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Working up my list for a local tourney.

I am pondering what assault unit to bring. One of the things about Eldar (besides the insane cheese) is they play in all phases of the game. I have been a tau player for a while and this whole using warp charges and assaulting is just MIND BLOWING!! I want to bring a hard hitting assault unit.

What unit do you think works best....

Harlequins 6 troupe members... Shadow seer and Death Jester.. Troupe Leader here I also have the Neuro Pistols for 6 ap2 shots wounding on 2's

Banshee's 8 strong with exarch

Scorpions 8 Strong with exarch

I have my army setup to give Invisibility or shrouding... I would even consider putting in a Phoenix lord for either eldar group..... is there another unit I am missing?

Now of course I have my Wraithknight and he will offset some target priority.

Thanks for any advice!

A Cast of Players Harlequin formation is very potent in an Eldar army. The Shadowseer adds additional Warp Charge, and the Phantasmancy psychic discipline is, in my opinion, one of the best in the game for facing non-vehicle opponents. The Death Jester in the formation isn't really great, since you want to be running with your troop as often as possible, unless you're sticking them in a Wave Serpent or Raider, but if you find yourself in a position where you can't assault but you can shoot, he'll potentially just erase a unit from the board with his special forced fall-back rules.

The main thing is that you can equip the Harlequins for any enemy, but need to know the enemy you're equipping for. If it's for pin-point heavy infantry destruction, you need a transport and neuro-pistols. If you change these up for Fusion Pistols, your Harlequins can even pretend to be Fire Dragons (though the 3" for melta is a a serious matter for explosions). If you need a unit that can counter-charge heavy infantry, caresses and no transport is needed. If you need a unit to take out hordes/swarms, go for the Embrace.

Just remember, even if you can't go against what you built them for, the Harlequins are still a strong assault uni, especially with a Shadowseer in the mix. They get lots of attacks and a high weapon skill and reasonable strength, and the Shadowseer's miststave is fleshbane too. It won't do great when not properly equipped, but it's still better than most units in the game! I had a unit of 5 with a Shadowseer take out a unit of 3 Necron Wraiths (no resurrection protocols).

Which is better?
Yes.

They have different roles.

Harlequins:
... are paper, but protected by lots of shenanigans. Keep them out of LoS if possible. Even a 4+ cover usually sees them removed via incidental fire.

Don't expect to do a lot of shooting. If its a close charge (2-3"), sure, blast away. But if its a distant charge (6"+), you don't want to be any further than you are. So you probably don't want to kill anything. If you can't charge, you'll probably want to either run closer, or run into Cover/LOS. Bear in mind you *ignore* terrain, not just Move Through Cover.

So super Pistols, and even the Death Jester, don't do a lot for them, most of the time. Although the Death Jester is necessary for Cast of Players.

So Harliquins are a shenanigany bully unit that can get in, do some damage, and get away. Provided shenanigans succeed.

Striking Scorpions love Cover too, but in a different way. They're basically Assault Marines, but with deployment shenanigans and stealth instead of Jetpacks. They are bullies, and take some pre planning to use right. Never expect them to win a toe to toe fight. They attack the guys who sit in the backfield and shoot. And they do it well.

Banshees changed a lot in the last book. They can still do their counter assault thing, but now rock as the first unit in. They can rush up a flank and hit fast. Not hard, but fast. If you can find a sameish-sized unit of 3+ armor, you'll do some damage, and win the fight. If your opponent needs their overwatch, they do amazing. And with their speed, can reach some units your opponent doesn't want in CC. Those are the things Banshees do well. What they don't do well is hit hard. Or survive. S3 has trouble wounding T4, and flails against T5+. Being T3 4+ makes them as tough as DAs. Although now they're just as cheap?

Which is my favorite? All of them. Which would I suggest? All of them. Although probably not in the same list. Depends on what you need.

I’m not trying to be a jerk but looking through the first page gets you this: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/650104.page and search is your friend.

I'd go with an Aspect formation with Banshees, Scorpions and Shining Spears.
The three work so well together, and the formation bumps them to WS5.
Scorpions and Spears really get most jobs done, but having a very cheap unit of "no overwatch for you" is too good to pass up for the points, and you want a 3rd combat unit to take advantage of the +1 WS.

