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Alright fellow Watch Masters time to step up,

Find inside the quintessential guide and discussion for all of your Deathwatch tactics. All are welcomed and encouraged to ask questions and offer their sage advice for others to answer and learn from, together we can become a force to be reckoned with.

This foremost post will be kept up to date occasionally with a record of the strong and weak points of our great army, as well as it's various tips and tricks and its uses as allies. So read on and contribute as you feel appropriate, I just ask that no infighting occurs between watch brothers (and sisters), keep your discussions civil lest you displease your god emperor.

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So to kick us off, killteams or normal squads? What's your choice and why, I think the killteams have an incredible amount of flexibility based on the magnitude of USR they get from the various unit types. That, combined with the specific kill teams rules and the mission tactics I think will make each kill team a small powerhouse that doesn't have to waste strength firing at or attacking suboptimal targets thanks to split fire/heroic intervention.

Do you see them more as an allied detachement or as your core force?

What items are you the most keen for?

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*UPDATE 29/08/2016* (Australian sorry, I know there aren't 29 months for you yanks)

Army Wide Strengths:
Deathwatch Frag Cannon
Special Issue Ammunition
High Damage Capability
Lots of rerolls
The ability to be built to deal with specific threats
Deathwatch Frag Cannon
Huge customisability in loadout, to further deal with specific threats
Ability to field an immense # of psykers
A very easy to form Decurion
A new flyer in the Corvus Blackstar
Deathwatch Frag Cannon....and another few exciting wargear options

Army Wide Weaknesses:
Very low model count
You're still space marines, so you die....a lot
Lack of much armour beyond landraiders and dreadnaughts
Some rather confusing gear options that can cause questions
No bolt pistol on basic troops, so CCW/powerswords are sub-optimal
Annoying modelling options given that powerswords are sub-optimal

Specific Tricks and Tactics:

Angelis Drop: Take the Angelis beacon relic, allowing you to pick a DW unit that is already on the board and deepstrike it to your location. So build your favourite alpha strike unit or your mellee powerhouse, sprinkle it with a transport of your choice for added survivability and firepower (land raider redeemer for example), put your unit inside. Then drop pod a few units in first turn, one holding the beacon then bring a landraider + deathstar + 1 to 2 units into the enemy deployment zone turn 1.

*Note the beacon drop does work with a corvus, which seems amazing with its payload of missles, twin linked assault cannons, hurricane bolters, bomb type thing and rerollable jinks. However note you will need the Corvus to start on the table, meaning you need a skyshield landing pad.

A Note on Droppods:With the FAQ drafts from GW and their rulings on droppods you CAN shoot through them if you can see through them also the doors, when down, count towards the model itself. You may disembark the full 6" from the tip of a fully open Drop pod door. It also counts as part of the model for the purposes of enemy models trying to move around it, they cannot move on the ramps and must move around.

Deathwatch are probably best used as a shooting alpha strike army, so use these rules (if you are using the drafts) to your advantage, drop down and use the pod and some terrain to block access to your shooty death unit. Armour 12 all round will cause problems for those damn ork or nid or daemon swarms and will buy you at least 1 turn from larger creatures.

Breachers: Veterens are your troops. They come with a Boltgun and a CCW, so theres no point keeping the CCW as you don't get +1 attacks for 2 weapons. What you can do, if you wish to increase your survivability and want awesome models, is swap that useless CCW with a storm shield for +10 points per model. Special issues ammunition bolters with storm shield. 10 of them. Beautiful.

MSU Vanguard Vets: If you want to be annoying, a strategy that has been proposed is 1 or 2 Vanguard Vets, armed with dual flamer pistols or infernus pistols. Just jump them around the board, cap objectives, flame light troops off objectives or nuke vehicles. If your enemy wants to kill them fine, focus a whole unit on 1-2 guys and leave my heavy weapon squads alone....that'll work real well for you.

Allies:

Alright listen. Deathwatch is a super cool army, fun to play, incredible to model and have the posibility to be fairly strong (in my humble opinion, you just have to play them very well)...BUT...they're probably better as allies to IoM armies.

