes to the game and use the rules you wish. Your case reminds me a bit of Gitsplitta's blog- I believe he games a lot with his kids and he seems like he has a blast! Definitely check it out:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/301952.page

As for me, I'm in the process of getting games together with a grad-school buddy of mine who used to play 4th/5th, so we're going to be super relaxed about it and see how it goes! I have pretty high hopes.

I have a blast. I've never been to any tournaments, but outside of one or two nobs, everyone I've played has been an absolute joy, even if they whooped me.

Overall, outside of the tournaments, I think 40k is still a blast and fun can be had. I usually go in with a caveat that I don't tailor my list against an opponent short of knowing what race they are playing.

There's still problems with it and it could definitely use some fixing, but overall it's one of the few games that I can still have fun face to face with a friend.

I love 40k because my best friends play it, and it's turned into a tradition whenever we all happen to be back home. Would I have as much or more fun if we played a different game? Probably, but we've all been collecting armies for darn near a decade at this point, so none of us really wanted to start something new (although I have made the suggestion a couple times).

It's just a fun thing to do with our friends, which seems to be "working as designed" as far as I can tell.

We always have fun. No restrictions and never had a problem.

Roughly 80% of my games are casual pick-up games at the local GW on Fridays/Saturdays (the other 20% are tournament games, and roughly half of those are casual events).

Most of the time, I do have fun. The few times I don't have much fun is when the opponent has to leave before the full game is finished, or when my opponent has an army with a big difference in power level. A complete beginner with Orks against my semi-competitive Wraithdar, or when I use the same army against someone practicing for a tournament using the old Transcendent C'tan.

Even in the tournaments I've been to, it's usually not an uber-competitive environment. Everybody is laughing, making jokes, and having a good time.

Plus, most people in my meta know the rules well enough that the rules themselves aren't a big obstacle. We know what we're doing, and almost always bring fun and/or balanced lists.

With PUGs and tournament games, it's often impractical to make up a story (I like to do that, but many of my opponents don't). Still, it's fun for everybody when say, a tactical squad kills that intimidating Wraithknight, or two special characters go head to head for several rounds.

Those little cool moments definitely make the game more interesting.

My environment is competitive, but only in the story and gameplay areas. Our lists are always mixing up, and are mostly fluff based. It's when we hit the table that our warlords begin hurling insults and we get hyped up on our little plastic soldiers exploits. So yes, I have a lot of fun in a casual environment!

I liked 6th ed a lot for the casual fun of the game it was streamline (to me) the phases were in the correct place and the strategy was there to make it fun like "ohhhh i didnt see that coming" now in 7th the suspense is gone. psychic phase be damned.

But to the game itself i play at my local gw just whoever is there and whatever we have time for. The guy at the store always seems to make a game fun even if its a one sided match up he always has a way to really put that glimmer of hope into it. with selecting the game type to assist the weaker player.

As much as i grumble about GW prices when you find one of them awesome employees of GW who not only wants to make money for his workplace but really gets into the games played in the store, really enhances the atmosphere and makes even the worst games enjoyable

Actually, I now have more fun with the game than I've ever had before during my 12 year long run ( some breaks here and there though. )

Playing in 2 groups, one has a set "amount" of competitiveness going on but no restrictions, games are very balanced. No one "does their worst." Other group consists of players with random skill levels, available models and the like. No agreement is made beforehand, no restrictions are in effect. You can get pretty much anything against you. I also participate in tournaments.

It really depends on ones attitude and how you want to look at things. In friendly games I might try new strategies, experimental lists and occasionally just plain goofy ones and I have a great time. For the tournaments I bring out the big guns and I expect everyone else to do so aswell, I enjoy the challenge of beating and/or trying to beat the difficult armies and again, I have a blast.

I have actually not met a single unfriendly, uncool person face to face during my hobby years in 40K if I think about it.

While sadly I very rarely get to play these days, due to the gradual disintegration of my local gaming group, we always did play in exactly this way. To hell with the rules if they got in the way of fun, always playing in character, armies built purely for theme and enjoyment with no thought towards effectiveness.

