Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Yes yes age of sigmar good bad, we've had those threads but what im talking here is the new Total warhammer game seems an odd time to release after fantasy was completely changed. I mean why keep reminding those who don't like AoS what they have lost. Considering the game will work on mass armies, point systems and so on. Its like saying "Well warhammer fantasy wasn't good enough to keep around but we're still going to make money off it" why not make it Sigmarines and just be done with it. Good enough to sell us as a video game but not good enough to keep around the tabletop. you don't make a new game based on a system you deemed not good enough and replaced.

The games just going to remind me personally that a 9th edition that was actually worked on could have easily worked.

I dont consider it to be salt in the wound, I'm still perfectly capable of organizing a game of 8th edition with my friends should I choose to.

What I DO consider it to be however is a real headscratcher. Video Games are big publicity, especially BIG video games in a highly popular series from well known and reputed publishers. This game was a huge marketing opportunity to try to inject some new blood into the old system (at least IMO), just as DoW was for 40k. I dont see this working as a boost to Age of Sigmar, as they are technically different settings, and Age of Sigmar is branded differently from this which will lead to some confusion amongst those who aren't readily familiar with the game.

Then again, the long standing rumor as to why GW wouldn't allow a game like this to release in the past was that they felt it would undercut sales of the tabletop product. SInce that product technically no longer exists, maybe they felt it was time to finally allow it.

chaos0xomega wrote:

Then again, the long standing rumor as to why GW wouldn't allow a game like this to release in the past was that they felt it would undercut sales of the tabletop product. SInce that product technically no longer exists, maybe they felt it was time to finally allow it.

I really have to question who runs the department at GW who actually thinks thats how things work but yeah it doesn't make much sense from a business outlook.

Some new kid plays the game thinks wow this world is awesome im going to collect the tabletop > goes into the store looking for fantasy.

"Sorry kid the fantasy world we introduced to you no longer exists, how about some sigmarines instead?"

Its like trying to sell someone who wants to collect Chaos after playing Dawn of war, Space hulk.

Games Workshop didn't make the game. Video games have long, changing development schedules. Changing the game to AoS would almost restart the development process, I'd guess. GW can't work on the schedule of another company.

I agree with Chaos0xomega, the timing makes GW look like idiots. They must have known well in advance that they were switching to AoS, it wasn't developed in the last two weeks. They've had artists, writers and sculptors at work, they've created new moulds and new product lines, I'm guessing they've had a team on AoS for one to two years.

Total War: Warhammer is still in development after the whole end times product cycle and even now, after AoS has been released.

It's the strangest and most notable mixed message I've ever seen a company give.

 NoPoet wrote:
I agree with Chaos0xomega, the timing makes GW look like idiots. They must have known well in advance that they were switching to AoS, it wasn't developed in the last two weeks. They've had artists, writers and sculptors at work, they've created new moulds and new product lines, I'm guessing they've had a team on AoS for one to two years.

Total War: Warhammer is still in development after the whole end times product cycle and even now, after AoS has been released.

It's the strangest and most notable mixed message I've ever seen a company give.

As said previously TWW has been in development for some time, and apart from initially giving the OK, is out of GW's control I think. To suggest that anyone in Nottingham has given the slightest consideration to what will happen when hordes of potential new customers for the Old World come round, is to imply a level of joined-up thinking that I've yet to see. But who knows? Perhaps they are going to pull another surprise like the AoS rules, and bring out some fluff / roleplay type books to continue supporting their much loved creation after all.

Creative only acquired the license in late 2012 (December actually), meaning that the game basically went into development in 2013 (unless those last 20 days of 2012 really matter to you). End Times released in October 2014, and given its size & scope its safe to say that it was already being worked on at the time Creative Assembly acquired the license. In other words, GW and Sega did it this way from the start.

Also worth noting that apparrently Total War: Warhammer will be a trilogy.

Obey the next two in the series is TWW:End Times and TWW:RealmGate Wars

Yes it is, because I don't have a good enough computer to play it

chaos0xomega wrote:


Also worth noting that apparrently Total War: Warhammer will be a trilogy.

Excellent, I can hardly wait. By the look of it TWW will be the first of a string of Warhammer lovelyness. How do you think GW will take advantage of this, apart from cashing the royalties cheques.
I mean when Dawn of War first came out the situation with 40K was pretty different wasn't it?