Deathwatch as Allies: Killteams are amazing. Ignore all the people saying "why would you take this it has x" everything has its purpose and they're just not reading. Find what your army is lacking; do you lack anti armour? anti 2+ anti horde? Pick and build one of the killteams that offers the rerolls against the most likely unit type, chuck them in a drop pod, and then drop down and nuke that annoying elements off the board with those glorious rerolls of all wounds.

Allies for Deathwatch: Imperial Guard.

Okay now seriously Space Marines are best used to bring in armour if you want it I guess? Some sort of centurions? I'm not a space marine guru and this hasn't really been covered yet, I'm spitballing here.

Imperial guard bring in mass troops, giving you bodies you seriously need and rerollable armour/invuln saves on those beautiful breacher squads from your priests. Can also be used to bring in armoured support if you want, wyverns are always beastly.

Inquisition is fluffly as all getout, inquisitors with rad/psychotrope grenades and crusaders etc

Sisters with mass flamers and meltas, allowing your DW to focus on MC and 2+ hunting?

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Alright guys I'm done here for this update, I'll comb back through and make sure I haven't missed anything. Hope this little collection on the front page helps any newcomers. Read through for more specifics.

Cheers all,

Qwerty2jam

I always build lists from a fluff direction first. So for me, they will always be an allied force and I hope the formations reflect that. I was actually surprised this is being treated as a full codex instead of a supplement or mini Inquisition-style codex.
In fact I might have been content with running the HQ/unique squad from the Overkill box codex for a while. But I didn't like the schizophrenic wargear loadout forced on you in those datasheets, so I am very interested in what this release has to offer.

I'll repost here what I posted in the rumour thread:

Sadly, I don't think most of the options will be usable. I foresee two veteran squad loadouts that will be be spammed. 1) Snipers with backup bolters accompanied by a librarian with the shielding relic. 2) The frag cannon spam with some extra bodies with bolters. Backup shotguns for everyone for massive wall of death, except maybe some meltas instead shotguns for few guys. Possibly couple of storm shields at the first rank. Add a librarian or single vanguard (can be one of the shield guys) to make it aquila-compliant.

I just don't see the melee stuff being viable, the weapons are just overpriced.

I hope I'm wrong!


Now, that being said, I'd love to see some viable melee builds and have been thinking about the subject a bit. CC weapons are silly expensive on veterans, so it is best to make a combined squad of vanguards and veterans. Veterans can take heavy thunder hammers (and pay same price for them as the vanguard) and they can take flamers which might be handy (and cheap!) They can also have a sergeant and a black shield (more about him later), both of which you obviously want in a melee squad. Vanguard can have discount priced melee weapons, so it is best to lead up with them. Lightning claws might be the best option. Again, it is good to have some storm shields, maybe even termies with shields and hammers.

Black shield is interesting, but equipping him is difficult. His double attacks activate when outnumbered, or when fighting MCs, ICs or Vehicles. Now, unless you're fighting orcs or some other horde type of enemy, you definitely want to give him a power fist (or a thunder hammer), otherwise his extra attacks will be pretty much wasted against vehicles and MCs. And if you want him to find characters he needs a storm shield or he will be instantly squished. But now we are looking at over 70 points for a single wound character... which is crazy. For reasonably priced infantry murdering goodness single lightning claw will suffice.

As for xenophase sword, I don't think it's worth it. Lighting claw will be cheaper and more effective most of the time. (Why have lightning claws to be so good? They look stupid on PA marines!)

And then there's the problem of getting them into combat. You can of course pod them, or teleport them via detachment tactic ot the teleport relic, but that means one turn eating plasma. Land raider and Corvus are the available assault vehicles. Now, usually assault flyers are a bit dodgy, as they get killed instantly once the start to hover, but with its jink re-rolls Corvus is actually pretty durable, and it is cheaper (and faster!) than LR anyway so it might be the way to go.

 Crimson wrote:
I'll repost here what I posted in the rumour thread:

Sadly, I don't think most of the options will be usable. I foresee two veteran squad loadouts that will be be spammed. 1) Snipers with backup bolters accompanied by a librarian with the shielding relic. 2) The frag cannon spam with some extra bodies with bolters. Backup shotguns for everyone for massive wall of death, except maybe some meltas instead shotguns for few guys. Possibly couple of storm shields at the first rank. Add a librarian or single vanguard (can be one of the shield guys) to make it aquila-compliant.

