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My question is regarding the use of salvo weapons in overwatch.

Does the movement in their previous movement phase affect which number to use? Or is just any movement in the opponent's turn?

BRB p.45 "overwatch is resolved like a normal shooting attack" Normal shooting attacks use their own movement phase.

BRB p.17 "Movement phase. Here, you move any of your units that are capable of doing so."

BRB p17 "Whenever a rule refers to 'a turn' it always means 'player turn' unless it specifically refers to a 'game turn'." Although 'turn' does not show up, no length of time is otherwise listed for how long a unit/model remains as "moved".

BRB p.43 Diagram on p43 uses the term "Stationary" for both salvo and heavy weapons. Again on p.201 Top left hand table lists "Effect of moving".
BRB p.41 But under the description for Heavy Weapons:"If a model carrying a Heavy weapon moved in the preceding movement phase, he can fire it in the shooting phase but only as snap shots."
BRB p.42 In contrast to salvo weapons: "A model armed with a salvo weapon can move and fire at a target up to half its maximum range away. In this case, the number of shots is equal to the first number."
I bring these up because I'm not sure if they suppose to be used the same way or not. But if they are would the "preceding movement phase" be any movement phase or theirs?

BRB p57 Under Fall Back "Units make a fall back move immediately upon failing a morale check - the only moves they can make in subsequent phases are fall back moves until they regroup."..."instead of moving normally"

I bring up the fall back rule because it mentions every movement phase but only the movement phases in which the unit can move normally, I assume. Although the normal movement of a unit in the opponent's turn is 0.

So resolving the overwatch as a normal shooting attack would you use your own previous movement phase at all or just movement in the phase in which the overwatch takes place in?

I would argue that the overwatch is still happening after that units preceding movement phase **they moved so they still are not quite setup to use their weapon to full strength**

Would be interested in others thoughts.

Well unless a Salvo operator is either expected to be Relentless, Slow and Purposeful, or immobile the whole game, I expect the "move and fire" to be a turn's actions, as in player turn.

But that's just my interpretation of it.

with a lack of qualifying what the preceding movement phase is, with any other words, it has to be the enemy movement phase which just happened before psychic/shooting/now its assault by the rules as written.

The way I think it's supposed to go is using the full salvo. My reasoning: Heavy weapons don't suffer any extra penalties for being fired in over watch. Only a single snap shot penalty. Since that was applied by the over watch, that means if it had moved in a previous phase logically there would be more penalties (Such as can't shoot) applied.

My own counter is that: Since Heavy weapons fire snap shots, it means everything is counted as moving. Thus salvo would be under the lesser profile.

My counter to my counter: If you have a rule that lets you fire overwatch at full BS (Such as one of the warlord traits Ad Mech can get) then even heavy weapons fire full BS. That must mean they count as not moving, which means Salvo would as well.

My counter to all of these: I'm going way too complicated and assuming GW actually knows what they're doing and should just be more specific when writing rules.

If a Salvo firer is being assaulted, I would think he would fire his full number of shots unless he moved during his opponent's movement phase. (Possible, but unlikely.)

EDIT - Aplogies; misread the rules quoted in OP and have checked Salvo's wording now.

Salvo's wording isn't phrased well as, by a strict RAW reading, if the model moves at all it is then restricted to firing a lesser number of shots at half range, period.

Sensibly it should parallel the rules for Heavy weapons, referring only to the preceding Movement phase (whether the firing unit's or its opponent's).

 Mr. Shine wrote:
EDIT - Aplogies; misread the rules quoted in OP and have checked Salvo's wording now.

Salvo's wording isn't phrased well as, by a strict RAW reading, if the model moves at all it is then restricted to firing a lesser number of shots at half range, period.

That is not at all true unless you ignore context.

 DeathReaper wrote:
That is not at all true unless you ignore context.

If by "ignore context" you actually mean "decline to make sensible assumptions" then sure. It's worth saying though, considering how far down the rabbit hole RAW arguments can end up.

 Mr. Shine wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
That is not at all true unless you ignore context.

If by "ignore context" you actually mean "decline to make sensible assumptions" then sure. It's worth saying though, considering how far down the rabbit hole RAW arguments can end up.

No I mean the context of the rules.

Okay, sure.

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Mr. Shine wrote:
EDIT - Aplogies; misread the rules quoted in OP and have checked Salvo's wording now.

Salvo's wording isn't phrased well as, by a strict RAW reading, if the model moves at all it is then restricted to firing a lesser number of shots at half range, period.

That is not at all true unless you ignore context.

What context is being ignored?

Salvo weapons are essentially more destructive Rapid Fire weapons.

Salvo weapons have two numbers on their profile (listed after their type) separated by a ‘/’. A model armed with a Salvo weapon can move and fire at a target up to half its maximum range away. In this case, the number of shots is equal to the first number. If the model has not moved, it can instead fire a greater number of shots at a target up to the weapon’s maximum range. In this case, the number of shots is equal to the second number.

Models that shoot with Salvo weapons in the Shooting phase cannot charge in the ensuing Assault phase.

That's the entire rule with the sentences that mention movement bolded.

So, either one of three interpretations are possible:
1) If a model tries to move at the same time they fire (i.e. "move and fire"), they use the first number, and if they do not move at the same time, they use the second number. This does ignore the context of the rest of the rulebook like the Phase and Running, but not necessarily its own rules.
2) If a model move at all after deployment, they are restricted to the first number because of the moving restriction, and only by staying immobile the entire game may use the second number. This does not ignore the context of the rest of the rulebook, or its own rules. However, it is very stupid.
3) The movement referred to is during the Movement Phase when normal, non-Running, movement occurs. This does not ignore the context of the rest of the rulebook where turns are generally considered separate actions like being able to fire the same weapon a turn later. This does somewhat ignore its own rules, but only if one does not recognize that movement and shooting are usually performed at separate times. This is also not a stupid interpretation.

Doesn't Overwatch involve Snapfiring? Which supercedes movement qualifiers and BS. There is no aiming involved as the firer is snapping off quick shots at the charging enemy. That would mean the lesser salvo shots value and 'hit on 6'

Sorry, no BRB on hand for quotes.

WaughGoff wrote:
Doesn't Overwatch involve Snapfiring? Which supercedes movement qualifiers and BS. There is no aiming involved as the firer is snapping off quick shots at the charging enemy. That would mean the lesser salvo shots value and 'hit on 6'

Sorry, no BRB on hand for quotes.

Snap Firing does not affect a Salvo's shots, only movement does.

Then they would shoot the same number of shots that they did the last time that they fired. If they are firing overwatch, then it is currently their opponents assault phase and they haven't moved since the last time they shot

WaughGoff wrote:
Then they would shoot the same number of shots that they did the last time that they fired. If they are firing overwatch, then it is currently their opponents assault phase and they haven't moved since the last time they shot

It depends on how you interpret "A model armed with a Salvo weapon can move and fire at a target up to half its maximum range away." The restriction to whatever they used in the Shooting Phase would only actually occur if you interpret the "move and fire" to mean anything beyond the turn the movement occurs in, then ANY movement* in the game will set the weapon's rate of fire to the first value and shootable range to half.

The game carries no actual standard as to what "move and fire" means, as general rules do not allow for movement and shooting to happen in the same Phase (though some datasheet rules do allow for it, like Deathmarks, some Eldar, etc). I have seen most people interpret "move and fire" as being restricted to the relationship between a single turn's movement and shooting phases.

The way the rules are worded, the salvo overwatch would be at the stationary value. They didn't move this turn (unless their opponent used an ability that makes them move during THEIR movement phase).