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Hi there,
I have a friend who plays orks with the old codex, not the latest one. It doesn't bother us, as we play very friendly, but I was wondering if it could really change someting for him.
Is it a nerf ? A big up ? How does it compare to the new one ?
I can probably get him the codex if there is a great difference between the two.
I heard a lot of people complaining about this codex, this is why I'm asking.
Old one misses some cool new options. Such as the mek guns, the planes and the gorkanauts, and a few cool warlord traits + relics
But the new one is also a huge nerf in general. - Deff rolla's got nerfed to : They don't work no longer. - Mob rule got nerfed to: You no longer get a highr ld but this crappy table instead. - Weaker psykers. - Removal of Forge org manupulation HQ's options - Pain boyz are now expensive HQ's instead of unit upgrades. - Shoota boyz and all sorts of other things got more expensive. - Loota's are heavy now. - Looted wagon is no longer a dedicated transport. - The trukk ramshakle rule is gone now -> replaced by a non important rule - Nerf on the best gun in the codex. - You need a warbozz in order to waaagh now. - IA8 is not updated so has some mismatching rules with them - Boarding plank drive by option is killed off. - Red paint is killed off. - Wrecking ball is nerfed - Killa kans now have to take some sort of a moral test if they are under - Ghaz got nerfed and is a low now - KFF is nerfed to model within 6" and no longer goes outside transports
Buffs.
- You can take a few cheap mek characters to put into a squad and take challenges instead of your nob. -Old Fleet fixed back on waagh + a nice re roll 1 die on charge - Da lucky stick relic is great it allows re rolls of saves. So Mega warbosses all have it now to get a 2+ rerolable. Sadly a S10 AP2 weapon still insta gibs them and they no longer have ANY option to get a inv save in melee - Loota's 1 point cheaper. - Mek guns are good. ( but also heavy support) - Tank busta's lose their must kill vehicles first crazyness. - storm boys have a serious charge range now - Some nice formations in the supplements including a expensive one that makes ghazz a beast again, some things that allow you to waaagh every turn and a weaker version of the old appoc green tide formation.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Just look at this youtube videos to see how happy it makes ork players.
Notice this positive guy reviewing the codex and just suddenly being able to buy an ork army for really cheap when the new codex got out. This was a general thing. This is the codex was such a disappointment that made most ork players stop playing orks especcially when necrons, tau and elder did receive buffs instead of nerfs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsXWQyvhcz8
This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2016/07/12 13:33:04
Inactive, user. New profile might pop up in a while
Well, to be fair, Zoggy is leaving out that a bunch of specialist units that were nigh unusable in the old 'dex got significant points decreases or buffs in the new codex.
Basically, if you like basic boyz/nobz/trukks/wagons and HQ choices especially named characters: The old dex is best.
if you like the more specialized tankbustas/kommandos/deffcoptas/big gunz/bikers: the new dex is slightly better.
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
the_scotsman wrote: Well, to be fair, Zoggy is leaving out that a bunch of specialist units that were nigh unusable in the old 'dex got significant points decreases or buffs in the new codex.
Basically, if you like basic boyz/nobz/trukks/wagons and HQ choices especially named characters: The old dex is best.
if you like the more specialized tankbustas/kommandos/deffcoptas/big gunz/bikers: the new dex is slightly better.
I have to disagree on that one.
Tank bustas got better yeah but I mentioned the reason why. Also they might just got killed off again by the new draft FAQ.
Kommandos got nerfed. Before: Fearless in blobs now LD7 but slightly cheaper. And they got no compensation for losing the old big benefits of infiltrate.
Deffcopta's Got 5 points cheaper and the 10 point rokkit upgrade for free. Thats nice. But it does not compensate for the scout + assault with a buzzsaw trick at all. I still use them and I use them a lot, but I mainly use them now as a cheap objective grabber / over watch eater. That rokkit doesn't really matter that much. But the 5 point decrease is nice I guess.
