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I have a couple of mates who are interested in trying 40k. I told them I'd show them the basics and I've got plenty of minis they can use for their first few games.
My question is, what is the best way to introduce them without overwhelming them?
I want to show them as wide a range of units as possible without as for me the variety on offer is one of the biggest draws for the game. However I'm aware that throwing in to much to early May just put them off.

I know the dark vengeance scenarios are intended for this purpose, but just wondered if anyone has any novel ideas or better ways to showcase the game to a beginner.

Do you bother with FOC? Do you play units or just individual models to teach the basic mechanics? How many points do you think is appropriate? Are points appropriate? Do you focus on balance or a good narrative?

Any advice is much appreciated.

Cheers

kill teams? with pointers that the game can scale up from there.

I build two 500-750pt armies. I run whatever while I always give the newer player Eldar. I've found that Eldar actually ignore enough of the bookkeeping to keep things nice. Vehicles move 12" and shoot with two guns or stay still and shoot with everything. Simpler than 6" for one gun, the rest snap shoot, 12" all guns snap shoot, stationary all guns shoot normally. No, if you move the Falcon, the two turret guns shoot normally. Move the Serpent, all guns shoot normally. Guardian weapons are Assault 2 and you want to see 6s. Simple. Dire Avengers are better versions. Even simpler. Jetbikes show how important speed is. All of that is led by an Autarch in with the Guardians. Nice and easy list.

Now, I've only introduced people that already were interested so I'm just teaching how to play instead of trying to spark an interest.

We recently did an intro game for a dad and his son. It was kind of a mixed bag.

What worked:
- Playing with them, not against them.
- Keeping the special rules on units to a minimum.
If you have to talk about how "this is a rule, but this unit gets to ignore that rule", you're only going to make things more complicated.
- Explaining Ballistic skill as follows: "You take 7 and substract the BS of the model, that's how much you have to roll on each dice for it to hit." Do it once, and then let them do it themselves.
- Simple armies make for simple games. Cult mechanicus versus Chaos Daemons would be a nightmare to explain to beginners. "This army here has a table to choose from all these different effects each turn and this other army has to roll on all these different tables instead of choosing your gear. Did I mention they don't have shooting but instead have a giant table of random gak that happens instead?"
If you don't have easy to play armies, dumb them down (for example remove Synapse from Tyranids). Tell your friends after the game that you did leave out some rules to make it easier for them to grasp the basics.
- Bring different unit types. Having a mix of infantry, bikes and vehicles is a great way to get people to learn the differences betwee unit types. However, I would stay clear of flyers, buildings and chariots because those can be a bit weird for new players.

What doesn't work:
- Explaining WS vs. WS close combat. It's confusing as feth compared to BS and shooting to new players.
- Bringing psychic powers. 3 phases is enough for a starter game. You can inform them that there is such a thing as magic in 40K ,but that you're deliberately leaving it out for simplicities sake.

What my older brother did with me when I first started playing 40k, was to just use minimum FOC requirements (1 HQ, 2 Troops).

From there, we played a simple game that was mainly to teach me how moving and shooting work. That's how I started (this was like 4th or 5th ed. so things were way less complicated for me).

Slowly, we played more and more games to introduce some of the more complicated things, like assaulting and psychic powers.

So I would suggest playing a series of short, small scenarios to introduce the game bit by bit.

Also, if you've got more than one person who's interested, maybe have them play against each other, and you watch and explain as they go.

Hope this helps

It all depends on the crowd. 40k Rules are simple compared to the average rpg rules that my friends and I tend to play. On top of that those players like list building a lot.
Letting them build 1000 point armies each from he collection of models you have in your collection and help them with the rules along the game seems to be the best option for these kind of players.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
This is way more interesting then playing against then playing with pre-made lists while holding back or the even worse alternative you krumping them.

I've found the best way is to construct 500 point armies with relatively few special rules and go from there.

I've done Guard with a HWS, a couple vet squads with commissar and plasma guns plus a couple scout sentinels vs a couple tactical squads with flamers and a basic dread with assault cannon.

