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Hi all.

So I'm thinking about coming back to the hobby after a few years off and start an army I've been looking at for over 10 years, the Imperial Fists, and as such, I think now is a good time for that.
I have watched a few battle reports on Youtube to find the style that suits me and have found a drop pod list to be what I'm looking for. After I started to build and experiment, I came up with this one which I'm thinking about running.
The thing is, I think this list just can't be beat. That being said, I have not played since 5'th edition so my understanding for the game and the rules might be off.

Anyway, the list is based of what I consider an Imperial fist Alpha Strike.

Pedro Kantor 185.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

Dreadnought: Autocannon, Heavy Flamer 130.p OR 6x Sternguards. 132.p

Skyhammer Formation

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamer, Power Weapon, Veteran Sergeant 120.p

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamer, Power Weapon, Veteran Sergeant 120.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

5x Drop pods 175.p

1498.p / 1500.p

So. First turn, drop in the whole army, barring the Dreadnought or the small unit of Sternguards. The dreadnought give me a hard and flexible target but the Sternguards give me another Objective Secured unit aswell as the 1'st company strike force formation.
Which one should I go for?

The first turn, the big Sternguard units will hunt heavy/medium infantry, with rerolling 1's they can use the Vengeance Round with relative saftey. That coupled with some Grav Weapons and a Heavy flamer will hopefully put a dent on most heavy/medium infantry.
The Assault marines will go after Light infantry and play an harassing role, and the Devestators will combat squad into 2 groups of 3x Normal Marines, 2x Multi Melta Marines. This will most likely kill all the enemy vehicles turn 1 since 8 tank hunting multi melta at short range will do that.

Lastley, Pedro Kantor will give me some units with objective secure and extra attacks, should the enemy make it to close combat after the first salvo.

So what do you guys think?

Good list, but not unbeatable. Tyranids, Daemon, and even Ork lists will give you trouble. Eldar especially will be troublesome, wraithguard can D your sternguard and devestators clean off the table in one turn with their flamer templates which you so thoughtfully dropped in range. Daemons and Eldar will also have a killer pskyer phase and you don't have anything to counter. You also don't have any counter to flying units who'll be able to pick your units off with almost total impunity.

Like I said, it's good, but don't get cocky kid.

E: Also, go with the extra sternguard over the dread. Putting exactly one vehicle on the table like that you might as well put up a neon "feth me" sign on top of him.

I see you've never played against tau. That will be an interesting experience for you.

Yeah, this isn't a overly OP list. Sternguard are kinda expensive, you have no real way of getting many objectives, and Tau, Eldar and even other SM lists will have a field day against you. MM on Devs are a strange choice, and Dreads aren't good anymore.

That seems like a very random order BUT I think I got everything.

slip wrote:
Good list, but not unbeatable. Tyranids, Daemon, and even Ork lists will give you trouble. Eldar especially will be troublesome, wraithguard can D your sternguard and devestators clean off the table in one turn with their flamer templates which you so thoughtfully dropped in range. Daemons and Eldar will also have a killer pskyer phase and you don't have anything to counter. You also don't have any counter to flying units who'll be able to pick your units off with almost total impunity.

Like I said, it's good, but don't get cocky kid.

E: Also, go with the extra sternguard over the dread. Putting exactly one vehicle on the table like that you might as well put up a neon "feth me" sign on top of him.

Thanks for the input. Yeah I have ponderd the Wraithguard with D-scythes conundrum since I actually contemplated playing Eldar before the Fists. The thing is a unit of Wraithguard will be a high priority target and a unit of Sternguard will kill about 7-8 of them if my flamer cover 5, and I have two of them. As for the Nids, This unit will kill a big Nid in one turn, so in essence, 2 big monsters will die the first turn from the Sternguard. Then comes 8 Multimelta shots that will do some damage. I have not played against Orks or Deamons ever so I woud be glad if you could explain the troublesome units in those armies. Flyers and the psycic phase worries and if anyone have some suggestion on that please let me know. For bigger games, I will add a librarian and a Stormtalon or two.
Also, I might be wrong about everything since I have no idea how the game has changed since 5'th edition.
Edit: Maybe change the small Sternguard unit for a Stormtalon to get some anti air and keep one empty drop pod, or get one of them weapon drop pods from forgeworld. What do you think?