Bikes in trade of point reduction. Used to be troops if you bought the correct HQ you can no longer do this ( I know you guys all use that FW update that is never updated for this codex ( and is just removed from their site instead) to get the troop bikes back. But is this really to be contributed towards this codex ?) Exhaust cloud is killed off Became LD7
Nobz and Biker Nobz Became LD7 Lost their ability to gain an inv save Lost their ability to get FNP as a unit upgrade its now a 50 point HQ instead of a 30 point unit upgrade Lost their ability to be Troops. Lost their ability to individually upgrade to eavy armour Got a slight point decrease.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Sure they might be the best things in the new codex but slightly better is not what I would call them at all. Having no inv save, not being troops and being LD7 is just too sucky.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2016/07/12 14:21:10
Inactive, user. New profile might pop up in a while
2016/07/12 14:30:41
Subject: Re:Is the new ork codex worth the old one ?
Well, my main opponent plays ork. And to be honest, the old (V5) dex was way better. For the most part, the key units such as boyz got nerfed either by a raise in price, either by the desappearance of rules like the truck or the boyz had. Moreover they lost the looted vehicule... THAT'S BETRAYAL!!!!!!
Finally, the fact they got rid of the waaagh unless you own a big boss is a real pity. All that orks gained fails to compensate as to my mind the only valuable new stuff is the AA gun. The rest is trash, especially the Gorka/Morkanauts which are just some gigantic thing like they like releaseing at the moment. Needless to mention the price of it...
So my advice for your friend: he should stick to his old codex.
40k: Necrons/Imperial Guard/ Space marines
Bolt Action: Germany/ USA
Project Z.
"The Dakka Dive Bar is the only place you'll hear what's really going on in the underhive. Sure you might not find a good amasec but they grill a mean groxburger. Just watch for ratlings being thrown through windows and you'll be alright." Ciaphas Cain, probably.
LIke zoggy said, about the only things in the new codex that got better was tankbustas, warbikers, and mek guns. Pretty much everything else was a disaster.
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment." Words to live by.
It's changed things up a bit. I think that it's somewhat stronger than the previous codex in 7-th edition as the game itself has changed a lot. For example, old kanz that have been amazing in 5-th are gona be weak in 7-th even with those old rules (with new rules they're a strong contendant for 'The worst walker' in 40k). Tankbustas have gotten significantly better even after the nerfs. Painbosses are a win in my book as you can now have a squad of fnp boyz, bikers or manz. Semi-fleet is great too. Mek gunz.
There are a lot of nerfs nevertheless. Walkers are not worth looking at now as they're way overcosted, fragile and slow for the current edition, nob bikers are no longer that great, Ghaz is a fail and so on.
Mob rule is a mixed bag. It makes boyz somewhat worse and doesn't help against fear. So, orks are the only melee army that is afraid of melee. But it helps smaller squads with characters. It allows manz missile to become playable (though, it'd be fine with just ld7 and re-roll like the old bosspole worked).
But we should look in the context of the current state of the game. For me it's like this:
Old dex in 5-th ed was >> New dex in 7-th.
But Old dex in 7-th is <= New dex in 7-th.
Flash Gitz and Blitzabommers also had huge improvements that turned them from a joke to something that was decent or potentially viable in solid lists. Other units received improvements but what hurts of them is that the army wide changes like Mob Rule, KFF, and Cybork all crippled any gains they made.
Kans, Biker Nobz, Shoota Boyz, Dakkajets, Battlewagons, trukks, and Burna Boyz all got nerfed while most of the unlisted stuff is a more complicated mix of buffs and nerfs that honestly feel like a net neutral change.
"Hold my shoota, I'm goin in"
Armies (7th edition points)
7000+ Points Death Skullz
4000 Points
+ + 3000 Points "The Fiery Heart of the Emperor"
3500 Points "Void Kraken" Space Marines
3000 Points "Bard's Booze Cruise"
2016/08/18 15:05:46
Subject: Re:Is the new ork codex worth the old one ?
Maréchal des Logis Walter wrote: Well, my main opponent plays ork. And to be honest, the old (V5) dex was way better. For the most part, the key units such as boyz got nerfed either by a raise in price, either by the desappearance of rules like the truck or the boyz had. Moreover they lost the looted vehicule... THAT'S BETRAYAL!!!!!!
Well they lost the looted vechile for about a week or so until GW gave it back. So there's that at least.
Notice this positive guy reviewing the codex and just suddenly being able to buy an ork army for really cheap when the new codex got out. This was a general thing. This is the codex was such a disappointment that made most ork players stop playing orks especcially when necrons, tau and elder did receive buffs instead of nerfs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsXWQyvhcz8
Rant incoming.