The big key is if you have 2 players, GM don't play, and try to avoid any mention of numbers that you can.

Space Marines vs Eldar is pretty simple, provided youre not using Windriders.

Eldar are fast and can fire all their weapons. Space Marines have more special weapons and don't care about morale (as much).

You want to have two forces that show off some nice diversity, and which demonstrate the two force's methods of war. Though one side should be numerically superior, they should both have the same number of units. Both sides should have a unit of basic infantry, one faster unit, and one big tough unit. A Dreadnaught is a wonderful unit for selling the game, and one side should have one. A small unit of bikes is also great. Nothing should start in Reserves (even if it's a good idea to, like with Terminators).

Your first mission also needs to be very simple and straightforward. The Relic is great for that. Don't roll for any Warlord traits, and pull their Psychic Powers for them if you even do any psykers in your first game. Absolutely no big vehicles for the first game. No flyers. Just one Monstrous Creature. Nothing too tough. Max of one special weapon power squad, and squad leaders should only have a single item. Keep it simple. It's a complicated game, but the basics will sell it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, and pretty important is having two new players play against each other! Now that's a level playing field!

The few intro games I've seen, usually had a couple of infantry squads, and maybe a vehicle (usually a transport of some kind).
Some rules were ignored entirely (such as bolters being AP5) just to give both players an idea of whats going on.

I may have an intro game of a kind tomorrow evening with a couple of newer players. I know at least one has his own army already (Tyranids). I figured I'd just build a relatively tame list at whatever points level and we'd just play, with me providing tips and tricks along the way. Nothing fancy, just a very basic list, not my crazy tournament Ravenwing rerollable jink nonsense.

1. take two generic armies like orks or space marines... nothin too fancy
2. set up two squads (i.e 20 orks vs 10 marines) and play it out.
moving, shooting and assault, explain the rules on the fly.
3. give em the rulebook and tell em to read it
4. after a couple o' days play a simple 500 points match (no scenario just kill of enemy units).

RedNoak wrote:
1. take two generic armies like orks or space marines... nothin too fancy
2. set up two squads (i.e 20 orks vs 10 marines) and play it out.
moving, shooting and assault, explain the rules on the fly.
3. give em the rulebook and tell em to read it
4. after a couple o' days play a simple 500 points match (no scenario just kill of enemy units).

Would you or your friends really enjoy that battle ?

1 HQ, 1Troops choice and vehicle of some kind per side. Make the armies simple so they're not overwhelmed by the rules but they can get a taste of them. Let them play "the good guy"iand you be the bad guy. Try to lose the game but not in a way that makes the player aware of it. Armies have to be fully painted.

Ex:
1 Captain
1 10 man tactical squad
1 Predator

vs

1 Warboss
1 15 man Ork boyz squad
1 Deff Dread

The two ways I've seen are small armies with as many different units as possible vs each other. That worked okay but it does mean going through a lot at once.

The other way was take 2 units from an army but that was for lots of people at once. It works okay the only issue was that it was an open game at a local store so of course people started bringing IK and WK.

1 HQ, 1 Troops and a vehicle. Maybe add a model with cool rules.... just so they get a 'wow' factor. Such as a Mawloc or something, but nothing too complex.

As others have stated made sure they're fully painted, and make sure they're more likely to win. Either do it by skewing points slightly or just the army composition. Marines are a good first choice for beginners, but the best thing is to let them decide who they wanna play as. Most people I know who got into the hobby simply selected whoever they felt was the coolest.

I'd say give them a fairly normal HQ, Troop with 1 Heavy Weapon and 1 assault weapon and something like a Russ, Predator, Razorback, Landspeeder, Dread, Sentinel etc. However not transports. For yourself have a slightly cheaper HQ, base troops (aka no special weapons etc), and a vehicle that is a different type. So say they have skimmer or walker, you have a standard vehicle. If you have models with no vehicles, such as nids or tau (damn suits), just give them something that looks cool.