I just don't see the melee stuff being viable, the weapons are just overpriced.

I hope I'm wrong!


Now, that being said, I'd love to see some viable melee builds and have been thinking about the subject a bit. CC weapons are silly expensive on veterans, so it is best to make a combined squad of vanguards and veterans. Veterans can take heavy thunder hammers (and pay same price for them as the vanguard) and they can take flamers which might be handy (and cheap!) They can also have a sergeant and a black shield (more about him later), both of which you obviously want in a melee squad. Vanguard can have discount priced melee weapons, so it is best to lead up with them. Lightning claws might be the best option. Again, it is good to have some storm shields, maybe even termies with shields and hammers.

Black shield is interesting, but equipping him is difficult. His double attacks activate when outnumbered, or when fighting MCs, ICs or Vehicles. Now, unless you're fighting orcs or some other horde type of enemy, you definitely want to give him a power fist (or a thunder hammer), otherwise his extra attacks will be pretty much wasted against vehicles and MCs. And if you want him to find characters he needs a storm shield or he will be instantly squished. But now we are looking at over 70 points for a single wound character... which is crazy. For reasonably priced infantry murdering goodness single lightning claw will suffice.

As for xenophase sword, I don't think it's worth it. Lighting claw will be cheaper and more effective most of the time. (Why have lightning claws to be so good? They look stupid on PA marines!)

And then there's the problem of getting them into combat. You can of course pod them, or teleport them via detachment tactic ot the teleport relic, but that means one turn eating plasma. Land raider and Corvus are the available assault vehicles. Now, usually assault flyers are a bit dodgy, as they get killed instantly once the start to hover, but with its jink re-rolls Corvus is actually pretty durable, and it is cheaper (and faster!) than LR anyway so it might be the way to go.

Yeah not very impressed with the codex in terms of efficient CC options.

The frag cannon spam will be pretty popular, but the issue is getting them close enough to use it before getting shred into pieces. If you load them up into a drop pod, they'll just end up being a one shot wonder or worse scatter out of range of the intended target. At least Eldar D-scythes don't have to worry about scattering with a web way portal. Another option is load them up in that flyer, but now you have to wait until at least turn 2 or mostly 3 to even do anything with that expensive unit. And the kill teams are too expensive to run efficiently as MSUs and no obsec.

What are people thinking about the Stalker Bolters? They seem good for sniper weapons.

If I am reading things right, does it say that you can basically build terminator devastator squads?!?!

I think the option of deepstriking 5 assault cannons or having 5 cyclone missile launchers wander up from the board edge is going to be very popular!

Well I think due to the cost of the melee options that if you want to go for that you need to go all in. The squad is still a 1 wound marine squad, regardless of shields etc so they need to hit hard and fast making assault vehicles a necessity.

If I were to do it, I would take 2 melee focused units in 2 Corvus blackstars in a flyer wing from death from the skies. +1 to reserves and attack bonus make it more reliable to me.

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Renesco yes you can, certainly one of the stronger options is to build some of the kill teams with a single bike, 5 veterans, 3-4 terminators. Build it in the decurion to give it deep strike then you get to drop down with 7-8 heavy weapons of choice, 1 special weapon and 1 TL Bolter, all with splitfire.

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PM, personally I've never been a huge sniper fan. As far as snipers go yes they are amazing with special issue ammo and heavy 2, certainly 20 shots, or 10 from a killteam, all with 2+ to wound or so 3 at 30" should be pretty effective. However to me not being able to move is such a crippling effect for me. Maybe it's just may play style but I can't stand stationary elements (pun totally intended).

I don't think the CC options are bad, it's certainly not a CC army, but there is room for CC elements.

I'm thinking an aquila kill team, 2 HTH (1 blackshield) 1 melta bomb, and 2 chainfist termies.

Comes in at 280 points, and can reliable take on a LoW with blackstar support, which is nice given the lack of Anti LoW mission tactics or formations.

Fly in T2, and get right up on top of them, T3, hover disembark, Concuss the target with stormstrikes, and watch the squad clean up. If they get a lucky stomp , you lose no less points than them.