This guy lost me at the, "GW just wants me to run alot of boys and that is not fun".
Boo freakin hoo. This is no different then the damn dark angels players that whine about having to take tacticals, or blood angels players saying they want to JUST FIELD DEATH COMPANY!
Well guess what, that's not available. It does not work that way anymore. If you think that msu is dumb, well you are playing a xenos hoard army...
NO army, no Deathstar, has the ability to drive up model and unit count like the orks, the new codex lets you do so more than anyone outside of IA13. Guess what, that works! I don't care how many gargantuan creatures, or librarian super friend units, or whatever; the hard counter to the current meta is MSU and no one wants to play it.
Good riddance. /rant off
To the dude asking, orks are a ball, as are KDK, the two best MSU armies at the moment that are not space marines.
Good god I forgot how much I loved the foc swapping that you got to do in the old codex. Man I miss the gak out of that! It really is so very fluffy and helps bring character and personal touch to your army as a leader. On a side not I really miss the third edition choppa rules
Notice this positive guy reviewing the codex and just suddenly being able to buy an ork army for really cheap when the new codex got out. This was a general thing. This is the codex was such a disappointment that made most ork players stop playing orks especcially when necrons, tau and elder did receive buffs instead of nerfs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsXWQyvhcz8
Rant incoming.
This guy lost me at the, "GW just wants me to run alot of boys and that is not fun".
Boo freakin hoo. This is no different then the damn dark angels players that whine about having to take tacticals, or blood angels players saying they want to JUST FIELD DEATH COMPANY!
Well guess what, that's not available. It does not work that way anymore. If you think that msu is dumb, well you are playing a xenos hoard army...
NO army, no Deathstar, has the ability to drive up model and unit count like the orks, the new codex lets you do so more than anyone outside of IA13. Guess what, that works! I don't care how many gargantuan creatures, or librarian super friend units, or whatever; the hard counter to the current meta is MSU and no one wants to play it.
Good riddance. /rant off
To the dude asking, orks are a ball, as are KDK, the two best MSU armies at the moment that are not space marines.
He might have lost you at that point, but it hit home to a lot of other players. Also you kind of went back on yourself "GW wants me to run a lot of boyz and that is not fun" Which implies I will be bringing HORDES of boyz and you rant this is nothing at all and a number of other factions have to take tacticals and what not. Then you go on to say that MSU is the best way to play at the moment..Boyz are the exact OPPOSITE of MSU. They are FHU (FETHING HUGE UNITS). If you think orks are good in the current edition i highly suggest you go look at EVERY major tournament across the US/Canada and Europe. Orks aren't winning, nor are they even placing well. LVO the highest ork was something like 80+.
Also, the only GOOD MSU the orks can pull off is Bull Boyz and Biker Boyz with Zhadsnark as the Warlord, otherwise they die in droves. BTW Ork Bikers aren't that good, they are one of the best units in our codex, but only because most of our codex is garbage.
For the OP though here is a breakdown of what is wrong with orks and what is good with orks when comparing the two codexs.
Spoiler:
New codex is significantly worse then the last codex, furthermore, just to compound the problem, most of the reasons why the last codex was good had more to do with the rules being written in 5th and 6th edition then the actual codex being good, IE the wound shenanigans with nob bikers and what not.
Overall though the new codex is a nerf, and a rather large one.
Upsides:
Lootas got a bit cheaper, Sadly though they got moved to HS slot which means they are constantly fighting for room.
Tankbustas are now usable, though the new FAQ teamed with the fact that they are still just boyz (IE 6+ armor) means they suck.
Mek Gunz are good, probably one of the absolute best units in our codex, unfortunately only the AA Gun and the KMK are worth taking as far as new options. The Rest and most of the old options are trash.
Flash Gitz are back, but they suck terribly and are so heavily over priced they have yet to be fielded in a major tournament list.
Lucky Stick: New toy that really helps certain models. Team a LS Warboss on a bike with Zhadsnark and turbo-boost and you can have a 2+ rerollable cover save....on one model....which costs about 300pts to get (with a lot of other bonuses)
Downsides:
Killa Kanz, Deff Dreads, Morkanaut, Gorkanaut and the Stompa are UNPLAYABLE. Stompa to a lesser extent, though it is seriously not worth 770pt, Hell its barely worth 550pts.
