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I think they're comparable, but Eldar still beats out Tau. Tau are probably the best army to bring against Eldar, though (well, besides bringing your own Eldar), and assuming both players are running competitive lists it basically comes down to whoever gets first turn in that match-up.
And yeah, needless to say being able to vote for both of them kinda defeats the purpose of the poll.
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I think it's misleading to say that either army is OP; it'd be more accurate to say that both armies have highly exploitable elements, some of which are underpriced (or overpowered for the price).
Against any reasonable Tau or Eldar list you should be able to have fun playing with most armies, it's only certain things that ruin the experience if a player exploits them. I have an Eldar army, it's a wraith force so presents difficulties to some opponents, but it's also very small and expensive, and I don't have a Wraithknight (nor really want one), so it's just regular Wraith Lords to contend with, which I don't think are OP at all even with the general imbalance of the Monstrous Creature rules, as while they're more durable than vehicles in some ways, they have generally less firepower for the same points. In other words, Monstrous Creature rules are mainly broken because they scale up badly to things like Riptides and Wraithknights, for the stuff they've been historically used for they're not automatically bad.
One of my opponents has a Tau army with lots of Kroot and several units of Vespid, so that's far from an overpowered force as well
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/11 10:07:27
Vector Strike wrote: Eldar is stronger than Tau by a wide margin, but Space Marines are more powerful than both.
People don't see the 2++ rerollable deathstars, ability to move your entire army across the table for a t1 assault, cover not mattering anymore and av15 landraiders to be even somewhat strong. Since murrens are the most popular army good luck getting anyone to see that they are comparable to them now.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/11 14:53:28
Vector Strike wrote: Eldar is stronger than Tau by a wide margin, but Space Marines are more powerful than both.
People don't see the 2++ rerollable deathstars, ability to move your entire army across the table for a t1 assault, cover not mattering anymore and av15 landraiders to be even somewhat strong. Since murrens are the most popular army good luck getting anyone to see that they are comparable to them now.
You mean those deathstars that took a heavy nerf in the FAQ? Or the psychic powers that are rolled for randomly and still have to be manifested? Are you referring to the Conclave that took a serious hit from the ML ruling? Yeah. Those are definitely more powerful than the Eldar.
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Vector Strike wrote: Eldar is stronger than Tau by a wide margin, but Space Marines are more powerful than both.
People don't see the 2++ rerollable deathstars, ability to move your entire army across the table for a t1 assault, cover not mattering anymore and av15 landraiders to be even somewhat strong. Since murrens are the most popular army good luck getting anyone to see that they are comparable to them now.
You mean those deathstars that took a heavy nerf in the FAQ? Or the psychic powers that are rolled for randomly and still have to be manifested? Are you referring to the Conclave that took a serious hit from the ML ruling? Yeah. Those are definitely more powerful than the Eldar.
Seriously. Also, who has an AV 15 Land Raider? Unless we're talking about that one Psychic power, in which case you're putting a lot of points on a possible combo
Tau have a handful of broken units, Riptide, Stormsurge, Ghostkeep and the massive firepower in the Broadsides.
Eldar have.....Well lets get started: Wraith Knights, Wraith Guard, D Weapons as spammable as Rocket launchers. Warp spiders, Fire Dragons, blade storm, and the Eldar Psychic shenanigans.
At AV 15, you have pushed melta pens down to less than 50%. That's pretty good. Of course, Eldar melta only needs a single pen to have a 66% chance of making the LR useless.
Martel732 wrote: At AV 15, you have pushed melta pens down to less than 50%. That's pretty good. Of course, Eldar melta only needs a single pen to have a 66% chance of making the LR useless.
Nothing like AP0 Melta gunz. Especially when open topped. +4 to explode.
Martel732 wrote: At AV 15, you have pushed melta pens down to less than 50%. That's pretty good. Of course, Eldar melta only needs a single pen to have a 66% chance of making the LR useless.
Nothing like AP0 Melta gunz. Especially when open topped. +4 to explode.
But they still suck vs MCs. Not even Eldar can overcome that.
Tau have a handful of broken units, Riptide, Stormsurge, Ghostkeep and the massive firepower in the Broadsides.