Spears can put pressure and support anywhere within a turn. They also will wreck walkers, which is something that banshees and scorpions don't do. Scorpions put out a decent number of S4 hits, along with a good number of S6 AP2 hits. They sweep the backfield effectively, and can start out on the flank threatening the backfield early on.
Banshees are great for support. No over-watch, a few S5 AP2 attacks, and -2 leadership. Combined with any other assault unit, that can tip the balance.

-Matt

 Zerib wrote:
I’m not trying to be a jerk but looking through the first page gets you this: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/650104.page and search is your friend.

Guess I can take this a couple of different ways.. but gonna just let it go and assume you were just giving me more info to read.

Thanks Fellow Buckeye! Even if you are jerk!

So in summary of posts so far....

Scorpions are good but have some bad matchups...
Banshees.... low T so they can easily get shot up... and their attacks are not very strong either... AP3... BUT they do -2 leadership and no overwatch...

Dark Eldar are not something I want to use.... Already played that one and the new book was done poorly... No thanks!

Harlequins... do it all.. they get real expensive too ... will give them a try...

Shining spears are expensive.. but they are quick and hit decently.. but do they have staying power? how many do you need?

Gotta put in a word for my favourite aspect units, the scorpions.
The mandiblasters allow you to go after low wounded monstrous creatures and a exarch with the claw can go toe to toe with a lot of melee units especially when the seargent has a thunder hammer, power fist, powerclaw this giving him 5(int difference) +1 (melee plus pistol) + 1(charge) +2( base) attacks at strength 6 and weapon skill 6(or 5) the squad I use at 6 has quite a small size and is easy to hide, with 2+ cover pretty much in any terrain they pretty durable if you can't hide them. And they all have better chainswords then the imperium, make sure to make a big deal of it too

My dragon Knights (shining spears) exarch when in the range of my avatar managed to solo Mephiston(with good rolling to hit was actually pretty easy).

 hiveof_chimera wrote:
Gotta put in a word for my favourite aspect units, the scorpions.
The mandiblasters allow you to go after low wounded monstrous creatures and a exarch with the claw can go toe to toe with a lot of melee units especially when the seargent has a thunder hammer, power fist, powerclaw this giving him 5(int difference) +1 (melee plus pistol) + 1(charge) +2( base) attacks at strength 6 and weapon skill 6(or 5) the squad I use at 6 has quite a small size and is easy to hide, with 2+ cover pretty much in any terrain they pretty durable if you can't hide them. And they all have better chainswords then the imperium, make sure to make a big deal of it too

My dragon Knights (shining spears) exarch when in the range of my avatar managed to solo Mephiston(with good rolling to hit was actually pretty easy).

A marine with a thunder hammer is still init 4, he's just attacking and piling in at init 1. So you're "only" getting 6 S6 AP2 attacks in the challenge, hitting on 2+.

-Matt

Striking Scorpions are very impressive. They whallopped my necron Wraiths pretty good recently and have always been strong in general.

 HawaiiMatt wrote:

 hiveof_chimera wrote:
Gotta put in a word for my favourite aspect units, the scorpions.
The mandiblasters allow you to go after low wounded monstrous creatures and a exarch with the claw can go toe to toe with a lot of melee units especially when the seargent has a thunder hammer, power fist, powerclaw this giving him 5(int difference) +1 (melee plus pistol) + 1(charge) +2( base) attacks at strength 6 and weapon skill 6(or 5) the squad I use at 6 has quite a small size and is easy to hide, with 2+ cover pretty much in any terrain they pretty durable if you can't hide them. And they all have better chainswords then the imperium, make sure to make a big deal of it too

My dragon Knights (shining spears) exarch when in the range of my avatar managed to solo Mephiston(with good rolling to hit was actually pretty easy).

A marine with a thunder hammer is still init 4, he's just attacking and piling in at init 1. So you're "only" getting 6 S6 AP2 attacks in the challenge, hitting on 2+.

-Matt

Indeed, though they're still getting 8 against a nob, do you mean wounding on 2+?

