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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/07 08:21:00
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot
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Hey there, I calculated this as an add-on to my 3k goblin horde..
ALLEGIANCE IRONJAWS
Gordrakk, the Fist of Gork 700 {general, leader, behemoth}
Orruk Brutes (10, command, two brutechoppas) 360 {battleline}
Orruk Gore-Gruntas (3, pig-ironchoppas) 180 {battleline}
Ardfist 40 {warscroll battalion}
Orruk Warchanter 80 {leader}
Orruk Ardboys (10, command, choppa and smasha) 180 {battleline}
Orruk Ardboys (10, command, choppa and smasha) 180 {battleline}
Orruk Ardboys (10, command, choppa and smasha) 180 {battleline}
Total: 1900
with hundred points left...
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Wh40k, necromunda, Mordheim |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/10 10:23:22
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Enginseer with a Wrench
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Ardfist isn't great in matched play I'm afraid. As you're adding additional units to your army, you'll need reinforcement points set aside if you want to bring any of those ardboy units back. Maybe consider Ironfist instead, as it really helps ironjawz with their movement issues and combines with rampaging destroyers for extra speedy-ness!
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/09/10 10:34:05
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/10 14:33:47
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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nudibranch wrote:Ardfist isn't great in matched play I'm afraid. As you're adding additional units to your army, you'll need reinforcement points set aside if you want to bring any of those ardboy units back. Maybe consider Ironfist instead, as it really helps ironjawz with their movement issues and combines with rampaging destroyers for extra speedy-ness!
pretty sure you only need reinforcement costs if you exceed the starting ammount or add a new unit like summon. Since ard fist does not add a new unit or increase the size of the unit it needs no reinforcement cost.
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I need to go to work every day.
Millions of people on welfare depend on me. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/10 14:42:33
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Lieutenant General
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Ardfist adds a new unit, so it does cost Reinforcement Points. Also, in Matched Play you can never increase a unit beyond its starting size even by using Reinforcement Points.
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'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/10 16:53:03
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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There is some room for interpretation, because the 'new' units are replacements. Think of it as returning slain models to a unit, only the unit starts at 0. Certainly I would have no problems with an opponent using the battalion that way. However, the logic of the above posters is also valid, so it's probably best to consult those you play with.
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Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/10 17:05:40
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Beautiful and Deadly Keeper of Secrets
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Considering how it's really, really cheap it does sound like it requires a cost for the new unit.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/10 20:45:33
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Lieutenant General
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NinthMusketeer wrote:There is some room for interpretation, because the 'new' units are replacements. Think of it as returning slain models to a unit, only the unit starts at 0. Certainly I would have no problems with an opponent using the battalion that way. However, the logic of the above posters is also valid, so it's probably best to consult those you play with.
Its a replacement unit, not an existing unit being returned to play at full strength.
... you can replace any units from the battalion that have been wiped out. The replacement unit is identical to the unit that was destroyed...
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'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/11 01:16:05
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Ghaz wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote:There is some room for interpretation, because the 'new' units are replacements. Think of it as returning slain models to a unit, only the unit starts at 0. Certainly I would have no problems with an opponent using the battalion that way. However, the logic of the above posters is also valid, so it's probably best to consult those you play with.
Its a replacement unit, not an existing unit being returned to play at full strength.
... you can replace any units from the battalion that have been wiped out. The replacement unit is identical to the unit that was destroyed...
But this unit can not be brought in unless they kill every member of the squad... So if you leave 1 alive in that formation they can't use it.
So I say replenishing a loss is different then adding a new unit.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/09/11 01:16:30
I need to go to work every day.
Millions of people on welfare depend on me. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/11 01:30:20
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Lieutenant General
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Again, the rules call it a 'replacement unit'. By definition that is a different unit as it is replacing the destroyed unit. It is not repairing, recycling or resetting the original unit. It is replacing it.
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'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/11 01:36:59
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle
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Ghaz wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote:There is some room for interpretation, because the 'new' units are replacements. Think of it as returning slain models to a unit, only the unit starts at 0. Certainly I would have no problems with an opponent using the battalion that way. However, the logic of the above posters is also valid, so it's probably best to consult those you play with.
Its a replacement unit, not an existing unit being returned to play at full strength.
... you can replace any units from the battalion that have been wiped out. The replacement unit is identical to the unit that was destroyed...
I agree that is the stronger logic. I would also let an opponent replace the units simply because the battalion does nothing otherwise, and because I'm not sure where the RAI is. If the sole benefit of the battalion is an extra artifact/deployment shenanigans then why not make it 20 pts? After the shock value of 'the units are endless!' wears off the battalion is actually not that powerful. The new units have to show up at the board edge, and these are slow melee units, plus if the single 6-wound character dies it's all gone. Plus, easy enough to just not kill the last one of a unit to prevent an opponent from replacing it.
But to reiterate, RAW I would have to go with the replacements costing reinforcement points if forced to chose. I just think it isn't incredibly clear cut either.
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Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page
I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.
I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/11 01:40:33
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Lieutenant General
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Agreed. So until such time as it is FAQed its best to clarify it with your opponent or tournament organizer first.
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'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2016/09/11 02:02:36
Subject: [2000] - Destruction - Ironjaws
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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NinthMusketeer wrote: Ghaz wrote: NinthMusketeer wrote:There is some room for interpretation, because the 'new' units are replacements. Think of it as returning slain models to a unit, only the unit starts at 0. Certainly I would have no problems with an opponent using the battalion that way. However, the logic of the above posters is also valid, so it's probably best to consult those you play with.
Its a replacement unit, not an existing unit being returned to play at full strength.
... you can replace any units from the battalion that have been wiped out. The replacement unit is identical to the unit that was destroyed...
I agree that is the stronger logic. I would also let an opponent replace the units simply because the battalion does nothing otherwise, and because I'm not sure where the RAI is. If the sole benefit of the battalion is an extra artifact/deployment shenanigans then why not make it 20 pts? After the shock value of 'the units are endless!' wears off the battalion is actually not that powerful. The new units have to show up at the board edge, and these are slow melee units, plus if the single 6-wound character dies it's all gone. Plus, easy enough to just not kill the last one of a unit to prevent an opponent from replacing it.
But to reiterate, RAW I would have to go with the replacements costing reinforcement points if forced to chose. I just think it isn't incredibly clear cut either.
I usually dont agree with you but on this I do but I will still let everyone know you can replace as you wish no more points.
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I need to go to work every day.
Millions of people on welfare depend on me. |
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