They are definitely a shooting army. No good way to get into melee outside of expensive transports. And oddly no real alpha strike bonus rules. They need to recruit more Ravenguard for Turn 1 reserves.

The Frag Cannon is the go to heavy weapon, it can fight anything. The infernus isn't worth it due to the Frag Cannon.

Frag cannons look awesome, but its so expensive to kit out a squad with them. Anyone thinking there's some viability in running less than 4 frag cannons and/or running max combi weapons to keep the special ammo around and then have a shotgun as back-up?

Anyone else planning on running more than one Corvus? At this point I'm not even bothered if its competitive because it looks so freaking cool. That said, AV12/12/11 with ceramite and re-roll jinks seems like a pretty solid gunship and transport for moving squads around.

Corvus Blackstar seems like a more efficient Stormraven. Same transport capacity, 1 less AV on the rear, very similar default weapon loadouts, priced similarly and both are Assault Transports. Blackstar can get Strafing Run (Auspex Array upgrade) and re-roll jinks (Infernum Halo Launcher) but lose out on Power of the Machine Spirit

The Blackstar can also be taken as a DT for Veteran Teams, which means you can take one for a Kill Team formation. And being a DT means you could Outflank it if you happened to get Infiltrate (via Warlord Trait) on the Veteran squad - some tasty side/rear armour shots with the Assault Cannon/Stormstrike Missiles coming in from outflank would be cool.

I'm building a squad purely as an ally you my inquisition, looking at two frag cannons, combi srg and two shotguns as the base with another couple built up with close combat options, hammer blackmailed and claw/shield perhaps. Fill out with a hflamer/melta term and a libby.
I intend to drop it in a pod as a surgical strike tool, expensive but deadly to most things

 SonsofVulkan wrote:


The frag cannon spam will be pretty popular, but the issue is getting them close enough to use it before getting shred into pieces. If you load them up into a drop pod, they'll just end up being a one shot wonder or worse scatter out of range of the intended target.

This is kind of a problem with skyhammer grav spam as well, and nobody seems to consider skyhammer underpowered. Granted DW is more points for fewer shots, shorter range and weaker special rules but you do have the benefit of being just as effective if you end up fighting a lot of vehicles or light infantry. Inquisitors and loads of skulls would be mandatory for this build though. Beacon Angelis might work if you can drop your first squad in the right place, since GW neglected to require that the bearer start the turn on the board in order to use the no-scatter rule. At any rate I'm not too worried about pods scattering out of range since you can only scatter 12" and you get to disembark within 6" of the pod, and then you have to account for the size of the pod's base.

With aquila teams in drop pods you're forced to use either a term or librarian to lead, but if you're really lucky one of your libs might roll Invis and your squad will be good for more than one turn.

the 4-frag cannon drop squad seems kind of boring but it's the only thing that makes me want to take some of these guys as allies. Poison stalker snipers sound fun but getting them into the right position to shoot seems like a hassle.

Real News wrote:

 SonsofVulkan wrote:


The frag cannon spam will be pretty popular, but the issue is getting them close enough to use it before getting shred into pieces. If you load them up into a drop pod, they'll just end up being a one shot wonder or worse scatter out of range of the intended target.

This is kind of a problem with skyhammer grav spam as well, and nobody seems to consider skyhammer underpowered. Granted DW is more points for fewer shots, shorter range and weaker special rules but you do have the benefit of being just as effective if you end up fighting a lot of vehicles or light infantry. Inquisitors and loads of skulls would be mandatory for this build though. Beacon Angelis might work if you can drop your first squad in the right place, since GW neglected to require that the bearer start the turn on the board in order to use the no-scatter rule. At any rate I'm not too worried about pods scattering out of range since you can only scatter 12" and you get to disembark within 6" of the pod, and then you have to account for the size of the pod's base.

With aquila teams in drop pods you're forced to use either a term or librarian to lead, but if you're really lucky one of your libs might roll Invis and your squad will be good for more than one turn.

the 4-frag cannon drop squad seems kind of boring but it's the only thing that makes me want to take some of these guys as allies. Poison stalker snipers sound fun but getting them into the right position to shoot seems like a hassle.

