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Hey you Malifaux people.

I have a pension for cartoony wargames and gothic stuff, currently looking at malifaux and bushido as a super casual side system to dabble in.

Anyone keen to have a crack at explaining to me in one or two lines what makes malifaux good / fun for you and why?

I can read a lot of fluff and stuff but always good to be sold on things by other players

For me the control that I have helps, by that I mean the cheating etc. Then the models, they're just gorgeous. Lastly the background is actually really well written. Malifaux is my preferred background over Infinity, WM/H, Fantasy, 40K, and Spartam Games.

If you're up in Brisbane shoot me a PM I have a bunch of crews and would be happy to show you the game, to save you spending a cent to try it.

The Setting:
To me, the best thing about the setting is that because of its completely otherworldly and almost pulpy nature, any kind of trope or character you'd care to mention pops up and can be played. You can get cowboys and railworkers (McCabe) fighting Zombies (McMourning), or Jack The Ripper (Seamus) going up against Ninjas (Viktorias)... and then you can throw in Fire Mages (Sonnia) and 'Goblins' (Gremlins). Basically, there's a little bit of what makes anything else cool in the setting, all steampunked up, so there's likely to be at least some part of the aesthetic you can get into.


Gameplay:
As said above, the control from having the Hand of cards you can 'cheat in' (swap bad cards for good) is fun, and the game plays rather fast and smooth once you get into it.

Models:
Hands down the best plastics on the market, can match Infinity metals for detail and blow GW out of the water. The fact you can get a full 50 point crew from just one Starter and an additional box or two means the startup cost is pretty low.. The hard part is knowing when to stop!

The balance is the big one of me. It is enjoyable playing a system where you can play in theme and still have a viable force. It is also nice that there are really no horrible choices, and while synergy between your models matters, there is almost no model that is unusable. On the same token there are really no models that are auto take. This allows for some creativity to fit into your own style of play and what you like, rather than needing to buy/avoid specific models/factions simply to play the game.

On the subject of lists with a theme quite often there is a lot of natural synergy in a themed list. I like that you are often rewarded for building a visually striking cohesive force and not the pile of random guys who can only be tied together by rules and paint job. That said the random mish-mash can work just as well for most masters with only a handfull realy requiring models that fit the official theme. (Marcus realy likes beasts, Rasputina is too fragile to be a frontline spellcaster so she wants at least 2-3 frozen heart channel points Etc.)

 Trapthem wrote:
as a super casual side system to dabble in.

Malifaux ain't a casual game. Well, maybe after a lot of experience it is, but I'm a decently experienced gamer and find it probably the most demanding of focus of any game I've played, and has a pretty steep learning curve. I like it a lot, but it isn't something I'd recommend as a light-weight alternative.

I'm surprised you say that, I find it quick and relatively easy to burn through a game of Malifaux. But each to their own.

I 100% agree with Cadaver here. Malifaux is by a large margin the best minis game I've ever played, but it is not a good game for a brand new gamer, I think. It is difficult to learn and will be much more challenging during your first few games than something like X-Wing would be. Once you've got it down, it's no more taxing than any other game to actually PLAY, but the learning curve is steep for sure.

How long does a game usually take though?

I mean overall you're building a small force, terrain is super complex like infinity and then its just playing a few games to get the hang of it yeah?

I'm in Adelaide so might check out some demo games before committing to anything.

The game itself probably won't take significantly longer than most other games you play once you are used to it. It may seem slow at first, but a Duel flip and a Damage flip isn't taking any longer than your average 40k squad's dice rolling hits, wounds and saves.c

Yeah, once you've got everything down, I think 2 hours is reasonable, more if you're chatting and hanging out, less if you're focused and quick.

Even the terrain rules aren't very tough, and the game over all has been a lot easier for me to learn than Infinity. Part of the thing that makes it tough to learn though is that flipping cards and working out totals is just DIFFERENT, and it takes some getting used to, and games will be longer until you do.

The good news though (especially when comparing Malifaux to 40k or Infinity) is that when you aren't sure how a rule works, I find two things usually happen. First, you can look it up, and the rule book will have the answer, and it won't be ambiguous and bad. Secondly, the answer will usually just be whatever you thought it SHOULD be. The rules are intuitive, at least as compared to other minis games that I've played. For this reason, I will continue to compare Malifaux more to Magic than to other minis games, because the rules are well written and they work.

Malifaux is great because it's fairly easy to pick up on the rules, but there are ridiculous levels of strategy and tactics once you dig down deep. Killing models takes a back seat to completing your strategies and schemes. Because you know your opponents faction and the strategy and possible schemes before the game, it prevents netlisting.