I think, personally, that GW will release Warhammer 9th a few weeks after TWW is released. That is so that the people who played the game CAN go and pick up warhams Fantasy models from a store with a brand new ruleset.
At least, that is what I would do.

 AUGmaniac wrote:
I think, personally, that GW will release Warhammer 9th a few weeks after TWW is released. That is so that the people who played the game CAN go and pick up warhams Fantasy models from a store with a brand new ruleset.
At least, that is what I would do.

I was thinking more on the lines of a series of scenario/narrative/campaign type books. The very first army books back in the 90's often had really well fleshed out scenarios in them - the battle of East Gate in the Dwarf book for example.
I reckon that could be a great success.

Every unit in TW:W has models and rules for it sold by GW. If it really takes off they could have a part of the website that guides potential buyers to where the featured miniatures and rules can be found.

 Bottle wrote:
Every unit in TW:W has models and rules for it sold by GW. If it really takes off they could have a part of the website that guides potential buyers to where the featured miniatures and rules can be found.

That's somewhat like this though:

"Hey, I like this batman character doing cool stuff in Arkham Asylum, and I heard there's a miniature game to go with him..."

[later, at the local Entertainment Workstation store]

"Oh yes, we do have the batman model, and rules to go with him. Only now he isn't in Arkham Asylum."

"Oh, so where in Gotham is he?"

"Well Gotham doesn't exist anymore, it's completely destroyed and will never come back. He now drives his Batmobile in Batcity backed up up by his Batpolice wearing badges made from Batium."

"Oh... well can I still play him with the older rules?"

"Yes, though these rules are not officially supported, cannot be played in Entertainment Workstation stores, and you will have to find the essential rules from 3rd parties because we no longer sell them. Also, players are likely to have made modifications to these rules in order to balance out their flawed state, so you will have to learn those as well."

Ultimately it is just another element in the pile of poor GW decisions.

Kinda, except there's nothing wrong with using AoS rules to fight battles based in the old world. In fact it's "officially supported" by GW to do so, as mentioned in the compendiums.

Obviously the-world-that-was will eventually be forgotton about, but at the moment the only thing gone completely is the 8th rules and Total War Warhammer does not have any real connection with the rule set.

I didn't think of it that way. Though there will still be mounting discrepancies as they re-do their model lines, that is a good point.

No, not a salt in a wound at all. I'm just ecstatic that CA got the license before AoS and I won't have to play in that IP law driven PG7 garbage of an universe.

I also wonder if end times and AoS are not the exact reason that TW game in old world became possible. They always seemed to believe thatcomputer games too similar to their tt games would eat the sales. It's bs ofc but it's gw after all.

Anyway great great thing, Warhammer TW, a dream come true tbh.

Plumbumbarum wrote:
No, not a salt in a wound at all. I'm just ecstatic that CA got the license before AoS and I won't have to play in that IP law driven PG7 garbage of an universe.

I also wonder if end times and AoS are not the exact reason that TW game in old world became possible. They always seemed to believe thatcomputer games too similar to their tt games would eat the sales. It's bs ofc but it's gw after all.

Anyway great great thing, Warhammer TW, a dream come true tbh.

AOS is far from PG7 after reading the BL books FAAAAR from it.

Dam if only Total War: Warhammer had end times characters...
Who wouldnt want to see nagash and an army of spooky scary skeletons fight chaos?

That video is all the things I love about the Warhammer world!

Hmmm...

I forgot about Total War: Warhammer...

That looks like a lot of fun, I've always been a big TW fan and I still play Rome every once in awhile. Those guys really know how to run a franchise and I'd be pretty hard pressed to find another series that I could choose over the Total War games.

Actually I'm just gonna go off on a tangent.

If you really wanna talk solid video game titles I'd put my personal top picks as follows.

Total War. Rome or Viking Invasion taking top spot.

Elder Scrolls. Morrowind is king.

The X-Series. If you don't know about Kyle Brennan and the AP Gunner... Damn... You gotta... Open world space simulation in a unique setting developed over the course of four titles. The end of X2 made me cry. Made. Me. Cry. Just let that sink in for a minute... (Darkcloak has tear ducts? No! Open world space sim!)