Skyhammer is more flexible as you can choose to come in turn 1 or 2. Chances of wasting a unit of frag vets during a turn is higher than sky hammer.

I am having a hard time deciding between the decurion or just a CAD.

I feel like the detachment would work but you would need some allied objective secured.

Get 4-5 kill teams at around 200-250 points each, couple characters, and then 400-500 points in allies - Thinking White Scars Scouts in land speeder storms. Would also work because you could use them as inquisitorial storm trooper types(or just use Tempestus but not as good)

I have always wanted to add an allied unit of Sternguard to my Dark Angels army and was going to paint them as Deathwatch. I was going to keep them simple and mainly be a shooting unit in a drop pod.

Is there a reason to actually take the DW veteran units over a normal SM sternguard suad?

 GoonBandito wrote:
Corvus Blackstar seems like a more efficient Stormraven. Same transport capacity, 1 less AV on the rear, very similar default weapon loadouts, priced similarly and both are Assault Transports. Blackstar can get Strafing Run (Auspex Array upgrade) and re-roll jinks (Infernum Halo Launcher) but lose out on Power of the Machine Spirit

The Blackstar can also be taken as a DT for Veteran Teams, which means you can take one for a Kill Team formation. And being a DT means you could Outflank it if you happened to get Infiltrate (via Warlord Trait) on the Veteran squad - some tasty side/rear armour shots with the Assault Cannon/Stormstrike Missiles coming in from outflank would be cool.

The Corvus blackstar does not have any special rules to disembark while flying, the stormraven does. Having to go into hover to disembark slows this down as a troop carrier.

Soss wrote:
I have always wanted to add an allied unit of Sternguard to my Dark Angels army and was going to paint them as Deathwatch. I was going to keep them simple and mainly be a shooting unit in a drop pod.

Is there a reason to actually take the DW veteran units over a normal SM sternguard suad?

You can take a Libby, 5 Sternguard, and a unit of Scouts as an Allied Detachment, or you can take a Aquila Killteam consisting of 5 Deathwatch Veterans and a Librarian and get to re-roll 1s To Wound and Artmor Penetration with them.

So I, like I'm sure a lot of people are, am looking at my shiny new Venerable Dreadnought wondering "what am I going to do with you".

Normally a venerable dread is a model I wouldn't even consider, an ironclad is the only model that looks remotely usable with that s6 immunity from the av13.

However the deathwatch codex is rather limited in its non infantry units, can a ven dread be in anyway useful? perhaps a long range fire support or a suicide pod to draw fire from the 1w 3+ guys?

Kaliban101 wrote:
So I, like I'm sure a lot of people are, am looking at my shiny new Venerable Dreadnought wondering "what am I going to do with you".

Normally a venerable dread is a model I wouldn't even consider, an ironclad is the only model that looks remotely usable with that s6 immunity from the av13.

However the deathwatch codex is rather limited in its non infantry units, can a ven dread be in anyway useful? perhaps a long range fire support or a suicide pod to draw fire from the 1w 3+ guys?

FW teased that you can use contemptors in DW so I am waiting to see if they FAQ the contemptor as well as the Terminator Captain armor.

Rihgu wrote:

Soss wrote:
I have always wanted to add an allied unit of Sternguard to my Dark Angels army and was going to paint them as Deathwatch. I was going to keep them simple and mainly be a shooting unit in a drop pod.

Is there a reason to actually take the DW veteran units over a normal SM sternguard suad?

You can take a Libby, 5 Sternguard, and a unit of Scouts as an Allied Detachment, or you can take a Aquila Killteam consisting of 5 Deathwatch Veterans and a Librarian and get to re-roll 1s To Wound and Artmor Penetration with them.

More than that, you can take something like an Aquila Kill Team as your primary detachment so that you only have to take one troops choice from the other larger facction you wish to use.

And KT's are very handy for alpha striking. Turn up via drop pod on turn one with 4 Frag Cannons, a meltagun, re-rolls up the arse and a Librarian for psyspam.

I've been actually kind of impressed at basic Sternguard weaponry, in casual games, the special issue ammo is surprisingly good. DW has that all day and you get what, five bolters? The shotguns and frag cannon are excellent, and I actually like the Infernus too. What are people doing with the Stalker? I could see a squad of five armed with it, but it's silly that there's only one in the kit.

