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Riding in astride massive, genetically advanced and power armoured horses or other quadrupeds, Space Marine Rough Riders are the fast response team of Space Marine Chapters. More sure-footed than Jump Pack equipped Marines, they are capable of covering great distances quickly, as well as being tougher than their smaller brethren. The horses are also trained in the arts of war, striking out with hooves and teeth.

...........................................WS...BS...S...T...W...I...A...Ld...Sv...Unit Type..................Unit Composition
Space Marine Rider.........4.......4.....4...5...2...4...2...8.....3+..Cavalry.......................2 Space Marine Riders
Rider Sergeant.................4......4.....4...5....2...4..2....8....3+..Cavalry (Character)..1 Rider Sergeant
Rider Veteran Sergeant..4......4......4...5...2...4...3...9.....3+..Cavalry (Character)

Wargear
Bolt Pistol
Close Combat Weapon
Frag Grenades
Krak Grenades
Space Marine Horse

Special Rules
And They Shall Know No Fear
Chapter Tactics
Combat Squads

Options
May add up to seven additional Space Marine Riders
Any model may take a Power Lance-10 points
The Rider Sergeant may be upgraded to a Veteran Sergeant-10 Points
The Sergeant or Veteran Sergeant may take a Teleport Homer and/or Melta Bombs-5 Points per item

Space Marine Horse
A model with a Space Marine horse gains the Cavalry Type, +1 Wound, +1 Attack, +1 Toughness, and can reroll failed dangerous terrain tests..
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

So, thoughts on this unit? Points costs? Etc.?

This looks like bikes++ to me. I'd recommend an implementation that doesn't make them an existing unit only better.

They lack special ranged weapons, but are a bit more melee focused. In addition, they lack the TL Boltgun of a bike.

Bikes have more ranged power, these guys have more melee power.

But that being said, I'm hearing that I should probably price them more than a bike.

I'm seeing a two-Wound Bike with Move Through Cover that doesn't get to reroll to hit with bolter shots.

...

Dammit, forgot to add that the horse gets to attack. It's supposed to have a single I3, S4, AP- attack. Which is really just icing on the cake.

Well, I like the imagery of Space Marines in Power Armour on Space Marine Horses in Power Armour. What would you do to differentiate them from bikers?

No T bonus, like other riders for a first. Possibly no extra wound, either, depends which unit you base yours from.

The only other riders I can think of are Rough Riders (who SHOULD be T4) and Thunderwolf Cavalry (which are T5). Oh, and Khorne Juggernauts, which come with a Toughness bonus.

Death Riders are T3 but gain an extra wound. And for that matter, they dont get MtC, not sure if the RR do.

Move Through Cover is not something native to Cavalry, just something I thought sure-footed Space Marine Horses would have.

They get an attack instead. I think that's enough

Death Riders are probably the best thematic precedent I'm going to get. Start from T4, 2W, Augmented Mounts (reroll failed Dangerous Terrain tests), and pistol/ccw only. I'd also rethink the 'may take items from the melee weapon list' thing if I were you, buying power weapons at character prices isn't a good idea. Consider some sort of lance or give them power lances at a reduced price?

Extra horse attacks are unnecessary complication and don't make a lot of sense in context; Daemonic mounts and Thunderwolves provide +A or +S/+A to the rider, horses don't. You've already given them two Attacks base, which is more than enough to account for the difference.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JNAProductions wrote:
The only other riders I can think of are Rough Riders (who SHOULD be T4) and Thunderwolf Cavalry (which are T5). Oh, and Khorne Juggernauts, which come with a Toughness bonus.

Juggernauts give a T bonus because some moron decided Bloodletters needed to be T3 in 5th, not because cavalry are supposed to give a T bonus more broadly. Also if you give your Space Marine a horse that's in similar proportion to the Juggernaut and the Bloodletter he'd be the size of a Dreadnaught.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JNAProductions wrote:
Move Through Cover is not something native to Cavalry, just something I thought sure-footed Space Marine Horses would have.

Death Riders do have a rule called Augmented Mounts that lets them reroll Dangerous Terrain tests, run with that instead?

I'd be okay with a Dreadnought sized horse. That sounds awesome.

But anyway, modified them to reroll dangerous terrain tests, not have boltguns, and have Power Lances for 10 points a pop. How many points should they cost base?

Thunderwolf calvary for every marine chapter!

Why something so mundane as horses? Think big!

Salamanders could ride dragons that get a breath weapon attack.

Raven Guard could ride giant crows that make them Jump Infantry.

Ultramarines could ride Brutors - Clydesdale-like horse with six legs.

Iron Hands could be centaurs, having replaced their legs with the lower body of a mechanical horse.

Imperial Fists could ride biochipped Tyranid "raptors" that look like large versions of hormagaunts.

Space Wolves, of course, have Thunderwolf Cavalry.

Back it down to T4 and I'd say about 23-25ppm.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Stormonu wrote:
...Salamanders could ride dragons that get a breath weapon attack...

You laugh, but this one's actually been in my notes for a long time. The theory was to genericize 'Space Marines' and compose a Chapter Traits system that included general forms of unique units.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Back it down to T4 and I'd say about 23-25ppm.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Stormonu wrote:
...Salamanders could ride dragons that get a breath weapon attack...

You laugh, but this one's actually been in my notes for a long time. The theory was to genericize 'Space Marines' and compose a Chapter Traits system that included general forms of unique units.

Whose laughing? Don't you remember the poster art for the movie Wizards?

Personally, I'd much rather see Space Marines on a bunch of sci-fantasy beasts than on bikes. Reverse for Rough Riders.

I think we replaced horses with bikes for a reason.

 mew28 wrote:
I think we replaced horses with bikes for a reason.

Because 40k is well known for its realism and practicality!

The issue with turning all Space Marine Bikers into Riders is that Cavalry are better than Bikes-they have Fleet.

Bikes look cool if you want horses just go play my little pony.

 mew28 wrote:
Bikes look cool if you want horses just go play my little pony.

Why can't both be awesome? Motorcycles are cool. Horses are cool too. I see nothing wrong with having both in 40k.

For this, I'd personally be of the opinion that they could be more like TWC.

Of course, I'm also of the opinion that every Chapter should have very generic used options with very minimal difference in options barring Chapter Tactics (as in, all SM get Centurions and grav, all Chapters get TWC-esque units, all SM get the wide variety of Psychic powers etc etc).