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So I was recently on a deployment, and came back to this new necron codex,
After I looked through it a few times im noticing some things..

first of all, decurion detachment is looking like the solid choice
as far as this goes...
I have no tomb blades, and obviously need to pick up at least one squad,
from what Ive seen, most people load them out with gauss.... why?

monoliths still look like a pile of turd...

also I had 15 destroyers and 3 heavies collecting dust... and now I really want to play with them...

also looks like wraiths got better, which is awesome, i never had spyders before tho, so I guess Ill grab at least one,

what are some other good things worth taking?

I have a trancendant ctan that looks pretty pooey now

I have the obelisk and 3 monoliths that still seem kinda lame

I have pretty much everything except tomb blades and spyders and thats about to be rectified

With Gauss, Tomb Blades operate as better, more mobile Immortals. Tesla has been nerfed since it no longer works on snap-shots, and the Beamer is generally considered substandard since a small blast is roughly analogous to two hits anyway and +1 Strength isn't a good trade off for AP4 and Gauss.

 KonTheory wrote:
So I was recently on a deployment, and came back to this new necron codex,
After I looked through it a few times im noticing some things..

first of all, decurion detachment is looking like the solid choice
as far as this goes...
I have no tomb blades, and obviously need to pick up at least one squad,
from what Ive seen, most people load them out with gauss.... why?

monoliths still look like a pile of turd...

also I had 15 destroyers and 3 heavies collecting dust... and now I really want to play with them...

also looks like wraiths got better, which is awesome, i never had spyders before tho, so I guess Ill grab at least one,

what are some other good things worth taking?

I have a trancendant ctan that looks pretty pooey now

I have the obelisk and 3 monoliths that still seem kinda lame

I have pretty much everything except tomb blades and spyders and thats about to be rectified

1. The Monolith got indirectly better because of the appeal and strength of footslogging armies now. They're not gun platforms, but instead, are tactical centerpieces with which you should build your army around to take the most advantage of.

2. Tomb Blades can now provide us with something that we didn't have before: An effective way to kill skimmers. Anything from Tyranid Warriors and Venomthropes, to Space Marine Scouts, to Tau infantry, will die easily to them because of the AP4, and they can kill any vehicle, while denying skimmers their jink saves.

3. Destroyers are awesomely good, and a ton of fun.

4. Don't compare the Transcendant Ctan to it's older incarnation, and it's not a bad unit. It can Deep Strike, which fixes the slow problem the other ctans have. Also, +1 S and W isn't bad.

5. Obelisk is actually better than bringing 3 A-Barges now. More durable, same amount of firepower for the most part, and can move fast. Taking as part of the Living Tomb is awesome, and not many armies can deal with 2-3 Deep Striking AV14 vehicles, and half your army up in their face turn 2.

6. Wraiths are still good, if not better, but now, I don't rely on them to kill anything. I've used both variants of Praetorians with the formation, and they've done some serious killing work. If you want stuff dead, don't look to Wraiths, as they're more of a tarpit in my experience.

While I think you made some very good points, I still think monoliths are pretty bad outside formations and lists designed around bringing them.

Wraiths are also better than before, and they were already incredible. They are fast, durable, and bring loads of s6 rending attacks. They still outperform praetorians and lychguard by far, even if those two units are no longer useless. Wraiths do not really tarpit things since they also rip whatever they fight to shreds.

Ratflinger wrote:
While I think you made some very good points, I still think monoliths are pretty bad outside formations and lists designed around bringing them.

Wraiths are also better than before, and they were already incredible. They are fast, durable, and bring loads of s6 rending attacks. They still outperform praetorians and lychguard by far, even if those two units are no longer useless. Wraiths do not really tarpit things since they also rip whatever they fight to shreds.

Eh, rending as opposed to all AP 2-3 attacks? Plus, I'd rather take a beefed up Lychguard squad with Orikan and an Overlord anyday over wraiths.

Lychguard certainly hit harder, but are still slow. I still think Wraiths are more useful since the rending attacks will do enough against good saves while the massed high strength attacks are enough to chew through masses of less durable wounds. But each to their own, I still think Wraiths are crazy good.

Wraiths have mediocre damage output. Praetorians and Lychguard are the high-damage-output guys.

Keep in mind here that the Wraith used in the calcs below costs considerably more than the competition.