And 'tis awesome. This is the environment 40k was born in, and the one it was built for, and in that environment it works perfectly.

My group is very casual in gaming. Using all sorts of different units and mixing it up.

Playing for us is just a way to relax and hangout. Drink a few beers, play a game, have fun.

Game time is a legitimate concern. And even if 40k were to fix their rules, I doubt I'd go back because their games are too long. (not a bad thing, just doesn't fit my life style anymore.)
But yes, 40k can be fun with like minded people. Probably the only way its still fun.

0 fun in 7th. In fact close to 0 fun since the new IG codex came over. After GK got an updated, and eldar, deeldar with eldar ally and GK are the armies I play the most against, it got so bad I more or less don't want to play anymore.
I don't like how missions punish my army for not being super fast or at least meq stats. I don't like the whole formation in a formation in a triple CAD lists. I hate how the only thing that was cool, for me, in the new IG codex got nerfed, because there isn't enough power dice to cast power now. I hate how cover was made unimportant unless it is on flyers or skimers.
I hate the fact that to play against the people I do the most, I should be starting my list with stuff like centurions.
I hate even the stupid things that are weak in other armies, but still demolish my own.

I hate ton of fun in 5th, I had a lot of fun in 6th, even with the crazy GK , SW or necron runing around. 7th is a horrible for me. If I could I would sell my army, but because we aren't getting any new players, there is no one to sell the army too. And am not going to sell over 1500pts of guard for 50$, I worked too much to buy the army.

I'm having fun with tournaments, tournament practice games, and competitive games against other tournament-oriented players.

Casual gaming, whatever that means? Not so much.


For me, a lot of the fun with 40k comes from making the best possible list that I still think is cool, and doing my best with that. At the moment one of those just happens to be one of the most complained-about lists out there. In a tournament setting, that's not a problem as my opponent is expecting hard lists and probably has a list just as hard himself. We play the game, drink some beers, have some laughs, and all's good. I'm sure you can all imagine how that's not exactly what happens in casual games.

Now, I'm not so out of touch that I can't understand how Serpent spam isn't universally loved by the casual gamer, but with other, more unconventional lists, it's even worse. I finally crack the code and put together a weird list that I'm super happy with, that at a tournament would be seen as odd and a bit of a bold choice, but having gone through the trouble of optimizing it and learning how to play it well doesn't exactly get me applauded by casual gamers. It's just more whining about how cheesy I am and how it was no fun for them to get tabled by something they hadn't even seen on the internet.

So, these days it's tournaments only. Much friendlier crowd.

I tried to build my armies around themes and stories. I'd write fiction about my heroes and create entire back stories.
And then they'd just get tabled because the rules don't represent how they're depicted in the fluff.
My IF dreadnaught spam army was barely usable. My penitent SOB army was so useless that I scrapped it and just went with the only style of army that does work, melta spam and exorcists. I won a lot more, but I felt less excited about it.

I'm back to 40k after about 10 years away, have played since 2nd edition but mostly off and on, so I"m probably a definitive "casual" when it comes to 40k

In addition am playing with my kids these days, which is great. We're focusing on vanilla Space Marines, Imperial Guard, and Orks, and so far it's quite a lot of fun.

My boys get that a fun game is predicated on having equally balanced, if totally distinct, lists, so we have the luxury of tailoring the models we own (and hence, possible lists that can be created) into something that's more or less evenly balanced.

The goal is that good tactics win the day, instead of whoever brings the most OP list. So far it's working out pretty well and we're having a very good time.

So, I'd say I'm having more fun than ever in 7th edition. Everything seems a lot more streamlined than in the past. Definitely a good time!

Casual 40k still works because it's...casual. Casual games don't need well-written rules, they just need a solid basic set of rules for you to play with.

On a higher level basis, the rules just fall apart and don't work anymore. While playable, they're at a laughable state as of now.

40k has been an absolute joy for me. It's incredibly fun, and with the options opened up by the new editions and new codices, we get to try armies we've never even tried before, like my unbound baneblade company or my BT buddy's terminator + terminator chaplain + LRC spam.

It's been an indelible amount of fun. I can barely wait day to day to get a game in.