The fluff is awesome, and they've recently released a pretty cool RPG for it. Honestly, I've set down 40k and scaled back warmachine because Malifaux just blows them out of the water.

The game doesn't (necessarily) take longer, but I find the decision making to be a lot more complex. Maybe some play styles are easier, but I generally find each action takes more thought (often on both players' sides), and then there's the objective system which is another few degrees on that learning curve.

I feel like the general scale of decision complexity/adding to the previous level of complexity is...
40k- basically list building, getting killed until it's your turn, prioritizing targets with what you've got left
WM/H-add in combos and timing
X-wing: bluffing and trickier maneuvering
Infinity: higher-stakes reactions/LOS and more flexibility/fluidity of game structure
Malifaux: lots of non-combat and potentially secret objectives; high variety of set playstyles/specialists

Love Malifaux, but its not a quick game to learn and play well - takes time and effort to understand how it works and more importantly how your chosen models work together[b] and hence gain the rich rewards.

Malifuax is an excellent and involved skirmish game with a huge variety of options and "gangs". Perhaps the only downside is that like a number of other games - you have some limitations of customisation - there are a variety of add-ons for each faction and individual which do help with this.

We have only been playing for a few months and its not the only game we play regularly so takes a couple of hours to get a good 50 Soul Stone game finished.

They are usually pretty close if both sides understand their models and interactions equally well. It took me several games to understand how my Viks and their girls worked and its a game where time pent reading before you start is well worth it.

Its also the only game I know which has you define the objectives and then build your force - tbh quite a few of us had limited figures and so tended to just bring an all comers list but we are moving beyond that now we have more models / options.

No played Infinity (have the rulebook somewhere) so can't compare
Its a lot more complex than say Necromunda
Personally I found it lot more satisfying and intuitive than WM/H
If we want 20-30 min games we play Judge Dredd which is also good fun.

oh and yeah the background / imagery is awesome......

Game play selling points:
Cheating fate and managing your control hand, adds a layer of resource management to the strategy in game.

Alternating activations makes the turns more engaging, as does the amount of interaction that occurs with the opposed duels that are part of attacks.

The game has tremendous variety with the number of possible combinations of strategies and scheme pools.

Due to unrevealed schemes, there is a level of feinting and misdirection that is isn't as prevalent in other games.

A lot of the gameplay stuff sounds like my group would really enjoy it actually.

Are there any pointers to picking minis / factions? Usually I pick what looks good but there are a lot of good looking (some look annoying to build) plastics in the range all from different sections and I have no idea where I would start with it all.

Are the character boxes that come with sidekicks from factions 'starter boxes' ? Or are they add ons for more complex gameplay etc?

Is it possible to just grab a character box and a couple of other random things from that faction, read the rules and get playing or is choice a lot more complicated?

To start, you'll want a 'crew' box, these are the ones with a named Master, typically a named Henchman, and then a few Minions. For example, the Torch and Blade set (Guild faction, Sonnia Master) includes Sonnia Criid (Master), Samuel Hopkins (Henchman), 3 Witchlings (Minions) and the Undying Flame (Totem). It also has all the neccessary cards for the models in the box, and some Upgrade cards.

For starting as a group, I suggest you each pick a character set you like, and go from there; most can do 30-35 Soulstones (points) using upgrade cards to balance them out, and games at that level are still plenty entertaining.

 Trapthem wrote:
A lot of the gameplay stuff sounds like my group would really enjoy it actually.

Are there any pointers to picking minis / factions? Usually I pick what looks good but there are a lot of good looking (some look annoying to build) plastics in the range all from different sections and I have no idea where I would start with it all.

Are the character boxes that come with sidekicks from factions 'starter boxes' ? Or are they add ons for more complex gameplay etc?

Is it possible to just grab a character box and a couple of other random things from that faction, read the rules and get playing or is choice a lot more complicated?

PullMyFinger is a great resource when your are starting out. Its a fan created and maintained wiki, officially sanctioned by wyrd. It has breaks down all the models and helps you figure out how they play who works will for who. It also has a choosing a master page to give a breakdown on what each master does well and how they play: http://pullmyfinger.wikispaces.com/Choosing+a+Master

So do you like pick what you play with inside a faction based on master choice?

Technically you pick after you find out the objectives for the game, which is a really fun way to do it. There are only a few models (mainly totems, which are little dudes who follow your boss man/lady around, and 2 noteable exceptions) tied to one master or another, but a lot of models see more play with certain masters because of synergies etc. If that helps?

Expanding a bit on above response, when you sit down for a game the only thing you are locked into is the faction you are playing. After the terrain is set and the strategy and available schemes are determined, you build your crew. So as you expand, it behooves you the have multiple masters in a faction.