Killa Kanz got a 45%ish increase in price, lost 3 strength on their klaw profile AND are the only vehicle in the game with leadership problems that I know of, that all teamed with significantly crappy weapon choices means that this once useful unit is utter trash.
Deff Dreads: Just to expensive for what little they can do. They also got a significant nerf when SM Dreads all got a buff. 4 CCW is barely enough to keep up with a dreadnoughts 1 CCW? how does that work.
Mork/Gork: Seriously the worst pile of garbage GW has ever tried to shove down our throats. These models are $$$ EXPENSIVE and they are expensive to use on the table. For the 230+pts these things cost you would expect them to put out some decent dakka but they don't. Gorkanaut is the biggest offender with its Gatling gun which shoots on average 7 shots, of which 2-3 will hit and only at S6. It has 2 Rokkitz (Which in a 6 turn game will hit exactly twice each) They both also have 2 TL Big Shootas which pathetically tend to do the most damage 6 S5 TL shots is averaging about 3-4 hits a turn, not terrible but not worth the points. Finally the vehicles each mount a belly gun, The Gork has a SKorcha which is great, except that as a walker it has little chance to get into range to use it, and once it is in range your not really going to want to use it because you might ruin your charge distance for that giant S10 AP1 Klaw you have, which for some odd reason is only WS4 and still not enough attacks on the profile to justify the point cost. The Mork has a KMK and a KMB to differentiate between itself and the gorkanaut, the KMK is a good weapon, but it overheats which is a bit of a problem, the KMB overheats as well and worse its not a blast weapon which means that you have a 1/6 chance to hurt yourself and a 1/3 chance to hit your target.
Stompa is just to over priced to function in most lists.
Boyz: T4 used to matter, it doesn't anymore. T4 is about the average now and that teamed with 6+ armor = lots of dead orks, but that is what the game creators want, or at least that is what every Tau/Eldar/SM player keeps telling me. Furthermore, Boyz are S3 which means that if you don't win combat on the charge, your going to get bogged down really quickly. S3 Vs T4 = wounding on 5s. Furthermore the new Mob Rule really gimps orks because it makes it almost impossible to function. In a big blob you take a lot of casualties because when you fail a LD test you have to hurt D6 boyz. Worse, for a smaller unit of 10 boyz you NEED a nob to even use Mob Rule, and in case you as the reader have never played against Orks, BOYZ NEED A NOB! Without that nob they don't even benefit from Mob Rule once they drop below 10 models, because of that your Average Ork player doesn't like accepting challenges with his precious nob for fear that he will get challenged out and die, thereby destroying the units only chance at passing a moral test. (Except by rolling a 1 on the charge if in CC)
Nobz: Without wound pool shenanigans they suck. 18pts for a single model. If you upgrade them to have eavy armor and a PK your paying MORE for them then you would for a MA nob. Give them bikes? It costs more to give a Nob a bike then it does to give a IC a bike or to give a SM Chapter master a bike. WHY!
MA Nobz: Got slighty better with the Mob rule, but doesnt change the fact that they don't have access to a CC Invul, and the only way you can get a FNP is to buy a IC for 50pts and attach him to that squad.
Burna Boyz: unplayable at the moment because they NEED a battlewagon to even function and they cost far to much to do that.
Kommandos: I have yet to see them fielded in any kind of game except For fun games. They are just to pricey for what little they can do, think of expensive boyz that have Camo Paint.
Flash Gitz: SO EXPENSIVE, NO ARMOR, SHORT RANGE, why do they all have boss poles? Situational upgrade that gives them BS3 but only if they don't move....which they need to since with range 24 guns they won't be in range. Random AP means they might be good, they might be gak.
Lootas: Same as before, slighty cheaper and moved to the HS slot where they now have to compete against Mek Gunz and other toyz. They die in droves to a stiff breeze and with so many weapons in the game now that ignore cover they generally don't get a save of any sort and are dead or worthless by turn 2-3.
Mek Gunz: Smasha Gun, Bubble Chucka, ZZap Gun are useless. completely un-fieldable if you are attempting to be even remotely competitive.
Warbikers: LD 7 means they are going to be running away frequently, if they even live that long. Exhaust cloud being gone kind of sucks, it was nice not having to jink.
ALL ORK PLANES/FLYERS: AV10, no dakka and over priced.