I see you've never played against tau. That will be an interesting experience for you.

Actually, I played Tau back in 3-5th edition. I have no Idea what the bring nowdays though. Again, I might be wrong and I most likely am, but the theory against the Tau is focus on high priority targets during the alpha strike. The sternguards can kill a riptide or a stormsurge the first turn if my calculus are correct. Same with both the Devestator squads working together. The Assault Marines can charge 2 units of battle suits the first turn, so now. The opponent is minus 2-3 big suits or vehicles and have 2 units in close combat.

Please shoot holes in my arguments since then, I might get a better comprehension for 7'th edition and its meta.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 WarbossDakka wrote:
Yeah, this isn't a overly OP list. Sternguard are kinda expensive, you have no real way of getting many objectives, and Tau, Eldar and even other SM lists will have a field day against you. MM on Devs are a strange choice, and Dreads aren't good anymore.

That seems like a very random order BUT I think I got everything.

The MM's on the Devs is because they save points to make me able to get two full 10 man squads instead of 5 man squads. The advantage to this, I think, is to be able to combat squad them into smaller groups and focus on 4 vehicles, and if vehicles are nowhere to be found, strip of wounds or kill the last remaining high priority targets from the Sternguard's prey during the first turn.They offer a great deal of flexibility for the list. The Sternguard can kill the Monsterus Creatures or heavily armored infantry, and as such, the Devs play a supporting role or guarantee vehicle kills.

Kokaka wrote:

slip wrote:
Good list, but not unbeatable. Tyranids, Daemon, and even Ork lists will give you trouble. Eldar especially will be troublesome, wraithguard can D your sternguard and devestators clean off the table in one turn with their flamer templates which you so thoughtfully dropped in range. Daemons and Eldar will also have a killer pskyer phase and you don't have anything to counter. You also don't have any counter to flying units who'll be able to pick your units off with almost total impunity.

Like I said, it's good, but don't get cocky kid.

E: Also, go with the extra sternguard over the dread. Putting exactly one vehicle on the table like that you might as well put up a neon "feth me" sign on top of him.

Thanks for the input. Yeah I have ponderd the Wraithguard with D-scythes conundrum since I actually contemplated playing Eldar before the Fists. The thing is a unit of Wraithguard will be a high priority target and a unit of Sternguard will kill about 7-8 of them if my flamer cover 5, and I have two of them. As for the Nids, This unit will kill a big Nid in one turn, so in essence, 2 big monsters will die the first turn from the Sternguard. Then comes 8 Multimelta shots that will do some damage. I have not played against Orks or Deamons ever so I woud be glad if you could explain the troublesome units in those armies. Flyers and the psycic phase worries and if anyone have some suggestion on that please let me know. For bigger games, I will add a librarian and a Stormtalon or two.
Also, I might be wrong about everything since I have no idea how the game has changed since 5'th edition.

The wraithguard will be in a wave serpant which will have a 3+or 4+ cover save. You'll have to pop that first. That's on top of the warp spiders who will wipe out whole units and then flicker out of range when you try and engage. The big Nid monsters will be flyers, so you'll need 6's to hit and they'll also have a 3+ or 4+ cover. (It's called jinking) Against orks, your expensive grav guns and meltas are going to be wasted killing 8 point orks or 30 point trukks, and a handful of flamers won't save you after you drop pod in the middle of an entire horde. psykers should scare the crap out of you, telepathy gives invisibility, so you'd need 6's even to hit that unit or shrouding which is a +2 save buff. Daemons also can fly, get massive invuls, and will summon more daemons in the psyker phase with no resistance. You have a lot of melta, but it's probably not enough to take out even one IK who in turn will drop an apocalyptic ap1 template on you in return.

