Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The CSMs are distinguished from the loyalist SMs by several features.

I'm curious about the fluff-wise origin of some of these features.

The first is the numerous spikes that dot the surface of a CSM's power armour. Next is the metallic trim, which also forms spiked patterns on an armour's surface.
Where did they come from? I've read that PA is twisted by Chaos, though in most depictions of CSMs the spikes seem like a deliberate addition. In contrast, the armour of a Helbrute appears to be more "naturally" distorted..

Many CSMs have their nozzles connected to their backpacks via an extended support, the so-called "Anvilus" pattern. Some say it's due to CSMs wearing an older mark of armour. But it the BL HH series few of the Traitor Legionnaires sport such nozzles.

CSMs also have the coolest helmets, sporting elaborate horns and whatnot. Do you think these helmets are inspired by the CSMs' daemonic allies?

Maximus Bitch wrote:
Many CSMs have their nozzles connected to their backpacks via an extended support, the so-called "Anvilus" pattern. Some say it's due to CSMs wearing an older mark of armour. But it the BL HH series few of the Traitor Legionnaires sport such nozzles.

In real world terms the original plastic CSM backpack was blatantly organic/mutated, for inexplicable reasons GW replaced it with a variety of similar shaped designs that were purely mechanical, the first Forge World Horus Heresy book was the first canon indication that it had an Imperial origin as they had never been depicted on pre-Heresy armour prior to that. Anvilus was a Forge World which was lost to the Imperium during the Heresy (it was the Imperium's primary source of Land Raiders, the loss of Anvilus forced the Emperor to issue his edict restricting Land Raider use to the Astartes) - presumably it will turn out Anvilus fell to the traitors intact rather than being destroyed by them.

 Gashrog wrote:
In real world terms the original plastic CSM backpack was blatantly organic/mutated

To better illustrate Gashrog's words, here's the first depiction ever of a Chaos Space Marine, from the cover of WD 99.

I presume a lot of their aesthetic came from the Warriors of Chaos line.

 Agent_Tremolo wrote:

 Gashrog wrote:
In real world terms the original plastic CSM backpack was blatantly organic/mutated

To better illustrate Gashrog's words, here's the first depiction ever of a Chaos Space Marine, from the cover of WD 99.

that looks pretty radical. what did ordinary SMs look like at that time?

also, i'm more curious about the fluff reasons for the CSMs appearance, like where they got the idea to put spikes on everything.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gashrog wrote:

Maximus Bitch wrote:
Many CSMs have their nozzles connected to their backpacks via an extended support, the so-called "Anvilus" pattern. Some say it's due to CSMs wearing an older mark of armour. But it the BL HH series few of the Traitor Legionnaires sport such nozzles.

In real world terms the original plastic CSM backpack was blatantly organic/mutated, for inexplicable reasons GW replaced it with a variety of similar shaped designs that were purely mechanical, the first Forge World Horus Heresy book was the first canon indication that it had an Imperial origin as they had never been depicted on pre-Heresy armour prior to that. Anvilus was a Forge World which was lost to the Imperium during the Heresy (it was the Imperium's primary source of Land Raiders, the loss of Anvilus forced the Emperor to issue his edict restricting Land Raider use to the Astartes) - presumably it will turn out Anvilus fell to the traitors intact rather than being destroyed by them.

Neat theory. I guess that sometime between BL's endless meandering and the Battle of Terra, the Traitor Legions will use Anvilus 9 to churn out lots of new backpacks, thereby explaining the difference in their appearance.

Supposedly there's some fluff out there that the Space Marines add spikes to their armor as tribute to a trio of minor Chaos Gods. These gods were cheekily named after some of the game designers at the time.

Apart from the tongue-in-cheek anecdote mentioned above, I do not think there is a fluff in-game reason for CSM to look the way they do. Maybe the Chaos gods are just really fond of spikes? Maybe the CSM add spike in order to look more menacing and intimidating?
The RL reason is of course that CSM have spikes because they were modeled after the WoC, who have spikes because that looks evil and cool.

 Darth Bob wrote:
Supposedly there's some fluff out there that the Space Marines add spikes to their armor as tribute to a trio of minor Chaos Gods. These gods were cheekily named after some of the game designers at the time.

just saw it on the wikia. I wonder which source it comes from.

Ans'l, Mo'rcck and Phraz-Etar are minor Chaos deities. Chaos Space Marines were rumored to praise them by putting spikes on their Power Armour. Their names are puns on the last names of Bryan Ansell, Michael Moorcock, and Frank Frazetta, writers and artists whose work all contributed to the look and feel of the Warhammer Fantasy and Warhammer 40,000 universes.

And because of this, I've just discovered Frank Frazetta's art. Simply amazing, great retro feel, that man was a genius.

it is stated spikes are an homage to Malal the lost Chaos god, but I guess because he isn't canon we really don't have a reason..

Maximus Bitch wrote:

that looks pretty radical. what did ordinary SMs look like at that time?

Back then they were all beakies:
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Space_Marines/Space_Marine-Infantry-and-Accessories/MK-VI-CORVUS-ARMOUR.html

Its a combination of them modifying their own armour as an act of worship of the chaos gods, along with the mutating power of the warp twisting everything.

Crimson slaughter are a good example, as they were normally marines, went into the eye of terror, and pretty much immediately gained ornante spikey mutatey armour.

Captyn_Bob wrote:
Its a combination of them modifying their own armour as an act of worship of the chaos gods, along with the mutating power of the warp twisting everything.

Crimson slaughter are a good example, as they were normally marines, went into the eye of terror, and pretty much immediately gained ornante spikey mutatey armour.

unfortunately the HH series doesn't tell us when or why they started going into the spiky business

Weeeelll

Typhon had a horn on his helmet in his first mention, long before the heresy broke out. That's possibly the first example of deliberate armour modification.

The word bearers had possessed marines before that tho and they would have had mutant armour, but only when the daemon takes control.

The image of the first Chaos Space Marine looks like the artist drew a lot of inspiration from H.R Giger

Maximus Bitch wrote:
just saw it on the wikia. I wonder which source it comes from.

3e Codex Chaos Space Marine, Spiky Bits entry in the Chaos Wargear section.

 dragoonmaster101 wrote:
it is stated spikes are an homage to Malal

I don't think that has ever been stated.

Spikes are evil and scary. And what else are you supposed to put skulls on?

 Great White wrote:
Spikes are evil and scary. And what else are you supposed to put skulls on?

a large number of things apparently

One just has to hope they're properly recycling all of these unused skeletons.

Veteran Sergeant wrote:One just has to hope they're properly recycling all of these unused skeletons.

Spikes serve the dual purpose of turning your armour into a powerful weapon and looking awesome.

Great White wrote:Spikes are evil and scary. And what else are you supposed to put skulls on?

I'll give you a hint. It hangs and it wobbles, then it stiffens in the cobbles and it fills her bits and bobbles

Spiky bits used to give one re roll to hit (I believe).