Storm Boyz: If they didn't have the negative of killing themselves in droves they would be fieldable and possibly competitive in a rushing army, at least give some difference lists a shot instead of the FA slots being filled with Warbikers and the occasional DeffKopta
Deff Kopta: Still expensive, Still has leadership issues, just got a bit cheaper and no longer paying for Rokkitz. However they are just Boyz which means that they are S3 or S6 (with Saw) so they aren't as much of a threat to vehicles as your opponent thinks they are.
Warbuggies: They aren't terrible but they don't have enough dakka to play with. If you could triple the amount of Dakka on them they would be good, And worth paying an extra 5-10pts for. AV10 means they aren't going to live long after they arrive from reserve
Ghaz: I honestly don't know of a more useless LoW in any army that is a character. Seriously this is supposed to be the best Ork in the galaxy and he costs over 200pts. But a Warboss in MA is almost as good as he is. hell you could buy 2 MA Warbosses for less points and they would do more damage then Ghaz. He needs a HUGE Buff otherwise retcon him and give us a new Ork Warboss who is worth following.
Mork/Gork: Seriously the worst pile of garbage GW has ever tried to shove down our throats. These models are $$$ EXPENSIVE and they are expensive to use on the table. For the 230+pts these things cost you would expect them to put out some decent dakka but they don't. Gorkanaut is the biggest offender with its Gatling gun which shoots on average 7 shots, of which 2-3 will hit and only at S6.
While generally you make good points small correction. Gorkanaut main gun does have in average 10.5 shots(3d6=10.5). Doesn't albeit help much but at least bit better than 7.
Ah well. Good thing rules I use are better for orks.
Mork/Gork: Seriously the worst pile of garbage GW has ever tried to shove down our throats. These models are $$$ EXPENSIVE and they are expensive to use on the table. For the 230+pts these things cost you would expect them to put out some decent dakka but they don't. Gorkanaut is the biggest offender with its Gatling gun which shoots on average 7 shots, of which 2-3 will hit and only at S6.
While generally you make good points small correction. Gorkanaut main gun does have in average 10.5 shots(3d6=10.5). Doesn't albeit help much but at least bit better than 7.
Ah well. Good thing rules I use are better for orks.
I haven't used my ork army once since the new codex. Kan klawz went from x2 to +2 strength. I have nine in my 1k army. It went from being a funny army to play, to being a joke.
JamesY wrote: I haven't used my ork army once since the new codex. Kan klawz went from x2 to +2 strength. I have nine in my 1k army. It went from being a funny army to play, to being a joke.
and went from 35pts a model to 50pts a model as well as gaining a new special rule called "Cowardly Grots" which is pseudo Leadership issues.
On a side note, is there a single army out there that has as many "Special Rules" as the Orks do that are negatives? I mean hell we have so many special rules that are at best situational but mostly bad that it is ridiculous.
One of the biggest things that hurt in my opinion is that there is no combat invuln saves for your average warboss. Cybork body was turned from a 5+ invuln to a 6+ FNP save. it's friggen maddening! The orks are supposed to be masters at close combat, and yet they lack one of the biggest things you can have for combat. now, you need a painboy sitting behind in your squad that contains your warboss to provide that crappy 5+ fnp save and pray your warboss doesn't face anything with AP2.
Also, we pretty much have only 3 types of combat weapon. A choppa, a big choppa, and a powerclaw. We are the friggen orks! apparantly we spiffy up the weapons we suck at (guns) so they are shiny and shooty and gak, but when it comes to combat weapons all we can muster are two variations of a dull knife and a power fist? Where are the power weapons? Why cant I give my nobs a power sword or a power axe? surely it doesn't take Orkimedes to take some energy to a choppa? surely some boss saw a Space Marine captain chopping up his boys with a Relic Blade and thought "Oi! Why is his choppa sharper than mine? " but no, all we get are cheap weapons with worse ap of a powermaul, or an expensive boxing glove.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/12 22:45:07
"Do you really think 7th edition was the best edition?"
Tiger9gamer wrote: One of the biggest things that hurt in my opinion is that there is no combat invuln saves for your average warboss. Cybork body was turned from a 5+ invuln to a 6+ FNP save. it's friggen maddening! The orks are supposed to be masters at close combat, and yet they lack one of the biggest things you can have for combat. now, you need a painboy sitting behind in your squad that contains your warboss to provide that crappy 5+ fnp save and pray your warboss doesn't face anything with AP2.