Ignore most advanced rules. I remember being taught myself and we stuck to basic movement, basic shooting and assaulting. Maybe have a little cover, maybe include morale tests, but simply keep it in context of 25% casualties and assaults. The main thing is simply to have fun. If the rulebooks still have the short turn progression page etc let them have that in-front of them. Some people say ignore synapse.... but that more relies on who you're trying to get into it. If you think they would find it cool, do it. I still have some 3rd edition cards for the starter set which I sometimes still use to get people into it seeing the extreme basics are pretty similar.

Blood-for-the-blood-god wrote:
I have a couple of mates who are interested in trying 40k. I told them I'd show them the basics and I've got plenty of minis they can use for their first few games.
My question is, what is the best way to introduce them without overwhelming them?
I want to show them as wide a range of units as possible without as for me the variety on offer is one of the biggest draws for the game. However I'm aware that throwing in to much to early May just put them off.

I know the dark vengeance scenarios are intended for this purpose, but just wondered if anyone has any novel ideas or better ways to showcase the game to a beginner.

Do you bother with FOC? Do you play units or just individual models to teach the basic mechanics? How many points do you think is appropriate? Are points appropriate? Do you focus on balance or a good narrative?

Any advice is much appreciated.

Cheers

I generally lose intro games. flat throw them. lol.

But as for doing a demo, I think th easiest thing is to have two of the same army face off. Sure there's things they won't see immediately but thats not really the point. getting them to see the basics is the point.

1. Make sure that both armies hit on the same number. it's simpler. so similar BS and WS makes the first couple games a little easier to get used to. Commanders will hit easier and that will seem as it should be.

2. Identical forces. Why not? :Less units to explain and the second guy is following right along as you explain it to the first guy. It will be more fun to mix it up but if you're goal is to TEACH, then let the complication come later. Also whether they win or lose, there wont be any damn "army envy" going on and you personally dont have to feel bad about matching XYZ up against ABC. They're the same!

3. Have them play from one side of the board and then switch. Identical armies make this super easy and quick. Lets them see the board from a different angle and perhaps reveals to them what their opponent was thinking and maybe where they erred.

4. After two small practice games, allow them to add their own personal choices of up to 250 more points. this allows them to kind of pick through the codex without getting too crazy and they can start to individualize and "take ownership" of their forces. Start to see a little variety. Plus they will be better equipped to even look at a codex.

I like to start by having us each drop some $20 bills in the paper shredder, with whichever one of us shreds the most money winning the game. I think this does a nice job of setting the theme of how a normal 40k game will go.

 Peregrine wrote:
I like to start by having us each drop some $20 bills in the paper shredder, with whichever one of us shreds the most money winning the game. I think this does a nice job of setting the theme of how a normal 40k game will go.

Thank you for this constructive advice.

Exalt for Peregrine! Don't let the anti-snark faction get you down!

Thanks to all for some great advice and ideas. I especially like the idea of pitting the two newbies against eachother while I act as a sort of GM.

I think I'm gonna run a little mini narative campaign between space marines and chaos space marines. Starting with a kill team mission so I can teach the basics of movement with different unit types, shooting, and assault without having to worry about to many models.

Then I'm gonna run a 750 point game using the relic mission and introduce vehicles, probably a helbrute for Csm and a predator for sm.

Finally I'm gonna give each player a copy of the codex and let them pick 250 points worth of cool and let them duke it out over a standard EW mission.

I know some have advised against use of psykers in order to keep it streamlined but knowing the players I think they'll be most interested in that aspect from a narrative standpoint so I'm gonna include a lv1 on each side with a pre generated power (any suggestions?).

Also seeing as I can act as GM I might play a 3rd threat such as daemons and place the odd squad hear and there to keep things interesting/prevent one player from getting his face stomped.

Thanks again for the advice guys.