Clearly there are a wealth of options. Here's a question, let's assume most people building this army have a box of Overkill and a box of Death Masque. What's decent to make with just those models? I'd like to maybe run twenty or twenty five models altogether and am scratching my head about what to do, there just are so many options.

Okay guys and gals and attack helicopters here's an idea,

A small point before we begin is that this relies on a Land Raider, with a unit embarked inside and not taken as a dedicated transport , still counts as 'a unit'.

The Deathwatch get a relic called 'The Beacon Angelis' which, if the bearer is on the table, allows them to pick another Deathwatch unit on the table and deepstrike them within 6" of the beacons bearer. A few points to note;

1. It doesn't say that the bearer has to be on the board at the start of your turn, allowing you to bring that model down from reserve and then use the ability
2. This ability takes place in your movement phase
3. Bikers can take teleport homers to remove scatter

So the idea works as such;

1. Will only really work in a CAD or in the decurion.
2. A killteam or squad, assembled as you like with a drop pod to gain drop pod assault, maybe 3 to get 2 down first turn.
3. Your nice beefy deathstar squad of your best tomfoolery in a Land Raider of choice (or any vehicle or not at all really, just using a LR for added survivabilty, firepower and mind games)
4. Drop Pod assault your beacon squad in, if you're running a bike in it for the homer you have the issue of only 7 other guys. I would likey use stalker bolters and drop them midfield next to terrain to get them in to place.
5. Activate the beacon and leapfrog the landraider and super squad forward 6 inches, probably into your enemies frontline/backfield and cause havoc.

Survivability of the super squad is the main issue, my thoughts are a land raider/transport, 4 librarians (max for a killteam right?) fishing for invis, stormshields with a guard ally for a minisortum priest (reroll saves).

This could be a fancy little trick? It's expensive as hell and would only really work in a full DW army or as an expensive ally in a large game but could be fun and/or effective. My super unit idea is honestly 4 frag cannons, 4 libs and an assault cannon termie/HQ with the big book of camping (4++ if you stay still, which in the enemies backline ain't so bad)

_______________________

Kaliban101 I might also reccomend the above idea for early/lower point games as a use for your dreadnaught, droppod/DS 2 squads in, leapfrog your dreadnaught forward as additional damage/distraction carnifex. Solves one of the worst problems which is movement.

_______________________

As to close combat with these guys I certainly think they have some good options but as with most combat in this game that isn't some unholy deathstar/superfriends you have to ask the question....why would you? I see these guys having a ton of potential as an extremely flexible shooting alpha strike army. We will just have to see I guess.

Ooof. A pinpoint deep striking Dreadnaught is actually pretty scary to a lot of things. Parking lots, Thunderfire Cannons, anything without reliable anti-tank really. Maybe there's a use for that Venerable after all.

aushlo wrote:
I've been actually kind of impressed at basic Sternguard weaponry, in casual games, the special issue ammo is surprisingly good. DW has that all day and you get what, five bolters? The shotguns and frag cannon are excellent, and I actually like the Infernus too. What are people doing with the Stalker? I could see a squad of five armed with it, but it's silly that there's only one in the kit.

Clearly there are a wealth of options. Here's a question, let's assume most people building this army have a box of Overkill and a box of Death Masque. What's decent to make with just those models? I'd like to maybe run twenty or twenty five models altogether and am scratching my head about what to do, there just are so many options.

My plan with that is to CAD initially, though that's partly because I just don't like formations. Leaving out the VenDread as I want that for my Crimson Fists, this is the plan:

Watch Captain (or Artemis, pending points and options)
Librarian or Chaplain

Deathwatch Kill Team featuring the SW, IH (combi-melta) and DA (power sword, Plasma pistol, as sergeant) from Overkill, plus two more Bolter or Combi Deathwatch. The 'tactical' squad in this setup.

Deathwatch Kill Team featuring the Ultramarine and Imperial Fist (Frag Cannon) from Overkill plus one Frag Cannon, one Infernus Heavy Bolter and one Heavy Bolter (from the bits box, otherwise you'll need to settle for soemthing like a Stalker or Shotgun). These guys fill the 'Devastator' role.