All that said, in any situation the master leading your crew will shape shape the crew to some degree, but the strategy and schemes of the game will usually have a bigger impact.

Ahhh right so your tactics etc work better if say, you have the whole faction, purchased and painted and can pick from on the fly, you dont pre plan lists?

To some degree, yes. After you have all of your archetypes well covered (scheme runners, tanks, damage dealers, etc) you reach a point of diminishing returns. The advantage of a player that has an entire faction over a player that has a couple of complementary crews plus a handful of small boxes is not that great. Though the advantage of the second player above over someone who just has enough to fill out a 50 stone crew can be significant depending on the game set up.

Yeah, having every possible model will almost always be overkill. Very useful, instead, to have your bases covered and to have at least two masters available, with differing strengths and weaknesses. However, a lot of that is for more advanced thought. I've been playing a lot over the past few months and I'm still mostly in the "play what looks cool" phase and not only is it still hella fun, it's still reasonably competitive with other, more advanced, players (that is, they best me due to skill, not model collection size).

Depending on your group we are also quite happy with proxies so that reduces the issue with mini's you don't have.

In this case the card packs that contain all of a given books stat and upgrade cards are very handy and allow you to try stuff without having to constantly flip through the book.

Although in contrast I found the Schemes box of cards suffered from terrible unclear printing and tiny almost useless text.

 Mr Morden wrote:
In this case the card packs that contain all of a given books stat and upgrade cards are very handy and allow you to try stuff without having to constantly flip through the book.

Although in contrast I found the Schemes box of cards suffered from terrible unclear printing and tiny almost useless text.

Don't have any problems reading mine. I'd rate the Scheme and Strategy deck as one of the games essential purchases. Makes set up so much faster.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Trapthem wrote:
Ahhh right so your tactics etc work better if say, you have the whole faction, purchased and painted and can pick from on the fly, you dont pre plan lists?

Pre-planning lists is a bit different in Malifaux. You might pre-plan as in 'If I take X master, I like to take Y scheme runners and Z offensive units for reasons'. It's not really pre planning a list, but more about favouring certain units with certain masters for your own personal reasons. A good example is Pandora for Neverborn. I've seen arguments for and against the Poltergeist (her personal totem) and the Primordial Magic (a generic totem) for different reasons. I've seen arguments for some or no Sorrows at all (her synergistic minions). I've seen arguments for taking Barbaros (Liliths thematic henchman) and arguments against taking him.

It feels more like Infinity than 40k. It's possible to make a dud list if you're not thinking, but there's a great level of flexibility in what you take, and it's not always down to raw numbers. If you can figure out a tactic that makes a unit work with a master in an unconventional but effective way, then go for it.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
In this case the card packs that contain all of a given books stat and upgrade cards are very handy and allow you to try stuff without having to constantly flip through the book.

Although in contrast I found the Schemes box of cards suffered from terrible unclear printing and tiny almost useless text.

Don't have any problems reading mine. I'd rate the Scheme and Strategy deck as one of the games essential purchases. Makes set up so much faster.

I've found that the freely available apps are much quicker for this. Particularly, of you have android, the Malifaux Companion app is great. The Beach is good as well, but hasn't been updated in some time, and it has a few errors.

I've found that the malifaux player base is a lot more helpful than some of the other games'. If you have questions about faction/master choice, you can probably just tell us what sorts of things you like (either in flavor/models or playstyle) and we'd love to help direct you to a master/crew that would suit you.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:
In this case the card packs that contain all of a given books stat and upgrade cards are very handy and allow you to try stuff without having to constantly flip through the book.

Although in contrast I found the Schemes box of cards suffered from terrible unclear printing and tiny almost useless text.

Don't have any problems reading mine. I'd rate the Scheme and Strategy deck as one of the games essential purchases. Makes set up so much faster.

Love the idea of them but for me the execution was terrible - unless I got a duff box? - the coating makes the writing blurry and the text as I said I and the others at our club found very small and does not use the given space. They are very different to the unit cards in style and in particular feel?

Im still looking at minis but the guild justice box is looking pretty sweet cos of pine box... seems like putting an executioner in one to jump at things would be amusing. Im sure there are a million combos i havent looked at.

Looking at a lot of other stuff but working my way around. Scales of just and the gun coffin minis looked amazing.

*edit*

Yeah so i totally bought 3 crew boxes for me and two friends... hahaha

Old sonnia box
Jacob Lynch new box
McMourning new box (cos zombie chihuahua)

I may not have any rules, cards or whatever but its a start