Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

If a renegade chapter or one of the original traitor legions turned back into the emperors light?

The taint of chaos can never be removed. The best they will get is a quick death. Even the DA kill the fallen who repent

Hmmm you may be right,but there are some renegade chapters that were just driven insane and didn't succumb to chaos willingly.

They can become Black Shields and become permanent members of the Deathwatch. Obviously this works for renegades and others who are the last loyal survivors of their chapters.

jareddm wrote:
They can become Black Shields and become permanent members of the Deathwatch. Obviously this works for renegades and others who are the last loyal survivors of their chapters.

But they were loyalists and never fully corrupted, right? There's no going back once you truly embrace Chaos.

The Badab War is a good example of renegade chapters serving the Emperor once again. Many of the chapters fighting for Huron were given a second chance, or sent on penitent crusades. So there's still hope for renegades but not for CSMs.

Even if it were possible to break free from the Dark Gods, the Imperium would never take them back and would give them a swift death at most, as seen with the Fallen who repent (though I'd argue that many of the Fallen aren't even true CSMs... many of them just seem like they're in denial and still think they were betrayed, or they're just on the run because there's no other option and they're insane anyway. But you don't see that much Chaos worshiping from them).

sushi2001 wrote:Hmmm you may be right,but there are some renegade chapters that were just driven insane and didn't succumb to chaos willingly.

Not quite.
Once the mark of Chaos is on you, you would not be taken back in on most cases. Being driven insane is still being corrupted, even if not willingly. A corrupt marine is a dead marine in the eyes of the Imperium.

jareddm wrote:They can become Black Shields and become permanent members of the Deathwatch. Obviously this works for renegades and others who are the last loyal survivors of their chapters.

I've only seen this work on Renegades. Renegade Marines are different to Chaos Marines as a Renegade is just opposed to the Imperium. A Chaos Marine has changed their loyalty to the Chaos Gods, thus damning their soul. You can have a survivor of a chapter that did turn to Chaos, but the Marine in question must not have joined Chaos, then had a change of heart.

EngulfedObject wrote:

jareddm wrote:
They can become Black Shields and become permanent members of the Deathwatch. Obviously this works for renegades and others who are the last loyal survivors of their chapters.

But they were loyalists and never fully corrupted, right? There's no going back once you truly embrace Chaos.

The Badab War is a good example of renegade chapters serving the Emperor once again. Many of the chapters fighting for Huron were given a second chance, or sent on penitent crusades. So there's still hope for renegades but not for CSMs.

Even if it were possible to break free from the Dark Gods, the Imperium would never take them back and would give them a swift death at most, as seen with the Fallen who repent (though I'd argue that many of the Fallen aren't even true CSMs... many of them just seem like they're in denial and still think they were betrayed, or they're just on the run because there's no other option and they're insane anyway. But you don't see that much Chaos worshiping from them).

This.
Renegades = Okay
Chaos = No

jareddm wrote:
They can become Black Shields and become permanent members of the Deathwatch. Obviously this works ONLY for renegades and others who are the last loyal survivors of their chapters.

I'd forgotten to type an important word, as otherwise 'obviously' makes no sense.

But my point was for survivors of fallen chapters (not legions), the Black Shield route is an option.

 EngulfedObject wrote:
The Badab War is a good example of renegade chapters serving the Emperor once again. Many of the chapters fighting for Huron were given a second chance, or sent on penitent crusades. So there's still hope for renegades but not for CSMs.

Mantis Warriors kinda got away with it halfway when, while on their penitent crusade, their Red Hunters wardens mysteriously vanished

There would probably be one poor adapt back on terra with a hell of a pile of paper work and a very kindly member of the inquisition standing over them while they blacked out every mention of the aforementioned traitor.

Once thats done the lovely inquisitor would invite the adept to come on a lovely trip down to the office for an "appraisal""

The talk round the staff water cooler is jerry from desk 2128b got reassigned to desk 4142a on the fifth floor

As for the marine if they haven't been tainted by chaos they'd most likely be sent on some redemption mission where there is very little chance of making it out alive

Pretty sure this was a plot point of Dead Sky, Black Sun, only with renegades.