Eldar have.....Well lets get started: Wraith Knights, Wraith Guard, D Weapons as spammable as Rocket launchers. Warp spiders, Fire Dragons, blade storm, and the Eldar Psychic shenanigans.
Eldar have 4 things. Let's stop the ridiculous exaggerations now.
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Martel732 wrote: At AV 15, you have pushed melta pens down to less than 50%. That's pretty good. Of course, Eldar melta only needs a single pen to have a 66% chance of making the LR useless.
Nothing like AP0 Melta gunz. Especially when open topped. +4 to explode.
yeah...why on earth anyone decided that Fire Dragons needed AP0, on top of potentially getting BS5, all at no cost increase of course, is beyond me. That was an airheaded change with no good reason behind it.
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Vector Strike wrote: Eldar is stronger than Tau by a wide margin, but Space Marines are more powerful than both.
People don't see the 2++ rerollable deathstars, ability to move your entire army across the table for a t1 assault, cover not mattering anymore and av15 landraiders to be even somewhat strong. Since murrens are the most popular army good luck getting anyone to see that they are comparable to them now.
You mean those deathstars that took a heavy nerf in the FAQ? Or the psychic powers that are rolled for randomly and still have to be manifested? Are you referring to the Conclave that took a serious hit from the ML ruling? Yeah. Those are definitely more powerful than the Eldar.
Comparable = definitely stronger now....what? I'm not saying spess mureenz are stronger, they are just now COMPARABLE now. Remember that mureenz are and have been used as the baseline that everyone compares to, eldar are stronger, no longer super op, but quite strong, tau are about equal if you play itc rules and on the flip side, CSM, nids, guard and orks for examples are far underpowered.
Is that because Tau are weak or because people houserule nerf them?
It's because they're weaker than sw, demons, space marines and eldar. Necrons are roughly at their power level. People always go "tau shooting is op!" But tau only have that and that alone, coupled with no warp defense, or melee, and you quickly realize that tau aren't all they're cracked up to be. They're good, but most other competetive armies have power builds that trump anything tau can put down even if the average level of tau codex trumps their book's average level.
Also I'm sick of the people going "tau op, my orks/dark eldar/chaos marines can't beat them!" Frankly that's those books being crap, not tau being too good.
Is that because Tau are weak or because people houserule nerf them?
It's because they're weaker than sw, demons, space marines and eldar. Necrons are roughly at their power level. People always go "tau shooting is op!" But tau only have that and that alone, coupled with no warp defense, or melee, and you quickly realize that tau aren't all they're cracked up to be. They're good, but most other competetive armies have power builds that trump anything tau can put down even if the average level of tau codex trumps their book's average level.
Also I'm sick of the people going "tau op, my orks/dark eldar/chaos marines can't beat them!" Frankly that's those books being crap, not tau being too good.
That applies to most books. They have one gimmick and that's it. Which doesn't make them less OP.
Also I'm sick of the people going "tau op, my orks/dark eldar/chaos marines can't beat them!" Frankly that's those books being crap, not tau being too good.
Hrm, its an issue with power bloat, I'd argue that Orks, IG, DE, and CSM's are at a power level the rest of the game should be at. Tau, like other upper tier armies, benefit from unit power levels unheard of in previous editions (ghostkeels, riptides, stormsurges, etc) and freebies from formations, both fundamental failures of game design that enhance power at the expense of balance which is largely (though not totally) absent from these older armies.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/11 20:50:00
IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.
New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights! The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.
Is that because Tau are weak or because people houserule nerf them?
It's because they're weaker than sw, demons, space marines and eldar. Necrons are roughly at their power level. People always go "tau shooting is op!" But tau only have that and that alone, coupled with no warp defense, or melee, and you quickly realize that tau aren't all they're cracked up to be. They're good, but most other competetive armies have power builds that trump anything tau can put down even if the average level of tau codex trumps their book's average level.
Also I'm sick of the people going "tau op, my orks/dark eldar/chaos marines can't beat them!" Frankly that's those books being crap, not tau being too good.
Ah, yes, Tau only have shooting, THE STRONGEST PHASE IN THE GAME. Next excuse?
or 
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