Also, mass drop podding like that will cluster all your units together, leaving you very susceptible to template weapons, and you won't be able to charge so you'll be wide open to CC heavy armies. (Your army is mediocre in CC, even with the assault marines.)

You're on the right track with the stormtalon and librarian tho, but there'll never be a way to make a perfect list. You only have so many points, there'll be a weakness somewhere. Focus on what you feel is a good balance of competitive and fun and you'll never be disappointed.

e: I will say this list will make short work of most SM (cept space wolves), CSM, Necron, and AM armies.

slip wrote:

Kokaka wrote:

slip wrote:
Good list, but not unbeatable. Tyranids, Daemon, and even Ork lists will give you trouble. Eldar especially will be troublesome, wraithguard can D your sternguard and devestators clean off the table in one turn with their flamer templates which you so thoughtfully dropped in range. Daemons and Eldar will also have a killer pskyer phase and you don't have anything to counter. You also don't have any counter to flying units who'll be able to pick your units off with almost total impunity.

Like I said, it's good, but don't get cocky kid.

E: Also, go with the extra sternguard over the dread. Putting exactly one vehicle on the table like that you might as well put up a neon "feth me" sign on top of him.

Thanks for the input. Yeah I have ponderd the Wraithguard with D-scythes conundrum since I actually contemplated playing Eldar before the Fists. The thing is a unit of Wraithguard will be a high priority target and a unit of Sternguard will kill about 7-8 of them if my flamer cover 5, and I have two of them. As for the Nids, This unit will kill a big Nid in one turn, so in essence, 2 big monsters will die the first turn from the Sternguard. Then comes 8 Multimelta shots that will do some damage. I have not played against Orks or Deamons ever so I woud be glad if you could explain the troublesome units in those armies. Flyers and the psycic phase worries and if anyone have some suggestion on that please let me know. For bigger games, I will add a librarian and a Stormtalon or two.
Also, I might be wrong about everything since I have no idea how the game has changed since 5'th edition.

The wraithguard will be in a wave serpant which will have a 3+or 4+ cover save. You'll have to pop that first. That's on top of the warp spiders who will wipe out whole units and then flicker out of range when you try and engage. The big Nid monsters will be flyers, so you'll need 6's to hit and they'll also have a 3+ or 4+ cover. (It's called jinking) Against orks, your expensive grav guns and meltas are going to be wasted killing 8 point orks or 30 point trukks, and a handful of flamers won't save you after you drop pod in the middle of an entire horde. psykers should scare the crap out of you, telepathy gives invisibility, so you'd need 6's even to hit that unit or shrouding which is a +2 save buff. Daemons also can fly, get massive invuls, and will summon more daemons in the psyker phase with no resistance. You have a lot of melta, but it's probably not enough to take out even one IK who in turn will drop an apocalyptic ap1 template on you in return.

Also, mass drop podding like that will cluster all your units together, leaving you very susceptible to template weapons, and you won't be able to charge so you'll be wide open to CC heavy armies. (Your army is mediocre in CC, even with the assault marines.)

You're on the right track with the stormtalon and librarian tho, but there'll never be a way to make a perfect list. You only have so many points, there'll be a weakness somewhere. Focus on what you feel is a good balance of competitive and fun and you'll never be disappointed.

e: I will say this list will make short work of most SM (cept space wolves), CSM, Necron, and AM armies.

Thanks, good post.

Absolutley, there are no perfect list, but that's what makes it so fun by tweaking the list and thinking about different scenarios that might happen.

That being said, It seems my weakness is Flyers > Psykers > Hordes. Would it be feasible to skip Pedro Kantor, giving up Objective Secured and +1A aura aswell as a the small unit of Sternguards to a Librarian, a Gunship and a small unit of Tacticals. Maybe thats not such a bad Idea, get one more unit on the field that way.
Then it would look something like this. Also get one more flamer for the hordes (no pun intended).