Wraith on charge against MEQ: 0.778 wounds

TP with rod against MEQ:

shooting: 0.444 wounds
hammer of wrath: 0.222 wounds
beatin' the crap: 1.000 wounds
total: 1.666 wounds

TP with particle caster and voidblade against MEQ:

shooting: 0.185 wounds
hammer of wrath: 0.222 wounds
hittin' that ass: 0.667
total: 1.074 wounds

Lychguard with sword and shield against MEQ: 1.000 wounds

Lychguard with warscythe against MEQ: 1.250 wounds

hmm... I only ever bought one squad of lychguard..
I still dont think Id run lych or prae.. they look alright now but I dont think I can justify spending the money on them to maybe play with them lol

I was playing around with a list like this

Decurion

Nemesor
5 immortals w/ night scythe
5 immortals w/ night scythe
10 warriors
10 warriors in ark
3 tomb blades

destroyer lord
5 destroyers
5 destroyers
5 destroyers

this is around 1735 give or take some load out

 KonTheory wrote:
hmm... I only ever bought one squad of lychguard..
I still dont think Id run lych or prae.. they look alright now but I dont think I can justify spending the money on them to maybe play with them lol

I was playing around with a list like this

Decurion

Nemesor
5 immortals w/ night scythe
5 immortals w/ night scythe
10 warriors
10 warriors in ark
3 tomb blades

destroyer lord
5 destroyers
5 destroyers
5 destroyers

this is around 1735 give or take some load out

Well, damage output aside, why not give Sword and Board Lychguard a try? 3++ with a 4+++. I've played them in 3 games and they have....not....died.....

That aside, your list does look rather devastating. If you want to focus more on Destroyers in the future though, I made a very competitive list with a Destroyer Cult and the Judicator Battalion. BS5 rerolling 1s Destroyers that reroll everything else. They've murdered anyone who's played against them so far.

All this talk of necron melee capabilities and no mention of flayed ones?

Point for point they are now one of the best melee units out there.

 Big Blind Bill wrote:
All this talk of necron melee capabilities and no mention of flayed ones?

Point for point they are now one of the best melee units out there.

Completely agreed, but the are expensive money-wise and not everyone wants to field them when they have Wraiths. >.> Even though Wraiths aren't the best option anymore.

Yeah... I started playing on the last codex so I don't really have any units that sucked before, don't have many lych, prae, or flayed lol
After seeing the decurion tho, would you ever play without that detachment?

 KonTheory wrote:
Yeah... I started playing on the last codex so I don't really have any units that sucked before, don't have many lych, prae, or flayed lol
After seeing the decurion tho, would you ever play without that detachment?

I collected most of the old codex, save for Flayed Ones, even though 50% of he book was useless.

And no, I doubt I will ever not use the Decurion. It's A. Really strong, and B. Very fluffy at the same time.

I will not keep yapping about my glorious wraiths, but I will leave one more post on the subject.

Lychguard still struggle to reach whatever they are aiming for due to having limited movement whereas wraiths ignore terrain, move 12 and have fleet on the charge. The 3++ save still is important against ap, even if you get a 4-5+++ save. And finally wraiths do not hit at i2 which will make a a fair bit of difference.

That said, it is great that more melee units are viable, especially praetorians with rods and flayed ones. Even if I would generally wish to keep my praetorians mobile and as such lose out on the HoW. Wraiths are still fast, durable and hurt, and are very versatile. Praetorians are almost as fast and hurt more aimed with rods if they can survive moving up the board and then last through the combat, and their models look neat.

Ratflinger wrote:

That said, it is great that more melee units are viable, especially praetorians with rods and flayed ones. Even if I would generally wish to keep my praetorians mobile and as such lose out on the HoW. Wraiths are still fast, durable and hurt, and are very versatile. Praetorians are almost as fast and hurt more aimed with rods if they can survive moving up the board and then last through the combat, and their models look neat.

Well, I will leave another post on the subject. Praetorians with Voidblades. I don't know the math hammer on it, but consider this. 6 Wraiths is 18 attacks, 24 on the charge. 12 T5 3++ wounds. With Whip coils, it is 258 points. 10 Praetorians with Voidblades are 280 points, only 10 wounds, but 30 attacks, 40 on the charge. Only S5, but AP4 as opposed to ap -, and with rending still. Less overall wounds, but still come with RP, and overall have more attacks.

Hence why I go to them to kill things.

Anyhow, regarding that list. 115 points to 1850 does not lend a whole lot of room for melee support. I would likely consider adding some heavy destroyers or otherwise get a bit more high strength shooting into it.

 KonTheory wrote:
So I was recently on a deployment, and came back to this new necron codex,
After I looked through it a few times im noticing some things..

first of all, decurion detachment is looking like the solid choice
as far as this goes...
I have no tomb blades, and obviously need to pick up at least one squad,
from what Ive seen, most people load them out with gauss.... why?

monoliths still look like a pile of turd...

also I had 15 destroyers and 3 heavies collecting dust... and now I really want to play with them...

also looks like wraiths got better, which is awesome, i never had spyders before tho, so I guess Ill grab at least one,

what are some other good things worth taking?