The worst part is, the only reason to run any of these units is just "for fun." If you're strictly speaking looking for the "most effective" Eldar assault army, it's still just ... Wraithknights.

Surprise surprise, they're also the best at shooting.

And, you know, everything.

Kinda depressing.

the_scotsman wrote:
The worst part is, the only reason to run any of these units is just "for fun." If you're strictly speaking looking for the "most effective" Eldar assault army, it's still just ... Wraithknights.

Surprise surprise, they're also the best at shooting.

And, you know, everything.

Kinda depressing.

Somebody's bitter. At least he's only running one Wraithknight!

To the OP: formations are your friend. Harlequins have some excellent ones, and the Aspect Host for Eldar can go a long way toward making Eldar better at assault. Just make sure to gove them adaquate fire support. You might also look at Jain Zar if you are running Banshees; she is one of the best challenge characters in the game.

 TheNewBlood wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:
The worst part is, the only reason to run any of these units is just "for fun." If you're strictly speaking looking for the "most effective" Eldar assault army, it's still just ... Wraithknights.

Surprise surprise, they're also the best at shooting.

And, you know, everything.

Kinda depressing.

Somebody's bitter. At least he's only running one Wraithknight!

To the OP: formations are your friend. Harlequins have some excellent ones, and the Aspect Host for Eldar can go a long way toward making Eldar better at assault. Just make sure to gove them adaquate fire support. You might also look at Jain Zar if you are running Banshees; she is one of the best challenge characters in the game.

Heroes path is a goto ally for me, solitare is one of my favourites especially with the ability to move 12, infiltrate, and 2+ cover.
Jain zar is quite amazing in challenges, however a IH smashbane (2PFist,GorgonC,Bike) will kill her, and he's a regular character to see in
Games.

the_scotsman wrote:
The worst part is, the only reason to run any of these units is just "for fun." If you're strictly speaking looking for the "most effective" Eldar assault army, it's still just ... Wraithknights.

Surprise surprise, they're also the best at shooting.

And, you know, everything.

Kinda depressing.

Sometimes. MSU is good too. A wraith knight dies to the first barrage from grav centurions. For less than a wraith knight, you could run 3 units of assault eldar. While 3 for 1 might not sound like a good idea, 6 for 2 really changed the dynamic of the army, you cover way more of the table and can hit multiple objectives at once with ease.

I'll say this much. My last game was Eldar vs Eldar. I had Karandras and some Scorpions (including Exarch and Claw), my opponent had Jain Zar leading some Banshees (including Exarch). 1 Banshee survived, with the mob being tied up in combat with a Seer Council for almost 10 player turns. Meanwhile the Scorps outflanking on any board edge (thinks to Karandras) were doing serious damage in his backfield.

 Happyjew wrote:
I'll say this much. My last game was Eldar vs Eldar. I had Karandras and some Scorpions (including Exarch and Claw), my opponent had Jain Zar leading some Banshees (including Exarch). 1 Banshee survived, with the mob being tied up in combat with a Seer Council for almost 10 player turns. Meanwhile the Scorps outflanking on any board edge (thinks to Karandras) were doing serious damage in his backfield.

You won the match up.
Power weapons vs invul saves is a horrible use of banshees, and the scorpions really wouldn't want to tangle with the massed AP3 hits from the banshees.

 HawaiiMatt wrote:

 Happyjew wrote:
I'll say this much. My last game was Eldar vs Eldar. I had Karandras and some Scorpions (including Exarch and Claw), my opponent had Jain Zar leading some Banshees (including Exarch). 1 Banshee survived, with the mob being tied up in combat with a Seer Council for almost 10 player turns. Meanwhile the Scorps outflanking on any board edge (thinks to Karandras) were doing serious damage in his backfield.

You won the match up.
Power weapons vs invul saves is a horrible use of banshees, and the scorpions really wouldn't want to tangle with the massed AP3 hits from the banshees.

Wouldn't say its a horrible use, a seer council is 2 farseers and 5 warlocks AT LEAST that means roughly 285 points of banshees and jain zar tied up at least 375 points, not including sprit stone, spears, bikes or eldrad. And he tied down the force multiplier or all game, it's not actually that bad of a move.