Vanguard Veterans with the BA and Raven (2xLC) from Overkill, plus 3 more Vanguard, I'm tempted to keep them light but I might throw on a Storm Shield or Thunder Hammer. These guys fill the 'Assault' role.

All that comes to around 700-750 points, I think, so should make a nice force to go half-and-half with another (in my case that'll be SM or AdMech), or stand alone in smaller games.

aushlo wrote:
I've been actually kind of impressed at basic Sternguard weaponry, in casual games, the special issue ammo is surprisingly good. DW has that all day and you get what, five bolters? The shotguns and frag cannon are excellent, and I actually like the Infernus too. What are people doing with the Stalker? I could see a squad of five armed with it, but it's silly that there's only one in the kit.

Clearly there are a wealth of options. Here's a question, let's assume most people building this army have a box of Overkill and a box of Death Masque. What's decent to make with just those models? I'd like to maybe run twenty or twenty five models altogether and am scratching my head about what to do, there just are so many options.

For some reason, GW seems determined to make all DW units have no focus whatsoever - all pictures of them show each model having wildly different weapons than their squadmates. It's like they think that nobody wants a DW squad to have some sort of use for the cost.

With the addition of a drop pod and two terminators and a spare meltagun, I get this:



Largely because the DM box forces all boltgun marines to use power swords, too. Which makes no damn sense.

As for my team's tactics, they are designed to DP next to vehicles or assault-vulnerable expensive units and kill stuff dead on T1+2. Sergeant takes challenges and hopes to negate some Ap3 with his SS. Libby does magical stuff on Biomancy. HTH Blackshield and the Chainfist termie do tank-murdering.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

aushlo wrote:
anything without reliable anti-tank really.

So, CSM, IG, some Ork builds...

The usual.

Selyn at the risk of telling you what you already know, all your vets can take both a boltgun and a shotgun for free, at the same time if you give up your ccw.

I find that generally in my meta there might be the odd bit of anti tank scattered around but unless I'm playing my eldar friend, they're going to have to dedicate a couple of squads to it, which is FINE for a big distraction carnifex, some major mind games there.

Also yeah, if you want optimal loadouts you might have to go bitz shopping for a while because you do NOT get the bits to do it.

The sprues do not allow that.

Also, I vaguely recall reading a FB post where the design team disallowed that.

Yeah, again if you ever want to model them for peak combat ability it's gonna take some time and bits.

The problem with that is they never really addressed the issue. The person replying didn't understand if you read it and didn't actually disallow it. Eventually they said they would pass it on to the rules team for a verdict, I haven't heard anything since then.

The kitchen sink motif on those pictured squads really is funny. The Dreadnaught will definitely need to pick its targets carefully. Why do they keep making sprues with all the same option on the same side arms? Maddening.

I'm looking at bits and seeing a pair of combi-meltas, pair of frag, pair of shotguns, infernus and special issue bolters as interesting, I like the tower shields too. The stalker will wait until later when more become available. I find myself wanting Sternguard, not the Vanguard we got. It does seem like having a guy to tank wounds with the shield could be good against things like Ordnance and such. Considering the cost of the models, it might actually be worthwhile. That said, a Terminator might be better for that.

Looking at weapons and kill team roles I'm seeing this:

Terminator w HF. Melta, two models with Combi-melta, two with Heavy Thunder Hammers or Shield and normal TH maybe, arrive by Deep strike as a Malleus kill team. Good place to put a Black Shield.

Two Frag, two Shotguns, and probably the Infernus bolter, plus Bikers, as a Venator kill team or perhaps Furor. No jink for you, bike face. Or die, horde.

Two Vanguard Vets with Claws or TH/SS, Black Shield with TH/SS or Heavy Hammer, Sergeant with Xenophase Blade, twin Claw or TH/SS terminator and maybe some variety of Gunslinger (two Melta Pistols?) as a Purgatus, or drop the Terminator and go Dominatus. Not sure on other Vet loadout here.

Obviously, turning any or all of these into a Strategium option could be good too.

Should you use the Black Spear detachment, DReadnaught is the cheapest tax unit although the Blackstar is probably much better almost always.