Go unbound. The FoC can be confusing at first. Try and avoid units with a lot of complexity, i.e. wulfen with a lot of table rolling and checking. Make it a balanced fight. Getting your gob smacked about by eldar won't leave a good taste in your mouth as a newbie. Try and make the table and scenario as cool as possible. Spending hundreds of dollars on minis and then playing on your kitchen table can kind of ruin the mood. Good luck, and hopefully you can get your buddies into the hobby

@#1shoeldbrother3++ Yeah I wanna try and make the whole experience as cool for them as possible. Wel be playing with all painted minis on a realm of battle with plenty of fully painted terrain. I wanna show them this game in its best possible light so I'm going for something as thematic as possible. I figure if I got hooked pushing a few marines around the dining table over hills made of books then this should really peak their interest.

Blood-for-the-blood-god wrote:
Thanks to all for some great advice and ideas. I especially like the idea of pitting the two newbies against eachother while I act as a sort of GM.

That's perfect! The main thing is that you're not there to choose their actions; they need to pick those for themselves. The main thing you want to do is help facilitate their first game. Don't get bogged down by the rules. If there's Space Marines on one side, just say that they're hitting on 3's or better. No need to even explain why or get into the gritty of BS, WS, or S/T charts. If they ask why they're hitting on 3's the answer should be something like, "They're really great soldiers who have trained for decades, and battled for centuries." and THAT'S why!

Blood-for-the-blood-god wrote:
I think I'm gonna run a little mini narative campaign between space marines and chaos space marines. Starting with a kill team mission so I can teach the basics of movement with different unit types, shooting, and assault without having to worry about to many models.

Then I'm gonna run a 750 point game using the relic mission and introduce vehicles, probably a helbrute for Csm and a predator for sm.

Finally I'm gonna give each player a copy of the codex and let them pick 250 points worth of cool and let them duke it out over a standard EW mission.

Don't do Kill Team for the first game. Do squads. First game should really just be 3 units vs 3 units. After that, if your intro game was done well, they'll probably want a second game right away with the same forces! This is a great idea, since by the end of that first game they'll be thinking to themselves of all the things they could've done differently. If they really want, give each of them their pick of 1 more unit for this second game. Don't involve points costs until the third game, and then just give them a few datasheets to work with (not a whole codex)!

Generally speaking, if they like the game, they'll buy the rules and the codex on their own. Let them. The beginning of playing this game is about discovery, and they need to be self-motivated for that to happen.

Blood-for-the-blood-god wrote:
I know some have advised against use of psykers in order to keep it streamlined but knowing the players I think they'll be most interested in that aspect from a narrative standpoint so I'm gonna include a lv1 on each side with a pre generated power (any suggestions?).

Only give one of the two players a Psyker, opposite of the player with the Dreadnaught. It should be talked about and fawned over as being such this critical and amazing guy, just as important as the Dreadnaught. If it's a Chaos Sorcerer, give them Bolt of Change (and nothing else!). It's a visually strong power, and it can potentially destroy a Dreadnaught. If it's a Space Marine Librarian, give him Iron Arm. This lets the Librarian be a real hero-style unit.

Blood-for-the-blood-god wrote:
Also seeing as I can act as GM I might play a 3rd threat such as daemons and place the odd squad hear and there to keep things interesting/prevent one player from getting his face stomped.

No. Absolutely not. Let me re-iterate. NO. By the Emperor that's a bad idea!

Firstly, if this is their first game, one side shouldn't just be getting stomped. Let it play out, because players will always surprise you! What you can do is point out the the player that's behind a special rule that you'd otherwise ignore. "Hey, that Sorcerer can leave his unit, letting them die while he grabs the glory of the Relic!". But absolutely do NOT get involved! The moment they see you putting down your own models to keep balance, the game becomes lost, since it's now Big Brother watching. You need to just guide them in their first game. They have to choose where to move, whether to shoot or run, and whether or not to try and charge. You're just there to make sure they do those things correctly, fix potentially problematic behaviours early (like making sure they roll dice in the open, or measuring from front-to-front), and get through from the start of the game to the end of the game as fast as possible. Keep that energy up, keep it fun, and they'll be hooked!