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So, first UM list. I've taken a look at their Legion Tactic, and the idea of marking units seems like a pretty cool idea. I'm also a huge fan of Roman shieldwalls, so I naturally gravitated to Breachers. The supporting fire idea could also be really effective with the Destroyer's rad-missiles, weakening an enemy hugely. Their ability to move around and prioritise targets for the Tacticals or Suzerains to mop up could be huge, as well as the Recon Squad's snipers.

So, without further ado, here's my 3k Ultramarines Legion list:

ROW: None

HQ:
Praetor in Cataphractii Armour, equipped with chainfist, combi-melta and frag assault launchers - 167
(Retinue) Invictarus Suzerain Squad with Land Raider Phobos, with armoured ceramite - 470
Centurion (Legion Champion) with artificer armour, refractor field, and Legatine Axe - 125
Centurion (Moritat) with artificer armour, refractor field, jump pack, plasma pistol and volkite serpenta - 155

Troops:
Legion Tactical Squad, 19 man, Legion Vexilla, 19x CCW - 288
Legion Breacher Squad, 2x Graviton Guns, Legion Vexilla - 270
Legion Breacher Squad, 2x Graviton Guns, Legion Vexilla - 270
Legion Reconnaissance Squad with 5x sniper rifles and cameoline - 175

Elites:
Apothecarion Detachment (3x Apothecaries in artificer armour, attached to Breacher and Tactical squads)
Cataphractii Terminator Squad with 4x power fists and reaper autocannon - 210
Legion Destroyer Squad with jump packs, missile launcher w. rad-missiles and phosphex bomb - 260

Heavy Support:
Legion Vindicator with Laser Destroyer Array - 130
Land Raider Proteus (for Tactical Squad) - 200
Whirlwind Scorpius - 115

Total:3000 points

Plan would be to have the Terminators, Recon Squad, Heavy Support and Scorpius backfield, marking targets. The Terminators can move up to take positions when I move up.
Breacher Squads move up and sweep, Land Raiders support.
Tacticals in Proteus can use Fury of the Legion, and the Breachers can screen for the charge, allowing for the next turn charge from the Tacticals.
A similar tactic can be employed by the Praetor's unit, with the Champion attached. Champion takes challenges against most enemies (paragon blade or higher), Praetor takes enemies that could be more fatal to him. Praetor also supplies anti-tank for the unit. Suzerains could cut through most, and Breachers can take the initial charge to lessen Suzerain casualties.
Destroyers mark priority targets, very good with the rad-missiles.

I'd go with grav guns for the Breachers, and go for larger units for them as well as you can load up more grav guns and protect them better.

How are you moving the terminators around? On foot? Bit slow and easy to avoid a small unit if so.

You need more anti heavy armour in this list, and a flyer, I'd suggest a Xiphon to address both as a starting point. I'm not a fan of small missile squads, rapiers or las vindicators would be my choice.

 Looky Likey wrote:
I'd go with grav guns for the Breachers, and go for larger units for them as well as you can load up more grav guns and protect them better.

Grav guns added, but I'm not sure about the larger squads. I could merge the squads to one big 20 man squad, but having two units allows for two different targets and flanks.

How are you moving the terminators around? On foot? Bit slow and easy to avoid a small unit if so.

I was planning on having them hold backfield objectives, so mobility wouldn't be a huge issue.

You need more anti heavy armour in this list, and a flyer, I'd suggest a Xiphon to address both as a starting point.

Why a flyer? I have added the Vindicator with laser destroyer array though.

I'm not a fan of small missile squads, rapiers or las vindicators would be my choice.

Done.

There is usually a significant points saving for a single large unit vs. two smaller units in 30k, the larger breacher squad is 125 points cheaper if my math is right.

I dunno if its the games I've played over the last couple of years but I see so much heavy armour that I never seem to be able to split fire and have to concentrate everything on the one target at a time so having more, smaller, units doesn't give me more value than the points premium they cost.

Its also been rare that I don't see a flyer on the other of the side, and when I don't the extra mobility and difficulty in bringing it down if they lack anti air means the flyer usually has cart blanche to operate. The Xiphon and the Primus Lightning are some of the best anti heavy tank this side of a super heavy for their points.

Add something fast, outriders maybe? Or Skyhunters? For getting rid of enemy artillery.

Looky Likey wrote:There is usually a significant points saving for a single large unit vs. two smaller units in 30k, the larger breacher squad is 125 points cheaper if my math is right.

I dunno if its the games I've played over the last couple of years but I see so much heavy armour that I never seem to be able to split fire and have to concentrate everything on the one target at a time so having more, smaller, units doesn't give me more value than the points premium they cost.

Yes, but 20 Breachers all in one unit is fairly slow moving, and can only fire at one target. Unless I play defensively, but 20 men leaves a big footprint. I do see the points saving though. I can always merge the two units if it doesn't work out.

Its also been rare that I don't see a flyer on the other of the side, and when I don't the extra mobility and difficulty in bringing it down if they lack anti air means the flyer usually has cart blanche to operate. The Xiphon and the Primus Lightning are some of the best anti heavy tank this side of a super heavy for their points.

How about a Storm Eagle? I could use it to transport a unit (Tacticals perhaps) and still get mobility and firepower? Plus I'm not overly keen on the Xiphon's aesthetic.

EmberlordofFire8 wrote:Add something fast, outriders maybe? Or Skyhunters? For getting rid of enemy artillery.

What would I drop then? Destroyers are fairly fast moving in their own right, and can escort the Moritat. And if I add this flyer in, I can get the anti-tank I need. The Scorpius is capable of taking out the lighter artillery if needs be.

A Storm Eagle can't match the anti tank output of a Xiphon, but its a good transport.