Also, we pretty much have only 3 types of combat weapon. A choppa, a big choppa, and a powerclaw. We are the friggen orks! apparantly we spiffy up the weapons we suck at (guns) so they are shiny and shooty and gak, but when it comes to combat weapons all we can muster are two variations of a dull knife and a power fist? Where are the power weapons? Why cant I give my nobs a power sword or a power axe? surely it doesn't take Orkimedes to take some energy to a choppa? surely some boss saw a Space Marine captain chopping up his boys with a Relic Blade and thought "Oi! Why is his choppa sharper than mine? " but no, all we get are cheap weapons with worse ap of a powermaul, or an expensive boxing glove.
Join the 2nd ed players
On more serious note with the way rules work 3th ed onward orks wouldn't really benefit from power sword. Since you are almost always hitting last anyway(bad initiave) you don't gain anything from power sword. And against stuff you generally strike first anyway(power fist wielders) they often have 2+ save to begin with so AP3 is useless.
JamesY wrote: I haven't used my ork army once since the new codex. Kan klawz went from x2 to +2 strength. I have nine in my 1k army. It went from being a funny army to play, to being a joke.
and went from 35pts a model to 50pts a model as well as gaining a new special rule called "Cowardly Grots" which is pseudo Leadership issues.
On a side note, is there a single army out there that has as many "Special Rules" as the Orks do that are negatives? I mean hell we have so many special rules that are at best situational but mostly bad that it is ridiculous.
Whoever wrote the Ork codex had it out for Killa Kans. I have never seen such a non viable unit get beaten to a pulp with the nerf bat. That being said the Grotzooka is still amazing IF the kanz can make it close enough to fire the thing while everything else is not worth taking.
Also all of those special rules are suppose to be "exciting" which really brings out the fluff of the Orks and helps with forging that narrative .
"Hold my shoota, I'm goin in"
Armies (7th edition points)
7000+ Points Death Skullz
4000 Points
+ + 3000 Points "The Fiery Heart of the Emperor"
3500 Points "Void Kraken" Space Marines
3000 Points "Bard's Booze Cruise"
Honestly while bad against infantry the deffrolla can work wonders against vehicles. I did 3 hull points to an imperial knight, blowing it up while I took no damage. Quite hilarious.
Ugh its so hard to say. I didn't know the ork codex was garbage compared to say Tau or Eldar codexes when I bought it so I can't really recommend it now that I know the horror of it all (my poor sweet mob rule you were so young). But on the other hand playing with last edition rules might be weird and it doesn't let you have access to all that orks have at the moment....
If you can find it cheap on ebay I'd say go for it.
"People say on their first meeting a Man and an Ork exchanged a long, hard look, didn't care much for what they saw, and shot each other dead."
Old rules. Always: 1d6 S10 ap- hits before any normal tankshock / ramming dmg even before the victims have any chance to react + Re roll terrain When they decide to death or glory. 1d6 extra S10 ap - hits
New rules. Always: Armour + 2 higher when ramming, Re roll terrain. When they decide to death or glory:1d3 S10 ao4 hits .
How are you able to remove 3 hullpoints from a vehicle with the new rules ? I hope that I am wrong but the way I see it, it just raises your AV to 16 now when you decide to ram the knight making it a single S9 hit.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/07/13 08:29:18
Inactive, user. New profile might pop up in a while
oldzoggy wrote: How are you able to remove 3 hullpoints from a vehicle with the new rules ? I hope that I am wrong but the way I see it, it just raises your AV to 16 now when you decide to ram the knight making it a single S9 hit.
Penetration+result on super heavy roll that causes multiple HP? Should be possible?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/07/13 08:16:08
Tiger9gamer wrote: One of the biggest things that hurt in my opinion is that there is no combat invuln saves for your average warboss. Cybork body was turned from a 5+ invuln to a 6+ FNP save. it's friggen maddening! The orks are supposed to be masters at close combat, and yet they lack one of the biggest things you can have for combat. now, you need a painboy sitting behind in your squad that contains your warboss to provide that crappy 5+ fnp save and pray your warboss doesn't face anything with AP2.