 Stormonu wrote:
I got back into 40k just before 6th, with the revamp of Necrons. i hadn't played since second, mainly due to chaos cheese. I had, however, been picking models and starter sets, just not playing with anything.

i've mostly been playing with my son, and we've been having a pretty good time. he's running chaos marines, while I've been rotating through Tau, IG, Marines (Ultramarine derivities), Necrons, and Tyranids. My brother has played a game or two as Eldar, and my younger son has an Orc force we've toyed with in a multiplayer game Tau vs. chaos w/ orc "allies" - at least until the tau died).

We have a strict rule of no characters, and because of our available models, there's no unit duplication outside of basic troops. we're still using 6th edition rules for our games. I can't remember running into any rule issues (other than forgetting a unit's special abilities here or there), but we generally only play once month or so.

I'm not saying there aren't any issues with the rules, I can definately see problems with some units, but overall we have been having moderate fun with the game (time to play I think is our biggest enemy so far). How about your own experience with non- tournament games for 40K? have they been enjoyable or not?

I enjoy my games quite a bit. i get in 2-3 games per week. I mean who doesnt have 3 hours to kill here and there? So I get a chance to play a lot of my armies a lot. I just accumulated about $2500 in Necrons in some trades that cost me about $500 in cash, so i am revving to go with Necrons.

The fun of the game comes from envisioning in my mind whats going on, on the table. I enjoy the idea of the fight immensely. the models are simply incredible, and the fluff outstanding. That there are rules to play with them is just kind if the added bonus and icing on the cake. Its ridiculous that someone was brilliant enough to say "lets not just build these and admire them. Hell no. lets wreck each others face with them! Can you imagine what a battle between X and Y would be like?..." And thus was wargaming born

7th edition fixed a LOT of what ailed 6th. I think 6th Edition 40K was akin to 4E Dungeons and Dragons: a complete mistake that shook the player base in a way it has never been shaken and then 7E came along and made up for it. It's still got a wart or two (Invisibility is just no fun to play against most of the time) but the game is very playable, assault has made its comeback and is totally viable and by and large the rules were a lot tighter. They even did what we all asked them to do: get all the codex's published in a year or so. How long have we lauded Privateer Press for getting armies out as one? and now 40K, a much more difficult game to do it with, accomplished it in a year or so. Fantastic. We now have a complete game to play.

Let's hope fro better and better things as time goes on.

I love my orks in casual games. And people love to fight orks. Win or lose, you get to kill a lot of stuff when you fight orks =)

My issue is that orks are not fun once you try and go competitive =(

People make the game often.
Any game to honest, but good people can gloss over some of the fault's

Orks are great for that, always somthing to kill.

Yes.
I am having loads of fun playing 40k in a casual environment with friends.
Minatures are always casual for me, they are about admiring the nice miniatures, not about rules. When I want to do something competitive, I go sporting or play videogames.

Casual games are so much fun, but all the people at my local GW are all tryhard gakkers. I hardly ever get a fun game cos every 2 minutes there is an argument which they are usually wrong about. And if the game is going wrong for them, which it usually does cos they never bring solid lists, they try and cheat their way to victory. It seriously annoys me. But when you find that one guy who just plays for fun, you can just have a blast.

This is why friends are super important for playing any wargame, you can just have a fun time with them and not caring about rules or whatever.

I play with a small group of friends, together the five of us comprise Salamanders, raven guard, space wolves, blood angels, chaos marines, necrons, tau, grey knights and both elder flavours.

Amongst us there can definitely be competitive atmosphere when the models hit the table but there are no power builds, there's room in our games for an instance of two of an OP unit (I regularly face an ion accelerator riptide) it's always at a level where no one has lost the game before it begins and its all decided at the table, like it should be.

Personally, my games are about my Dark Apostle and his host, the he and the aspiring champions slaying enemy characters for the dark gods. When the DA wins a challenge I add a head from that army on to a base that I use as an objective marker.

