[750] - Chaos - Knight and prince

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**mrhappyface**

How effective do you think this list would be?

Chaos Knight -
-nurgle
-420pts

Daemon Prince -
-nurgle
-wings
-warp forge armour
-exalted reward
-greater reward
-270pts

(Extra 60pts, if you could give me a suggestion of what to do with it I would be grateful)

The tactic is simple:
-Prince flies around being hard to hit and has a 3+ cover save
-Prince casts Grimoire of true names onto the knight
-With the knights 4+ ion shield he gets a wopping 2+ invulnerable save
-Knights stomps forward killing all in his path
-He takes a wound/wounds? No worries! It will not die
-Four attacks strength D will wreck any ground units
-Prince can vector strike any flyers

Anything that I have overseen in this list?
What can I do with the 60pts?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Please guys, I would really appreciate the opinion of a more experienced player. I am not even sure if I have got all these rules right.

**skycapt44**

Pretty mean list at only 750 points. Your prince has a 2+ cover save because he is shrouded and can jink being nurgle. 60 pts for a nurgling unit to sit on home base objectives as you will need that. Cut a few points (greater reward) to play a bound list CAD by getting two nurgling units. To be fair it's a rather cheesy list at 750pts. Don't expect to make friends or have anyone really agree to play it unless you have some sort group that is all about this sort of thing.

**mrhappyface**

This is more of a tournament list than anything else, and I'm not going there to make friends.

Unfortunetly losing the greater reward only gives me 80pts spare and two nurgling swarms would cost 90pts.

Any other options?

**Tactical_Spam**

I would probably hurt you for running this

Edit: Solid list BTW

**Filch**

Does grimoire reallg improve the ion shield to a 2++ because i do believe the daemon rule gives it a 5++ all aroubd and grimoire improves it.

**Captyn_Bob**

Weirdly , from the wording of the grimoire it does look like that works (however unintentional). Swings both ways tho, 1/3 of the time your invun will be reduced.

Also- first time I've noticed that the grimoire can be used aggressively to reduce opponents daemon saves.

**Dabigguy**

Really like this list I have a 750pt tournement coming up but finding it hard to work you list as a chaos knight plus mark of nurgly goodness makes 450

Add in the prince that takes us to 720 leaving 30pts what would you add to make it 750?

**Captyn_Bob**

35 pts gets you fighter ace. You don't really need dirge casters in this ..

**skycapt44**

FYI a Nurgle Chaos knight is minimum 445 pts so you only have 35pts to spare. Is this tournament allowing unbound lists?

**mrhappyface**

I do have the option of losing the warpforge armour and gaining a level 2 mastery psycher. Then cross my fingers and hope I can get invisibilty on telethapy: A chaos knight that can only be hit with 6's, a 2+ invulnerable save and it will not die.

Pulling out all the cheese for this list

**Captyn_Bob**

Or just use belakor. Invis is more reliable than the grimoire, and works better against D weapons.

**mrhappyface**

I did the adding up wrong when I posted this initially, the night costs 445pts and the daemon prince would cost 270 pts.

Be'lakor wouldn't fit.

**Filch**

I will fight you with my 2 IK Wardens at 750.

If you get invisibility and or grimoire then you win but If I can shoot down the DP with 24 S6 Ap3 Rending shots then procede to charge both of my Wardens at your single Knight then there is guaranteed to be apocalyptic explosion from your knight and Mine dying. There is always a possibility you get lucky and knock out my 2 Wardens with your 1 IK.

**mrhappyface**

So either I get all my buffs and beat you, or I don't and we all explode?

**Filch**

Your in combat invul save is very good and could possibly save against my str D chainsword. Also you get the foe reaper.

Or I could just plink away at you with low percentage of rending.

It will be fun i think. compared to me spamming lascannons. in an unbound list.

at 750 i can use 10 unbound obliterators and give some MoT or MoN based on wether you use thermal or rapid battle cannon.

**mrhappyface**

I would have gone with mark of Tzeentch, 'cause either way I'm wounding on two's so toughness 5 ain't gonna help you.

**Filch**

t4 means instant death to my 2 wound oblitz when h shoot s9 or s8. So i might just stick with MoN even if its counter intuitive.

Also, I am sure eldar players can laugh at our av12 side armor titans even shooting down our flying dp bc of their scat bikes. hell they can even bring 1 Wraith Knight to beat both my IK Wardens.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

mrhappyface wrote:
So either I get all my buffs and beat you, or I don't and we all explode?

pretty much, if my warden beats yours, it will explode and maybe take the last remaining hp off mine.

**Filch**

so Did yoh win witb your invisible Chaos Knight Cheese?

**TheFivth**

a unit or two of deep striking anti-tank will bring down the knight, pretty easily, and you've broken your list into two clear categories. One thing to pile on Anti-Armor against and another for just weight of fire. Also keep in mind that at 750, anyone who brings more then 20 models is gonna give you a tough game simply by spreading out and playing to points.