But yeah, there's no way a full-spiky marine would be forgiven. How would he even approach people to let them know he wanted to change?

"Sir, there's a Chaos Marine coming towards us."
"Shoot him with the heavy bolter"
"He's holding his hands up sir."
"Fine, use the lascannon. Then call an artillery strike to be sure."

If he wanted redemption he'd probably try and do the same sort of thing as the soul drinkers did.

The Badab War is a good example of renegade chapters serving the Emperor once again. Many of the chapters fighting for Huron were given a second chance, or sent on penitent crusades. So there's still hope for renegades but not for CSMs.

Indeed, but - again - at the start of the hostilities, the Badab War was Huron - the lawful ruler of the Maelstrom Sector - and the Maelstrom Warder chapters versus the Fire Hawks (who were being spiteful arses) and the massively corrupt rulers of the neighbouring sectors - and the latter definitely shot first.

It was, essentially, two imperial factions versus one another, not one faction versus the imperium; and indeed the Executioners stood down and surrendered the moment they realised it had turned into that - which is probably why they got off fairly lightly.


It led to a rather interesting conversation in our Deathwatch RPG group - we had a Deathwing Veteran on the team who genuinely had never heard of the chapter, in character or out. On being told "they were tricked into betraying the emperor, confessed openly to their brother chapters, and were judged and forgiven." the response was "....wait, they let you do that?!?!"

locarno24 wrote:

The Badab War is a good example of renegade chapters serving the Emperor once again. Many of the chapters fighting for Huron were given a second chance, or sent on penitent crusades. So there's still hope for renegades but not for CSMs.

Indeed, but - again - at the start of the hostilities, the Badab War was Huron - the lawful ruler of the Maelstrom Sector - and the Maelstrom Warder chapters versus the Fire Hawks (who were being spiteful arses) and the massively corrupt rulers of the neighbouring sectors - and the latter definitely shot first.

That is simply not true. Huron shot first, and made no pretense to hide it, just justifying it:

Lugft Huron...was adamant that the fleet was fired upon for refusing to give way to the just authority of the system's masters...

p. 21, Imperial Armour Volume 9, The Badab War Part 1

Also Huron had been withholding his tithe to the Administratum and blockading ship traffic from passing through his area. However this then impacted upon the Karthago Sector's rulers who were then unable to meet their tithe requirements. Huron's actions were directly impacting and preventing another section of the Imperium from fulfilling its lawful duties. Yes, the Karthago Sector was corrupt but they also did fulfill their obligations to the Imperium.

Why the other Chapters that sided with Huron were allowed to surrender and survive was because at that time Huron had not yet turned to Chaos. It was an Imperial on Imperial conflict, with both sides claiming they were acting in the best interests of the Imperium. If Huron had instead been openly siding with Chaos, it is more likely those other Chapters might have been viewed as irredeemably tainted and therefore to be destroyed.

It led to a rather interesting conversation in our Deathwatch RPG group - we had a Deathwing Veteran on the team who genuinely had never heard of the chapter, in character or out. On being told "they were tricked into betraying the emperor, confessed openl
y to their brother chapters, and were judged and forgiven." the response was [I]"....wait, they let you do that?!?!"

This is one of the funniest 40k things I've heard in a long time. Poor veteran, he probably suggested it to his brothers when he got back, and they told Asmodai to make him repent...

sushi2001 wrote:
If a renegade chapter or one of the original traitor legions turned back into the emperors light?

There are plenty of instances of chapters that used extreme methods(or were at the wrong place at the wrong time) and were excommunicated but still tried to serve the IoM. Returning to the "emperor's light" might be easy, but returning to the administration of the high lords of terra is not. Once suspected of being a traitor, it is nearly impossible to rejoin the system.

Worshiping chaos though there is no going back. To realize the lie that is the Emperor is similar to that moment when you figure out Santa Claus doesnt exist. Once it happens it cannot be undone.