Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I've seen some people say that the new FAQ means you can hit Flyers with Skyfiring Blasts and Templates, but I don't think this is the case. I just want to be clear on what the FAQs are saying. Here's what I've found:

Q: Does a template weapon aimed at a unit at ground level but also touching a Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature hit it? Does a blast marker that drifts onto a Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature hit it?
A: No, in both cases. Template and Blast weapons and other attacks that don’t roll To Hit cannot hit Flying Monstrous Creatures that are Swooping.

Q: Do Blast weapons hit Swooping Flying Monstrous Creatures?
A: No.

Q: Can a Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature or Zooming Flyer be targeted by a Blast or Template weapon with the Skyfire special rule?
A: Yes.

So, the way I read this, you CAN target these enemies with such attacks, and resolve the attack by putting down the template and appropriate blasts and scattering, etc, but that since you cannot hit them, you are just doing this in hopes of hitting something else nearby. Is that correct?

No, it seems to rewrite hard to hit, to at least be consistent, but allow blasts to hit both FMC and Flyers.

 Yarium wrote:
I've seen some people say that the new FAQ means you can hit Flyers with Skyfiring Blasts and Templates, but I don't think this is the case. I just want to be clear on what the FAQs are saying. Here's what I've found:

Q: Does a template weapon aimed at a unit at ground level but also touching a Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature hit it? Does a blast marker that drifts onto a Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature hit it?
A: No, in both cases. Template and Blast weapons and other attacks that don’t roll To Hit cannot hit Flying Monstrous Creatures that are Swooping.

Q: Do Blast weapons hit Swooping Flying Monstrous Creatures?
A: No.

Q: Can a Swooping Flying Monstrous Creature or Zooming Flyer be targeted by a Blast or Template weapon with the Skyfire special rule?
A: Yes.

So, the way I read this, you CAN target these enemies with such attacks, and resolve the attack by putting down the template and appropriate blasts and scattering, etc, but that since you cannot hit them, you are just doing this in hopes of hitting something else nearby. Is that correct?

That is the way that the FAQ seems to read to me. But the last one you quoted doesn't seem to make much sense when compared to the other two. Perhaps they will reword these for the final version to clarify matters.

Looks like the intent is that blasts won't hit fliers unless you specifically target them with a Skyfire blast, in which case they can.

 Charles Rampant wrote:
Looks like the intent is that blasts won't hit fliers unless you specifically target them with a Skyfire blast, in which case they can.

What this guy said

 Charles Rampant wrote:
Looks like the intent is that blasts won't hit fliers unless you specifically target them with a Skyfire blast, in which case they can.

My only question is if you target a flyer with a skyfire blast and it scatters to a ground unit are they hit? What if it scatters over another flyer, can it hit the other flyer then?

The first question is quite tricky, but it would seem that Skyfire probably means 'no'; the second seems like a 'yes'. But that treats the situation as Skyfire allowing you to place the blasts on the 'sky' level, where Swooping FMCs and Fliers live, as distinct from the 'ground' level where everything else lives, and that would seem both reasonable and unsupported by the rules.

I'd assume the only blasts that can hit a FMC are from a weapon using skyfire.
Going by that anyway.

However, reversing the wording I see that if it scatters onto ground based units it won't hit them.

So blasts would essentially be fired at ground or sky level, depending on the initial target model.

 Charles Rampant wrote:
The first question is quite tricky, but it would seem that Skyfire probably means 'no'; the second seems like a 'yes'. But that treats the situation as Skyfire allowing you to place the blasts on the 'sky' level, where Swooping FMCs and Fliers live, as distinct from the 'ground' level where everything else lives, and that would seem both reasonable and unsupported by the rules.

Seems reasonable and its probably how I'll play. I appreciate your quick response

So does that mean you could Phlegm Bombardment with a soulgrinder versus a flyer and then snapshoot the skyfire three shot autocannon?