**mrhappyface**

Played a game against an ig army
-3 leman russ vanquishers
-vendetta gunship
-tactical squad in drop pod

His tac squad dropped in and all 5 meltered my daemon prince and reduced him to one wound. His russes reduced my knight by one wound.
My prince assaulted his tac squad and rekt them -2VP.
My knight instakilled a russ with his strength 9 melta shot and assaulted another one -2VP
His vendetta came on and killed my lord, I killed his last russ.
We couldn't hurt each other after that.

I won 5 - 2.

That iwnd on the knight is massively OP.

**Filch**

LOLz!

I think he should have focused the drop pod melta marines on the knight Would have made a huge difference.

**mrhappyface**

Also I made the massive mistake of not putting my lord in cover so no 2+ cover save.

Maybe he should have focused on the knight but once the prince gets in the air he is invulnerable.

I did the math, if I do manage to get both invisibility and grimoire (which is a 1/6 chance) wounding my knight would be very hard.
1/6 chance to hit (for front armour let's say) 1/2 chance to wound and 1/6 chance to not be neglected by my 2+ invul. Oh also 1/3 chance to regen hullpoints.
Chance to do 1 hullpoint worth of damage is 1/216.

**Filch**

First off congrats and showing everyone and thefivth that your list can win.

If your DP gets in the air so what? His Vendetta can shoot it down. If you had the nurgle shrouded jink save then it will be hard to kill.

Even then. If he had successfully destroyed your knight he only has to worry about the DP. He underestimated both and had to deal with both. The killing power of the DP is now where near the killing power of the Knight. So he would just worry about getting charged by a DP. Where as the knight shoots, HoW, Charges, and stomps.

Again, Congratulations and keep stomping faces with this list.

Are you feeling proud? How about you up the ante and take on a harder list.

How about you fight a Eldar player packing 1 Wraith Knight with Ghost Glaive and Scat Bikes and a Pyscher to counter yours.

The thermal cannon will just take a wound off the WK as it proceeds to strike at i5 with 4 or 5 Str D attacks in melee. Also the scat bikers can still glance your Knight but most likely will focus on the DP.

Thats just roughly 500pts. Put in Farseer and warlocks on bikes and he will shut down your DP psychic.
I wish I had the models and played Eldar.

**mrhappyface**

I wouldn't mind fighting a wraithknight, should be interesting. He may strike first and do 5 str D attacks but that averages out at around 24 wounds, if I save 5/6 of those (which is statistically likely) I will still be alive. Then my 3 attacks +1 to D table averaging at 15 wounds, he would need to get over 50% of the saves which is unlikely with a 5++.
Then again if I don't get Grimoire I'm screwed.

Might be fun.

**Filch**

He has a 4++ from the sun shield and he cause blind. If it goes off, your ws is 1 and becomes so much harder to hit.

Also, Str D could mean 6+D6 HP gone if he gets 6s. If he gets 2s-5s its weaker but still d3 hp removed. you are not goinv t ok save 5/6 of them with your 5++. You might save 5/6 if you get that invis and grimoire off. Also The grimoire only improves your DAEMON save not the Ion Shield. So at most you get a daemon 3++ in combat which is still good.

Also, He will have so mucb more WC dice to deny you. I dont know the math but the potential is there.

Again, Congratulations and have fun. Not everyone has WK and scat bikes.

**mrhappyface**

Grimoire improves invulnerable save by 2+ whether that be from daemon or from ion shielding.
I did not know a wraithknight could take mastery levels.
What is a sun shield? Where can I look up the rules?

**skycapt44**

I think he means scattershield and that is a 5++ I believe. Plus FNP for be a GMC. But if they are taking the scattershield they aren't shooting the D cannons.Your list should do OK against Eldar but a lucky 6 from a shooting D WraithCannon will kill your knight and ignore any save you may have. It will likely get 4-6 shots before you make it into combat. By no means an easy match up.

**Filch**

Right scatter shield, can cause blind. Ghost Glaive and a Scatter shield will dominate the Chaos Knight at i5. The wraith cannon are not worth it for 2 Str D when you want a cheap GMC charging in with 5 Str D attacks and stomping. Cant stomp SHV but can stomp mc and smaller like dp.

Warlocks and Farseer are the psychers not the WK.

If if grimoire does improve ion shield, it wont help in close combat.

I once play my 5 IK list vs 2 WK and they killed my IK dead by bottom of turn 3. I nearly flipped the table and broke stuff.

**skycapt44**

If there was a Wraith knight with said set up i would place my knight in terrain and move away best I could so you would strike last and keep my prince far away. But I get your point. The wraith knight has no shooting but a chaos knight can at least shoot their battle cannons and force your scat bikes to jink. It would be a solid match up.

**Filch**

I told some guy that his wraith knight should hit last because it has no assault grenades and is charging my units in cover. He counters that GMC moves thru cover so he strikes i5. It was a "Casual" game and so no judge around and so we rolled off and he won and he murdered my list.