Now there are three game franchises that are long lived and well loved. So what the hell does this have to do with the topic? Nothing yet, let me think...

Ah yes! Its not unheard of in the video game world for a company to run a franchise successfully for a number of years. I daresay that the Total War games are pretty universally well received and well supported.

I forgot where I was going. Dammit I'm gonna fire up the old WindowsXP and blast some Xenon!

Um.. Yeah. I think it's great that the TW game isn't set in the bubble-gum-verse. Leaves it open for an AoS expansion. Derp.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Historians would call this conflict.....


...

..

Terran Conflict.

commander dante wrote:
Dam if only Total War: Warhammer had end times characters...
Who wouldnt want to see nagash and an army of spooky scary skeletons fight chaos?

Me. age of fetching mar! Ruined my favourite setting and my favourite god with a terrible backstory. At least with this game I can play those battles I wanted before the fall.

You can't look at this from the perspective of people who have known the old warhammer and say 'why advertise something that no longer exists'. If a kid, who has never seen warhammer before, plays this video game, loves the armies etc, he can still buy the models (it is still called AOS Warhammer), paint them, download free rules and play warhammer with them. To him it will seem perfectly normal, as he is not invested in some existing system, what is there to miss? The simple rules will make it even easier for him to get started. I don't think 'why advertise boost the ip of a dead product' argument is really that big of a deal.

Personally I am glad this is set in oldhammer, if it is done well, it will provide a decent fix.

 marlowc wrote:

 AUGmaniac wrote:
I think, personally, that GW will release Warhammer 9th a few weeks after TWW is released. That is so that the people who played the game CAN go and pick up warhams Fantasy models from a store with a brand new ruleset.
At least, that is what I would do.

I was thinking more on the lines of a series of scenario/narrative/campaign type books. The very first army books back in the 90's often had really well fleshed out scenarios in them - the battle of East Gate in the Dwarf book for example.
I reckon that could be a great success.

I still maintain the suspicion that GW is trying to pull a new coke... And I never even played WFB, it would make sense to bring out 9th ed with TWW... I expect a more 40k style though. Age of Sigmar reminds me of those "how to play" rosters you get in starter boxes where they list the too hit and to wound of everything in the box. Having watched and played a game or too AoS seems...temporary, a feeder/gateway game. It teaches you the general rules and principles of a wargame, but has no staying power. I anticipate 9th, do not be surprised if its a "war of the ring" style.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Powser wrote:
You can't look at this from the perspective of people who have known the old warhammer and say 'why advertise something that no longer exists'. If a kid, who has never seen warhammer before, plays this video game, loves the armies etc, he can still buy the models (it is still called AOS Warhammer), paint them, download free rules and play warhammer with them. To him it will seem perfectly normal, as he is not invested in some existing system, what is there to miss? The simple rules will make it even easier for him to get started. I don't think 'why advertise boost the ip of a dead product' argument is really that big of a deal.

Personally I am glad this is set in oldhammer, if it is done well, it will provide a decent fix.

Exactly, the buy in is actually affordable for kids (having just got back into 40k after a year off having to pay almost £100 Just for the equipment to play...too dam much.)

Anyone expecting 9th edition due to Total Warhammer will be disappointed. In fact anyone expecting GW to pay the slightest notice to the videogame market will be equally disappointed. GW has historically not given a damn about videogames and honestly not much has changed except their tactics, though they still come from the same plane of obliviousness. It used to be that GW would clutch onto their licenses, only dishing them out when a concept was as far from the tabletop as could be possible with still being recognisable, not caring about the particular studio (for each Relic we've had a Cyanide and Black Hole Entertainment.) These days they appear to be thinking "hey those videogames are popular" and licensing out the 40k universe to 40,000 studios at once.

Yeah, it would be cool if GW used a game like Total Warhammer to help boost tabletop sales, but they've never done this. If they were going to we'd have seen BloodBowl back on the shelves.

Also, as others have noted, games take a long time to produce and Total Warhammer has been in pre-production/development for at least three years. There's nobody at GW working with Creative Assembly feeding them information about Warhammer's current state.

Still, game looks absolutely awesome. I'm a huge fan of the Total War series and this'll be a day one purchase for me, regardless of the usual TW release issues.