Librarian: Lvl 2, Terminator Armour, Storm Shield 125.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

5x Tactical Marines: Flamer 75.p

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamer, Power Weapon, Veteran Sergeant 120.p

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamer, Power Weapon, Veteran Sergeant 120.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

5x Drop pods 175.p

Stormtalon Gunship: Skyhammer Missile Launcher 115.p

1498.p


I also noticed that if I go bare, I can squeeze in one more Stormtalon into the list. It would look like this then.

Librarian: Lvl 2 90.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

5x Tactical Marines: Flamer 75.p

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamers 80.p

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamers 80.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

5x Drop pods 175.p

Stormtalon Gunship: Skyhammer Missile Launcher 115.p

Stormtalon Gunship: Skyhammer Missile Launcher 115.p

1498.p

My area of expertise is GK, AM, IK, and Orks, so I can't help you with exact specifics but that does look better.

I wanted to make a note though about your weaknesses. It's really Flyers > Psykers >CC> Hordes>objectives>attrition.

Besides your assault marines, you don't really have any mobility after the pods come down to claim objectives. Your first two turns will be scary, but it'll peter out after you take causalities and are footslogging it across the board to objectives, so your assault marines could end up tied up with that rather then engaging in CC.

Just be very careful where you deploy your pods so you don't take unsustainable causalities on the counter attack or box yourself in a corner and you should go the distance in any given game.

Good luck!

slip wrote:
My area of expertise is GK, AM, IK, and Orks, so I can't help you with exact specifics but that does look better.

I wanted to make a note though about your weaknesses. It's really Flyers > Psykers >CC> Hordes>objectives>attrition.

Besides your assault marines, you don't really have any mobility after the pods come down to claim objectives. Your first two turns will be scary, but it'll peter out after you take causalities and are footslogging it across the board to objectives, so your assault marines could end up tied up with that rather then engaging in CC.

Just be very careful where you deploy your pods so you don't take unsustainable causalities on the counter attack or box yourself in a corner and you should go the distance in any given game.

Good luck!

Thanks.
About the objectives, Could a Stormtalon hover to claim it and if so, would the list with 2 of them be the most optimal?

Yes, it could hover to claim objectives but then ground troops no longer need to snap shoot at it, and it can even be assaulted in CC so be careful. Jinking also forces you to zoom iirc, and you can only make one 90 deg pivot before you do, so flying off the table into ongoing reserve is a real possibility to watch out for!

Don't know if a second would be worth it, flyers are expensive after all.

slip wrote:
Yes, it could hover to claim objectives but then ground troops no longer need to snap shoot at it, and it can even be assaulted in CC so be careful. Jinking also forces you to zoom iirc, and you can only make one 90 deg pivot before you do, so flying off the table into ongoing reserve is a real possibility to watch out for!

Don't know if a second would be worth it, flyers are expensive after all.

Thanks. Good to get all the rules cleared up before I buy the miniatures.
A Stormtalon is just the same points as a Librarian in Terminator Armour, If I go that rout it would lend me 2 lvl 2 psykers, each in a unit of Sternguard.

Librarian: Lvl 2 Terminator Armour 115.p

Librarian: Lvl 2 90.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

8x Sternguards: 4x Combi Grav, 1x Combi Flamer 204.p

5x Tactical Marines: Flamer 75.p

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamers 80.p

5x Assault Maries: 2x Flamers 80.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

10x Devestators: 4x Multi Melta 180.p

5x Drop pods 175.p

Stormtalon Gunship: Skyhammer Missile Launcher 115.p

1498.p

I think the list is starting to come togehter.

First -this isn't even a good list. The weapons options are on the wrong units. Sterns should take combi meltas and devs should take grav cannons because they are relentless in skyhammer.

Second - why can you take kantor and sterngards without troop choices- the codex gives no options to take sterngard as troops as far as i am aware?

Gladius with free drop pods is way better at what this list is trying to accomplish.