The last game I played was a maelstrom mission and was quite an eye opener for me, and felt like a significant moment in my wargaming life. My chaos forces were being picked apart by tau, pinned down by two riptides and my sorcerer and his squad just got hit hard by a farsight bomb and by turn 3 when my storm eagle full of possessed arrived I was 3 points down and I had two options, send the eagle after the IA riptide who was Sat on an objective I needed and sweep through his backfield, he wouldnt be able to stop me and the game would have been mine, however this would abandon the embattled rest of my army to an ignominious end.

I decided that I couldn't imagine my Apostle abandoning his men to be pulled apart by tau, so I sent the storm eagle to support my sorcerer, he and his possessed squad charged the farsight bomb and 20 kroot, my Apostle killed farsight in a challenge and sweeping advanced both squads away. I lost the game 7-12 but I was proud I could set aside a guaranteed victory for the sake of fun, fluff and a crisis suit head on my objective marker where other players would have taken the win, not that there's anything wrong with that at all but I felt the experience was enriched by my choosing the narrative over the win.

 Sheokronath wrote:
I play with a small group of friends, together the five of us comprise Salamanders, raven guard, space wolves, blood angels, chaos marines, necrons, tau, grey knights and both elder flavours.

Amongst us there can definitely be competitive atmosphere when the models hit the table but there are no power builds, there's room in our games for an instance of two of an OP unit (I regularly face an ion accelerator riptide) it's always at a level where no one has lost the game before it begins and its all decided at the table, like it should be.

Personally, my games are about my Dark Apostle and his host, the he and the aspiring champions slaying enemy characters for the dark gods. When the DA wins a challenge I add a head from that army on to a base that I use as an objective marker.

The last game I played was a maelstrom mission and was quite an eye opener for me, and felt like a significant moment in my wargaming life. My chaos forces were being picked apart by tau, pinned down by two riptides and my sorcerer and his squad just got hit hard by a farsight bomb and by turn 3 when my storm eagle full of possessed arrived I was 3 points down and I had two options, send the eagle after the IA riptide who was Sat on an objective I needed and sweep through his backfield, he wouldnt be able to stop me and the game would have been mine, however this would abandon the embattled rest of my army to an ignominious end.

I decided that I couldn't imagine my Apostle abandoning his men to be pulled apart by tau, so I sent the storm eagle to support my sorcerer, he and his possessed squad charged the farsight bomb and 20 kroot, my Apostle killed farsight in a challenge and sweeping advanced both squads away. I lost the game 7-12 but I was proud I could set aside a guaranteed victory for the sake of fun, fluff and a crisis suit head on my objective marker where other players would have taken the win, not that there's anything wrong with that at all but I felt the experience was enriched by my choosing the narrative over the win.

Interesting, very fun read. That being said, he is Chaos, I would assume he would gladly abandon his men

 jreilly89 wrote:


Interesting, very fun read. That being said, he is Chaos, I would assume he would gladly abandon his men

He's also a Word Bearer, the spiritual heart of his host and a living avatar of the word of Lorgar. He's forgotten a lot of things in his life, but not brotherhood. Plus, now everyone will fight harder knowing they're loved. They're sloppy things, those snuggly chaos marines.

 Sheokronath wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:


Interesting, very fun read. That being said, he is Chaos, I would assume he would gladly abandon his men

He's also a Word Bearer, the spiritual heart of his host and a living avatar of the word of Lorgar. He's forgotten a lot of things in his life, but not brotherhood. Plus, now everyone will fight harder knowing they're loved. They're sloppy things, those snuggly chaos marines.

Instantly reminded me of this -

 Otto Weston wrote:

 Sheokronath wrote:

 jreilly89 wrote:


Interesting, very fun read. That being said, he is Chaos, I would assume he would gladly abandon his men

He's also a Word Bearer, the spiritual heart of his host and a living avatar of the word of Lorgar. He's forgotten a lot of things in his life, but not brotherhood. Plus, now everyone will fight harder knowing they're loved. They're sloppy things, those snuggly chaos marines.

Instantly reminded me of this -

It's amazing how a bolter gets you an invitation inside instead of polite nodding!

Prefer the casual game, whether I win or lose if there's a point in the game where I go "holy heck that was amazing" then its been a good day to play.