I have a trancendant ctan that looks pretty pooey now

I have the obelisk and 3 monoliths that still seem kinda lame

I have pretty much everything except tomb blades and spyders and thats about to be rectified

Monoliths are fantastic.. The Living Tomb formation really lets you project sudden force.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
With Gauss, Tomb Blades operate as better, more mobile Immortals. Tesla has been nerfed since it no longer works on snap-shots, and the Beamer is generally considered substandard since a small blast is roughly analogous to two hits anyway and +1 Strength isn't a good trade off for AP4 and Gauss.

2 hits is more than triple the firepower of 1 Gauss shot (0.66 hits). S6 is more practical than AP4 because rarely do you catch 4+ sv infantry in the open these days, and the beamer is AP5 against worse saves anyway

The real reason for Gauss Blasters is that in combination with nebuloscopes and rolling a 6, you can take some HPs off holofielded/disruption-podded skimmers without them getting to jink in any way.

But seriously, a 3 man tomb blade squad isnt going to do anything significant to skimmers this way - you'd need at least 10 and get them into rapid-fire range to really threaten a skimmer.

Particle Beamers with nebuloscopes on the other hand are pretty neat against Tyranids, Orks, Eldar, Dark Eldar, anything really.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 krodarklorr wrote:
4. Don't compare the Transcendant Ctan to it's older incarnation, and it's not a bad unit. It can Deep Strike, which fixes the slow problem the other ctans have. Also, +1 S and W isn't bad.

Does the C'tan do more damage in cc than at range, though? Getting them into combat would mean ignoring the entire C'tan powers chart.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 KonTheory wrote:
After seeing the decurion tho, would you ever play without that detachment?

I would. General Combined Arms Detachment allows for some nice combos in low point games like bringing a single Doomsday Ark, or running Orikan (as your single HQ) + Lychguard without having to spend tons of points to get a Royal Court and your mandatory non-cryptek HQ as well; you can also bring one troop of Triarch Praetorians which is impossible with the decurion; etc. etc.

 Sir Arun wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 krodarklorr wrote:
4. Don't compare the Transcendant Ctan to it's older incarnation, and it's not a bad unit. It can Deep Strike, which fixes the slow problem the other ctans have. Also, +1 S and W isn't bad.

Does the C'tan do more damage in cc than at range, though? Getting them into combat would mean ignoring the entire C'tan powers chart.

Oh no, you have to ignore those random powers....

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Sir Arun wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 krodarklorr wrote:
4. Don't compare the Transcendant Ctan to it's older incarnation, and it's not a bad unit. It can Deep Strike, which fixes the slow problem the other ctans have. Also, +1 S and W isn't bad.

Does the C'tan do more damage in cc than at range, though? Getting them into combat would mean ignoring the entire C'tan powers chart.

Oh no, you have to ignore those random powers....

With only a 6 inch movespeed the powers are more likely to have a greater effect on the game than the cc capabilities imo.

 Big Blind Bill wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Sir Arun wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 krodarklorr wrote:
4. Don't compare the Transcendant Ctan to it's older incarnation, and it's not a bad unit. It can Deep Strike, which fixes the slow problem the other ctans have. Also, +1 S and W isn't bad.

Does the C'tan do more damage in cc than at range, though? Getting them into combat would mean ignoring the entire C'tan powers chart.

Oh no, you have to ignore those random powers....

With only a 6 inch movespeed the powers are more likely to have a greater effect on the game than the cc capabilities imo.

If you roll correctly, sure.

 krodarklorr wrote:
If you roll correctly, sure.

Usually 4 out of 6 powers are average to good against what you're targeting, only 2 are duds.

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Big Blind Bill wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Sir Arun wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 krodarklorr wrote:
4. Don't compare the Transcendant Ctan to it's older incarnation, and it's not a bad unit. It can Deep Strike, which fixes the slow problem the other ctans have. Also, +1 S and W isn't bad.

Does the C'tan do more damage in cc than at range, though? Getting them into combat would mean ignoring the entire C'tan powers chart.

Oh no, you have to ignore those random powers....

With only a 6 inch movespeed the powers are more likely to have a greater effect on the game than the cc capabilities imo.

If you roll correctly, sure.

Even if you roll the wrong powers you will still probably do more damage with them than melee attacks lol. There is a reason that walking melee MCs are out of the meta, especially ones without a ton of wounds or a great saving throw.

Plus with 4 attacks you do 2.66 hits and 2.22 AP2 wounds on average.