Phlegm doesn't have sky fire, does it?

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Phlegm doesn't have sky fire, does it?

No, but the Blight drone has both a flame template, and a large blast, and is a flyer. It would be able to fire one or the other (same weapon, 2 profiles) at a flyer now. Which is pretty nice, considering its only other weapon is a BS2 auto cannon.

If the resultant ruling allows that then Doomscythes will be the bane of psychic flying daemon princes everywhere!

Remember the Hard to Hit rule for flyers and FMC are different, By the rule FMC can be hit by blasts and templates so long as they have skyfire, whereas flyers explicitly say cannot be hit by blasts and templates (or is it cannot be hit by shots that dont roll to hit?) that may be what the FAQ is referring to?

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Phlegm doesn't have sky fire, does it?

You are right, it does not have in innately. However, if I'm not mistaken, if you fire with a weapon with the skyfire special rule it gives that rule to any other weapon you are also firing for the SoulGrinder. I believe it would also work with the flamer or the S10 eyebeam lasers.

 flukezor wrote:
Remember the Hard to Hit rule for flyers and FMC are different, By the rule FMC can be hit by blasts and templates so long as they have skyfire, whereas flyers explicitly say cannot be hit by blasts and templates (or is it cannot be hit by shots that dont roll to hit?) that may be what the FAQ is referring to?

Per the BRB, Flyers cannot be targeted nor hit by templates/blasts where as FMCs can b as long as the shot has the Skyfire special rule. The FAQ changes this so that both are immune unless the attack has the skyfire special rule (effectively changing Flyer Hard to Hit).

 Vache Glace wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Phlegm doesn't have sky fire, does it?

You are right, it does not have in innately. However, if I'm not mistaken, if you fire with a weapon with the skyfire special rule it gives that rule to any other weapon you are also firing for the SoulGrinder. I believe it would also work with the flamer or the S10 eyebeam lasers.

The soul grinder doesn't have skyfire. The harvestor has two weapon profiles, one of which has the skyfire rule

What happens when you clip a flyer with a skyfire blast but also land over a bunch of ground units?

So my Heldrakes can now flame flyers and FMC s ?

Yes and no. It depends on whether they keep the FAQ answer - as it really should be an errata.

This is also something where the writer of the FAQ probably was reading DFtS. Since ONLY fighters have native Skyfire.

The Helldrake is an attack flyer...so it doesn't get Skyfire. Thus cannot flame flyers or FMCs. (At least if you are using DFtS which seems to be a strong intention. . .but that's a different can of worms)

The Stormfang Gunship is a fighter with a blast, units controlling a skyfire nexus could have blasts (Yay Earshaker AAA :-p), but they are uncommon for sure.

Lendys wrote:
This is also something where the writer of the FAQ probably was reading DFtS. Since ONLY fighters have native Skyfire.

The Helldrake is an attack flyer...so it doesn't get Skyfire. Thus cannot flame flyers or FMCs. (At least if you are using DFtS which seems to be a strong intention. . .but that's a different can of worms)

The Stormfang Gunship is a fighter with a blast, units controlling a skyfire nexus could have blasts (Yay Earshaker AAA :-p), but they are uncommon for sure.

Assuming you are using the DftS rules, of course.

 Charistoph wrote:

Lendys wrote:
This is also something where the writer of the FAQ probably was reading DFtS. Since ONLY fighters have native Skyfire.

The Helldrake is an attack flyer...so it doesn't get Skyfire. Thus cannot flame flyers or FMCs. (At least if you are using DFtS which seems to be a strong intention. . .but that's a different can of worms)

The Stormfang Gunship is a fighter with a blast, units controlling a skyfire nexus could have blasts (Yay Earshaker AAA :-p), but they are uncommon for sure.

Assuming you are using the DftS rules, of course.

Exactly, but as I said, I suspect the FAQ writer had access to, or was reading DftS, assuming they ever really read the books and consider them that carefully.