Also, we pretty much have only 3 types of combat weapon. A choppa, a big choppa, and a powerclaw. We are the friggen orks! apparantly we spiffy up the weapons we suck at (guns) so they are shiny and shooty and gak, but when it comes to combat weapons all we can muster are two variations of a dull knife and a power fist? Where are the power weapons? Why cant I give my nobs a power sword or a power axe? surely it doesn't take Orkimedes to take some energy to a choppa? surely some boss saw a Space Marine captain chopping up his boys with a Relic Blade and thought "Oi! Why is his choppa sharper than mine? " but no, all we get are cheap weapons with worse ap of a powermaul, or an expensive boxing glove.
I think it is to represent that the IoM tech is more advanced, so they can craft this kind of weapons (swords, axes, etc...) while orks aren't clever enough.
It is sad for the orks that their new codex is such a flop, we can only hope there will be soon a new book like Mont'ka / Kauyon / Fenris with new ork rules.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2016/07/13 12:33:16
It is sad for the orks that their new codex is such a flop, we can only hope there will be soon a new book like Mont'ka / Kauyon / Fenris with new ork rules.
They did just re release waaaagh ghazzkull. That did not really help that much.
I think it is to represent that the IoM tech is more advanced, so they can craft this kind of weapons (swords, axes, etc...) while orks aren't clever enough.
IoM tech is less advanced really. Sure most ork tech is crude and simple, but IoM tech can't even come close to the true potential of ork tech that sometimes breaks trough the chaotic nonsense.
Just look at their weaponized teleportation weapons or their attack moons with grav weapons on a planetary scale. But even if we ignore that the ork armoury is lacking. Sure any orktribe could come up with more weapons then a charp choppy thing, a bigger sharp choppy thing and a unwieldy krunchy klaw. Their whole culture seems to be based around war and the fun of killing stuff in melee sure they would have come up with something more original from time to time.
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Ubl1k wrote: Everyone talking about all the Nerfs ive very rarely had a non enjoyable game with the orks. Just so fun to build and play.
They are fun, they are enjoyable, but that has more to do with the owners attitude during the game rather then the army. Ork players generally tend to be the most fun to play against because of the complete lack of feths they give about winning, mostly because we as a lot have become rather inured to the fact that GW hates us and we will lose more often then win.
Most other players enjoy playing against orks because it gives them a sense of accomplishment as they remove orks by the fistful each turn.
Just know this, anything that as viable or borderline GOOD in the old ork codex was removed or nerfed. Anything that was flamboyant but rather useless was kept about the same, anything that was a distinct negative was kept as well.
Shokk Attack Guns ARE FETHING AWESOME! but you can't use them in a competitive game because there are so many negative results on the table that your almost guaranteed to roll a bad result and your character either die or most shots just becoming useless.
ZZap Gunz, you have to choose your target before rolling for strength, so all your S2-7 shots plink off the heavy armor vehicles you chose to shoot at with your ANTI-TANK gun.
Bubble Guns........
Smasha Guns
The list of crappy weapons/gear/options/rules for orks is rather long so I will end it there.
Ubl1k wrote: Everyone talking about all the Nerfs ive very rarely had a non enjoyable game with the orks. Just so fun to build and play.
this, anything that as viable or borderline GOOD in the old ork codex was removed or nerfed. Anything that was flamboyant but rather useless was kept about the same, anything that was a distinct negative was kept as well.
Shokk Attack Guns ARE FETHING AWESOME! but you can't use them in a competitive game because there are so many negative results on the table that your almost guaranteed to roll a bad result and your character either die or most shots just becoming useless.
My issue with Shock attack guns ( as with most fun things in the codex) is its point cost. I don't really care for the risk of a bad result. Its paying 85+ points for a BS2 T4 2W 6+sv model that shoots a ~S8 Ap2 large blast heavy weapon that I mind. The mishap table is fun and all but a BS2 large blast on such a flimsy model should just not cost that much.
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2016/07/13 13:23:08
Subject: Re:Is the new ork codex worth the old one ?
And don't forget how Gazkull got nerfed. They ad it out for him as well... No more 5++, no more mega Waaagh, no more +2 Attacks rule.... Just useless now. As IG that's great on the table, but to be honest, that was much more fun against him behaving as a real most powerful ork, that's saying ever dying and wreaking havoc on my poor guys.Ah, how he died only once in 10 games...
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